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Who's heard the Kii Three speakers?

Discussion in 'audio' started by Bluedroog, Nov 23, 2016.

  1. YNWOAN

    YNWOAN 100% Analogue

    I didn’t personally find the bass ‘one note’ but I agree it started and stopped quickly and that it wasn’t particularly extended (which rather surprised me from the reviews I had read). Perhaps the bass just rolled off steeply rather than lacking extension. I didn’t think them unnaturally ruthless though, or super critical of lesser recordings.

    I recently heard the Dutch&Dutch speakers, though this was at a show rather than my house, and these seemed better integrated in the bass/mid - but, unlike my experience of the Kii’s, they did have a somewhat ‘ruthless’ character higher up (perhaps due to partnering equipment and/or show conditions).
     
  2. SteveH

    SteveH pfm Member

    In my room (pretty big and very high) the unadulterated Kii3s do not lack bass at all, going far lower and cleaner than the Shahinian Obs that they replaced.
    Nevertheless, I am interested in hearing the BXT just because...

    Steve Helliker from Ultimate Stream, who brought the Kiis to Hammersmith last year, will not be doing so this year because the BXT just won't be with him in time for the show. His will be with him for demo early Nov.
    He will, however, be demming the D&D 8c so I thought I'd pop along and hear those.
    I don't think there are any other Kii dealers attending?
     
  3. Purité Audio

    Purité Audio Trade: Purite Audio

    Quite possibly!
    Bass quality is often more to do with the room than the loudspeaker, I find that both the Kiis and the Dutch&Dutch 8Cs interact with the room far less them any other speaker I have tried, you simply hear everything .
    Keith
     
  4. Emlin

    Emlin MQA Hater!

  5. sunbeamgls

    sunbeamgls pfm Member

    Its curious, in this thread, how few people refer to music and emotion in music. I noted in the WHF review that this was their main criticism, although they didn't give it the emphasis that element deserves.
     
  6. KWB1

    KWB1 pfm Member

    Hmmm... seems my observations of the Kiis were correct - superbly clean but oh so needing a subwoofer or two..

    They do look stunning in red mind, partnered with mandatory BXT

    Flame suit on...
     
  7. Strictly Stereo

    Strictly Stereo Trade: Strictly Stereo

    The only negative observation that I can recall you making is that the Kii Three sounded a little bass light. That seems to tally with what you have written here. However, when we measured them in your living room in their flat setting, they were outputting a normal amount of bass. When we boosted the bass with the tone controls and measured them again, they were outputting an excessive amount of bass. The speakers did exactly what they are designed to do. By all means listen to whatever makes you happy, but could you please leave room for the possibility that it is your taste that is off here and not the speakers? What HiFi had no complaints about their low frequency output. Quite the opposite, in fact.
     
  8. John Phillips

    John Phillips pfm Member

    This issue puzzles me. Emotion seems to me to be a property of the art as produced by the artists, and nothing to do with reproduction of the art as performed by audio equipment.

    I have never had any problem enjoying the emotion of great art, for example the 1953 Clemens Krauss Wagner Ring with a cast to die for, or Carlos Kleiber's Beethoven symphonies 5 and 7 from the 1970s, on any audio kit from earbuds/MP3 player upwards. To me that concept called PRaT, for example, seem to seek a non-existent overlap between art and its reproduction which I have never found helpful.
     
  9. AndyU

    AndyU pfm Member

    So what’s the point of hi-fi to you then, let alone going to concerts, if earbuds and mp3 is all you need?
     
    Dozey likes this.
  10. John Phillips

    John Phillips pfm Member

    Good question. Long ago I adopted the motto "sound matters but music matters more." So I do spend enough to satisfy the "sound matters" element.
     
    jamjar784 and Emlin like this.
  11. KWB1

    KWB1 pfm Member

    Hi Lee

    I have already remarked in this particular thread somewhere that my preference for subwoofers were I feel mandatory listening to the Kii’s - that wasn’t down to just wanting to ‘feel' more lower bass but to also improve the headroom and dynamics of the Kii’s at the same time - I don’t listen to ear splitting levels either but remember feeling concerned the Kii’s were reaching its limitations in outright output - again my observations - others will of course may disagree

    Im not trying to diss on the Kii’s but for the money you could get a Pair of Kef Ls50a’s twinned with a pair BKXL400’s for under a third of the cost...
     
  12. S-Man

    S-Man Kinkless Tetrode Admirer

    I agree that the Kiis are not quite right in the bass, however LS50s are not quite right in the upper midrange... IMO a bigger issue.
     
  13. Strictly Stereo

    Strictly Stereo Trade: Strictly Stereo

    I would say you like to play louder than most, but I cannot recall ever hitting the Kii Three's limiters during your demo. The Kef LS50 and twin BK XLS400 set may very well be more your cup of tea. Those twin subs will go way beyond the 6dB bass lift available from the Kii Three. This set would certainly cost a lot less than the Kii Three / Kii Control combination too, but they will not match their quality. For what it is worth, I personally prefer the smarter, prettier and considerably more affordable Dutch & Dutch 8c.
     
  14. KWB1

    KWB1 pfm Member

    How did you demo them? (LS50a’s) they take a fair bit of patience setting them up with the Kef Control App but once you dial these in, they offer a tremendous package for the price - probably not in the same division as the Kii’s but not a million miles away either, and as i said previously, when they are twinned with a couple of very capable Subwoofers, those kefs simply sing

    I didn’t hit the limiter no but i reckon i wasn’t far off the Kii’s limits in terms of sheer output - I reckon they would appreciate some ‘help’ with a subwoofer or 2 and they would really be a package hence the probable introduction of the BXT

    The Dutch 8c look promising with its stereo twin subwoofer outs mind
     
  15. krenzler

    krenzler pfm Member

    The Dutch has more bass output than the Kii does it not? Having more woofer area (and bigger excursion?).
     
  16. Purité Audio

    Purité Audio Trade: Purite Audio

  17. John Phillips

    John Phillips pfm Member

    With more driver area the D&D 8c should indeed have a greater bass SPL capability for the same excursion. I don't know comparable excursion figures for the two loudspeakers.

    The HFN review of the Kii three measured 3.4% distortion at 100 Hz and 90 dB SPL. I believe humans are not too sensitive to bass distortion and I haven't heard the Kii three yet, but the measurement raised my eyebrows a little. However this is, AIUI, a normal laws-of-physics trade-off against compact drivers and enclosure. It will work well, I am sure, for many customers. Especially at usual domestic listening levels rather than studio SPLs.
     
  18. S-Man

    S-Man Kinkless Tetrode Admirer

    Sorry I missed the "a"... by which I assume you mean "Wireless". I owned the passive LS50s for a while and used them very carefully integrated with 2 very good LF extenders.
    The active LS50s are supposedly better (less upper mid emphasis) than the passive ones, and it seems like the designer had a different objective for them.
    The reason I didn't go for the LS50 Wireless is because there is no way to implement proper crossover slopes at LF, at least I couldn't see how to do it.
     
  19. Emlin

    Emlin MQA Hater!

  20. Purité Audio

    Purité Audio Trade: Purite Audio

    Thanks E, looks like controlled directivity has been extended down in terms of frequency and in terms of dB.
    Keith
     

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