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Working Hours (catering and food uk)

Good luck with that one kcd. I've been there. A smart employer will invent a complaint, and out you go. No need to substantiate the claim. Yes, I have been there and I did take legal advice. I don't think it's right either.
 
Then in all honesty, what could a different govt do..... or what could be a solution? If there is already a law and employers flout it, then the employer can be taken to tribunal. From experience of a previous company, they hated and feared tribunals. In a case like this, I wouldn't want my job back if I had to go to ACAS anyway. But the flip side is that there are many employees who take the proverbial too, usually the worst repeatedly so, which makes it more difficult for the supervisors/managers just to do their job within a big company and it could break a small company.

As with most things, a balance would be desirable with employees being reliable and employers being fair but unfortunately, the pendulum seems to swing each way too far.
 
This ConDem government has regard only for the employers' rights, not those of the (increasingly) poor working man. Employers get protection from Employment Law which makes it easy to sack anyone who is not full time and has not been employed for 2 years.

Breach the Working Time Directive? Sue me.

Trades Union and their members spent decades fighting this shit and having won, employees said what have unions ever done for me? Now they are finding out.

One worker will never win; thousands do. Join the Union. Do it now.
 
My wife has worked in catering/hospitality all her life; hours are shit and unsocial, she loves it!

Just like my job that takes me away from home all the time, up early back late and away 2 days a week...........not easy running your own company.

Want 9-5, get a job with those hours.

The world doesn't owe you an easy living.
 
Have to agree. There is something about pub and hotel work, its great, whilst you are young.

Grab it whilst you can and stick it on your cv, make you own way in the world it all comes good eventually.

In the mean time you will have an enormous amount of hours to do. My feeling is do them now rather than later.
 
kcdionysus said:
Then in all honesty, what could a different govt do..... or what could be a solution?
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Change the law. It's what govts do, after all. An employer can be done for discrimination and that's the only thing they are scared of for the first year of employment. Add unfair dis to that list and see things change.

But the flip side is that there are many employees who take the proverbial too, usually the worst repeatedly so, which makes it more difficult for the supervisors/managers just to do their job within a big company and it could break a small company.
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For sure, and therein lies the balancing act. I've worked in a factory that was run by the unions, it wasn't easy.
 
We had to change our shift pattern at work to comply with the working time regs, minimum 11 hour break between shifts now where before we used to double back off nights 6am finish to start on noons at 2pm in order to get an extra rest day, no longer allowed.
Probably doesn't apply to catering and food industries where zero hours contracts are rife.
 
flatpopely said:
My wife has worked in catering/hospitality all her life; hours are shit and unsocial, she loves it!

Just like my job that takes me away from home all the time, up early back late and away 2 days a week...........not easy running your own company.
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Mine too. I too run a business. Sometimes 2 nights away, sometimes 5. The difference is that I have a legal framework and a contract that means I get my invoices paid. Fail to pay my invoices and my solicitor and I will make you very sorry indeed. I am sure that you are the same. Now remove that framework and my business, like yours, wouldn't last very long. That's where a large number of employees find themselves.

The world doesn't owe you an easy living.
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I don't think that many people expect it to. What they have a right to expect is a fair day's pay for a fair day's work. It's a very modest rate of pay compared to what you and I earn, as well. My problem is that it is the people who get the rawest deal and who are least protected are those who are least equipped to deal constructively with abusive employers. After all, we have already established that anyone who gets on the wrong side of you or me in the world of business is likely to be very sorry. What I want to see is a similar level of understanding for those less resourceful and potentially unpleasant than you and me.
 
stevec67 said:
Change the law. It's what govts do, after all. An employer can be done for discrimination and that's the only thing they are scared of for the first year of employment. Add unfair dis to that list and see things change.
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The law doesn't need changing because employees are protected on most standard work relegated issues within the first 2 years in exactly the same way as they are as regards discrimination. Things like dismissal for making a protected disclosure, employers breaching environmental, health and safety and/or statutory rights as well as others - http://www.morton-fraser.com/knowledge-hub/dismissing-employees-less-two-years-service

The unfair dismissal part of the newer legislation is an employee can't take an employer to a tribunal if the employer decides to dismiss them within 2 years whereas before, it was 1 year...... but it doesn't mean an employer can disregard the usual rules of employment as regards breaks, holiday entitlement, H&S etc.
 
flatpopely said:
My wife has worked in catering/hospitality all her life; hours are shit and unsocial, she loves it!

Just like my job that takes me away from home all the time, up early back late and away 2 days a week...........not easy running your own company.

Want 9-5, get a job with those hours.

The world doesn't owe you an easy living.
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Nobody here has said it does, quite obviously.

What employees are entitled to is decent working conditions and a fair deal from an employer. All employers, all employees.

An employer who can't do this shouldn't be operating a business that employs others.
 
very interesting and grateful comments guys, been away for a bit and ready all the replies over the next few hours, thanks again
 
Martin D said:
very interesting and grateful comments guys, been away for a bit and ready all the replies over the next few hours, thanks again
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I'll be first, should be fun.

Tell him to "man up".

Seems to be the advice from people like minded with yourself. :)
 
Ha Brian, give me a break! "Reading" you got me there

PS he does man up, but you are right he could chuck it tomorrow, but this situation 6 days on the trot, i think is mad, i told him find something else. There is a difference between very hard work and having the piss taken.

I feel for him, he's trying not to quit but what does he face, he said the other day he couldn't remember driving to work, thats not on.

The young today are up against it like no other time.

Cheers all

Martin
 
Martin D said:
Ha Brian, give me a break! "Reading" you got me there

PS he does man up, but you are right he could chuck it tomorrow, but this situation 6 days on the trot, i think is mad, i told him find something else. There is a difference between very hard work and having the piss taken.

I feel for him, he's trying not to quit but what does he face, he said the other day he couldn't remember driving to work, thats not on.

The young today are up against it like no other time.

Cheers all

Martin
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See Martin, that's what thousands of people over many years have been trying hard to ensure doesn't happen. Things should get better for everyone.

In the Uk, what you're observing is the price of supporting the crushing of Unions for what they did in the 70's.

I feel for your lad, I really do.

My 2 are in a similar situation.

I would love to have a word with their managers, but unfortunately it is all down to some jobsworths in an office somewhere counting beans all in the name of share values. Dumping on the employee permeates its way throughout society...and then it happens everywhere because they think it's normal.
 
kcdionysus said:
The workers rights exist so no eroding of their rights but it's questionable as to whether all employers adhere to them.

The basic rules are slightly different for 15-17 year olds than 18 and over but the basics is that there should be a minimum of 11 hours between shifts/work days. If the employer isn't sticking to this, he/she is violating the rules.

Now I can understand bending the rules a bit here and there as hard and inflexible rules just don't work in small businesses with few staff. A decent employer might only do this very occasionally and should recognise that it isn't in the best interests of his/her company to have tired staff dealing with customers as well as the obvious safety implications of knackered staff who perhaps aren't concentrating as well as a rested one and if working in a kitchen environment for example whereby there are hot pans, boiling water, cooking oil etc... it could be dangerous.

I suggest your son speaks to his employer and expresses his concerns. If the employer chooses to ignore the request, you could speak to ACAS but I'd be inclined to look for another job regardless.[/QUOTE]

Precisely. He should just jack. Whilst he just accepts the situation, it will not change, for him or for whomever else they employ.

Chris
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flatpopely said:
My wife has worked in catering/hospitality all her life; hours are shit and unsocial, she loves it!

Just like my job that takes me away from home all the time, up early back late and away 2 days a week...........not easy running your own company.

Want 9-5, get a job with those hours.

The world doesn't owe you an easy living.
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Spot on!

Chris
 
This is a tricky one.

I would tell the employer to 'sling his hook' and go looking for something better.

I could do that.. because although I'm not from the 'monied' classes. I know that family wouldn't let me starve.

OTOH... many people are either totally financially isolated, or are from families who really can't help, certainly long term.

Unscrupulous employers know this. And they prey on it.

Govt let them. Even encourage them.
 
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