1. Things you need to know about the new ‘Conversations’ PM system:

    a) DO NOT REPLY TO THE NOTIFICATION EMAIL! I get them, not the intended recipient. I get a lot of them and I do not want them! It is just a notification, log into the site and reply from there.

    b) To delete old conversations use the ‘Leave conversation’ option. This is just delete by another name.
    Dismiss Notice

Verve Acoustic Sounds Series Reissues

Discussion in 'music' started by poco a poco, Sep 1, 2020.

  1. paulfromcamden

    paulfromcamden Baffled

    The UK 1970s 'Atlantic Years' pressings are still cheap - possibly because they have cover art that's rather of it's time...

    I seem to recall Jim @poco a poco compared one of the titles against a good recent reissue and it got the thumbs up.
  2. mikechadwick

    mikechadwick pfm Member

    I've got the Heavyweight Champion Boxset - must have a listen, it's been a while
    Graham H likes this.
  3. Graham H

    Graham H pfm Member

    Me too - overshadowed by all the Impulse stuff. Listened to Africa Brass a few days ago - still wow!
    mikechadwick and gavreid like this.
  4. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    I’ve never really connected with the Atlantic stuff. Seems a lull between his work with Miles and the amazing Impulse stuff that came later. I really need to reinvestigate it at some point, but my instinct is always to reach for an Impulse album.
  5. Theo

    Theo pfm Member

    I understand that: I probably would too. I just have a soft spot for Ole: I might hunt out one of the George Piros cuts from late 60s/early 70s.
  6. poco a poco

    poco a poco I'm Jim

    While pretty much everything is overshadowed the Impulse stuff but there is some great recordings on Atlantic including the great and important Giant Steps of course, but I also rate My Favourite Things, Ole and Coltrane Jazz highly.
  7. poco a poco

    poco a poco I'm Jim

    I think that was My Favourite Things where I have a US 1970’s Atlantic that is pretty good. I think I bought for less than £5. Ole seems to be about £40 for a 70’s Pressing though and most are French so I’m not sure how good that title would be.
  8. paulfromcamden

    paulfromcamden Baffled

    Ah I was thinking of the UK 1970s 'Atlantic Years' series. I'd always assumed it reissued all the Atlantic albums. But it looks like I was completely wrong! On DIscogs all I can find is:

    Vol.1 - Three Little Words (aka Bags & Trane)
    Vol.2 - Giant Steps
    Vol.5 - My Favourite Things

    I wonder what happened to volumes 3 and 4.
  9. hockman

    hockman pfm Member

    I am really taken aback (shocked actually!) by the lack of consideration here for Trane's Atlantic period. To me, it constitutes an important period of evolution in his playing and music and stands up very well to his Impulse albums. And contrary to opinion here, I probably play these more than the Impulse albums. There are so many great Coltrane albums here - Coltrane's Jazz, Giant Steps, Coltrane's Sound and also My Favorite Things (not a favorite but I admit that's my shortcoming ;)). Don't forget also that many of his classic tunes originated from this period - Giant Steps, My Favorite Things, Naima, Like Sonny, Countdown, Body & Soul etc - tunes that served as jumping off points for improvisation later in his career.
    gavreid and paulfromcamden like this.
  10. Graham H

    Graham H pfm Member

    If Coltrane had have quit in 1960 before his Impulse period, he’d still be considered a genius, no doubt. He pushed conventional harmony and chord structure to its limits, Giant Steps being the pinnacle in this respect. But then, in his own words, he was hearing something different, especially in terms of rhythm and time.

    It’s the post 1960 Impulse period that excites me the most. It could probably be argued that opinion on this relies on how individuals approach Coltrane. Mine was from the perspective of avant garde rock and British free jazz in the early to mid 70s, (Henry Cow, Beefheart, AMM, Evan Parker, Peter Brotzmann, Brotherhood of Breath etc...), so something like Interstellar Space, Ascension, Meditations, and all the Village Vanguard albums made perfect sense to me. Not so sure a ‘lack of consideration’ for the earlier period has much to do with my own perspective.
  11. Elephantears

    Elephantears Trunkated Aesthete

    I've got an early 70s German Atlantic 'Giant Steps' which sounds really good - richer, more open and more dynamic than the Rhino. I've not come across much else though. Interesting how the best sounding LP in the Heavyweight set by far is Alternate Takes.
  12. Elephantears

