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Who's Heard the Dutch & Dutch Speakers

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I guess you didn't delete it quickly enough. A copy of your original post landed in my email inbox. I wish that it hadn't, but it did. I work in this industry so obviously I found your comment a bit offensive. I think you're wrong.

On your other point, I assume that we are talking about all manufacturers generally now rather than Dutch & Dutch specifically. That topic really belongs on a different thread, but I suspect that manufacturers don't share measurement data that they do not have, do not like or think is not relevant to the majority of their customers. The reason for their reluctance to supply parts and service manuals to potentially unqualified and uninsured repairers or DIYers should be obvious. It exposes them to massive risk.

Hello again Strictly Stereo. Don't how how the message system works, I can only speculate that it took a while for updates/corrections to become effective.

My comments were not directed at all manufacturers. Far from it. What was actually written in post 1575 above is: "It relates to refusal by certain manufacturers ........" .

Given how inexpensive test gear is now, I find it hard to believe that, say, a speaker manufacturer does not have frequency response, distortion and directivity data on their own product. Is it worth owning a Hi-Fi widget where the manufacturer does not have data on their own product? My own opinion is not dissimilar to that of the Stereophile reviewer who, when looking for a set of speakers for personal use, wrote:

"I also insist on the availability of horizontal and vertical dispersion data from reviews (including John Atkinson's reports) or from the manufacturer. It is surprising how few manufacturers will provide this data even though any serious loudspeaker company should have it."

(see: https://www.stereophile.com/content/music-round-99-revel-exasound)

AFAIAC, the same goes for electronics, record decks, etc.

As an aside, extensive data on Harman speakers is available here:

https://speakerdata2034.blogspot.com/2019/06/harman-consumer-brands-spinorama-data.html

The reasons given for refusing to release service information do not convince, but I do not wish to get into an argument on this matter. After all, how much risk is there in working on a preamp running on +/- 25 V rails? Worst case, there are ways for manufacturers to get around liability risk - e.g. by insisting on waivers when releasing service info.
 
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Surely that would make the deal pointless due to import duty?!

Import duties in the US are very low. On a SME 20/3A table duties and processing fees were under $100. That may have changed with the current trade war.

Edit: It is as StrictlyStereo States in post 1582. VAT - free export, relatively low taxes and duties at this end.
 
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FYI they just made the stereophile class A rec. components list for speakers (although, I believe 'restricted' LF which honestly doesn't make much sense).
 
That reminds me the latest delivery came with firmware version ‘24’ , which allows you to store previous set-ups, also Martijn has been evaluating direct transfer of REW files.
Keith
 
FYI they just made the stereophile class A rec. components list for speakers (although, I believe 'restricted' LF which honestly doesn't make much sense).

The ‘restricted LF’ comment makes complete sense to me if you consider those speakers that Stereophile consider ‘full range’. I’ve heard both the Kii and D&D a number of times now and both definitely fit within the ‘restricted full range’ description (in an absolute sense). If I had to I would say that the Kii are the more complete package. However, they are also the more mechanical sounding - both are excellent but neither are a magic bullet for all speaker ills.
 
That’s because you are just quoting specs Keith (which is a bit weak because I know you know the difference) because any experienced listener who has actually heard both the Kii and the D&D realises that they aren’t as truly extended in the LF as their specs may imply - what bass they do produce is nicely linear (though the Kii is slightly more so I feel, but countered against a slightly drier mid than the D&D).
 
Mark, I have both, I live with them,have measured them and compared them to traditional loudspeakers they are completely ‘full-range’.
With all due respect you don’t know what you are talking about.
Keith
 
Not sure I’d pay much attention to that list tbh. The full range section has focal kanta no.2. Friend owned them, and I've heard them many times. They’re nothing like full range and don’t go anywhere near 20hz
 
I thought the unspoken rule was to ignore or disparage Stereophile's Recommended Components list if your kit didn't make the cut and to promote the crap out of the list if it did.

Joe
 
That’s because you are just quoting specs Keith (which is a bit weak because I know you know the difference) because any experienced listener who has actually heard both the Kii and the D&D realises that they aren’t as truly extended in the LF as their specs may imply - what bass they do produce is nicely linear (though the Kii is slightly more so I feel, but countered against a slightly drier mid than the D&D).
It’s an odd phenomenon; they measure low but they don’t sound as though they do. Perhaps this is something to with the way different types of speakers propagate sound in the room. Both excellent speakers of their type, but in both cases I would be inclined to underpin them with a sub for convincing bass.
 
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