    Elephantears Trunkated Aesthete

    I just heard a 1969/70 copy of 'Coltrane' at Cosmos in Toronto. 'Out of This World' sounded fantastic and the horn was really dynamic. After a discussion with Aki I've started to wonder if the Jasmine copy I bought in the late 80s is in fact a needle drop, but whoever did it had a pretty good early pressing.
  13. Elephantears

    Elephantears Trunkated Aesthete

    If anyone has any links to the history of Coltrane master tapes I'd be very grateful. I'd like to know where the Impulse tapes are and where they have travelled over the years. Whilst the Acoustic Sounds reissues do sound pretty good, they still haven't given me the feeling I'm at the end of my quest for definitive pressings of certain favourites (at least definitive for me). Do we know what tapes they have used?
  14. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Both Atlantic and Impulse are very cagey when it comes to this due to the two fires that wiped-out so many master tapes. Clearly other tapes still exist, e.g. the recent A Love Supreme is IIRC from a very good UK copy master. For me the definitive pressings are US originals or fairly early US reissues. Next best Japanese. Next best much of the high-end audiophile stuff. Some is very hi-fi and warm though, e.g. Speakers Corner. Whole different experience to original US vinyl. The standard ‘70s Japanese pressings tended to keep the bite and dynamic attack, so I tend to rate them higher. A lot of my Impulse Coltrane is mid-70s green label Japanese and I like it a lot.

    PS I’ve said it many times before but I don’t own a single Blue Note, Riverside, Impulse, Atlantic, Columbia or Verve audiophile label reissue I’d not swap for a decent US original. Not one.
  15. poco a poco

    poco a poco I'm Jim

    Well in the case of Giant Steps the Electric Recording Company claim the original mono master-tape exists as they released one of there expensive reissues this year “ Cut in true mono directly from the original dedicated mono master tapes on our 1965 Lyrec all valve cutting system”. 345 copies issued and now sold out. About £600 now on the reseller market. There is NM OG Stereo of Giant Steps on Discogs for around £400.

    Following the MoFi revelations one tends to be even more sceptical about which tape and the ‘full’ transfer process, but ECR seem to be fairly clear about it
    They also released a mono My Favourite Things in 2021.

    So current prices for OG’s or the ECR are a bit academic for most of us.
    I have a First 1961 Mono repress, Red & Plum label with etched 11637-A AT, [anvil-lathe] matrix in the dead wax bought over 30 years ago probably for less than £5?
  16. poco a poco

    poco a poco I'm Jim

    According to Tom Dowd when recording Giant Steps and most Atlantic John Coltrane around this period they were running separate Stereo and Mono Tape machines simultaneously as Van Gelder also did around this time. So there were separate Mono and Stereo Master-tapes. It was not a fold down. Atlantic had an 8 track tape machine commissioned by Dowd in late 1958, but it seems that was mainly being used for pop recordings.

    “When I was doing Coltrane, we were using the eight-position 2-track custom console I’d built,” Dowd recalls, “and I was feeding a stereo and a mono machine simultaneously. When we were doing jazz stuff we had to be able to record it mono, too, because there were still so many mono players out there; in fact, it was still mostly mono. Both the mono and the stereo were Ampexes-the mono would have been a 300, the 2-track machine a 352.”
    gavreid and Graham H like this.
  17. RickyC6

    RickyC6 Infuriate the frog-men

    May as well post this here…the latest “Coltrane” (Impulse) reissue has landed here and it sounds great. Not heard it before so can’t compare to anything…but it really is very nice.
  18. paulfromcamden

    paulfromcamden Baffled

    @poco a poco thanks for posting that quote Jim. It led me to reading the full article which has some interesting detail in how Coltrane approached recording - plus some pleasingly nerdy mic stuff : )
  19. poco a poco

    poco a poco I'm Jim

    Last nights ‘live’ 45rpm Audiophile session with Chad Kassem, Burnie Grundman and Ryan K Smith. Nearly 2.5 hours long so still working my way through it.
    gavreid likes this.
  20. gavreid

    gavreid pfm Member

    "God invented the volume knob for a reason" - love it :)

Share This Page


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice