advertisement


Tory leadership failure Part V: Rishi ‘Infosys’ Sunak

Matt Hancock says he is "enthusiastic" about scrutiny but in the same breath throws a wobbler and refuses to answer any questions about his time in office because he's "a human being"(?!).

Quite possibly. But an awful one.

https://twitter.com/TheNewsAgents/status/1659245652465811475

Good Law Project update here (Good Law Project). Hancock is a criminal and should be in jail for decades. He has stolen £millions from us, as have so many of the crooks in his party.

This is the reason the country is such a wreck. Why nothing works. It isn’t that we don’t pay for services and infrastructure, we do, the problem is this Tory filth just steal what we pay.
 

This Nat-C (bowel) movement is one of the most sinister developments in recent UK politics. It's exactly the sort of thing I was fearing would happen post-Brexit, and the fact that it seems to be going mainstream is terrifying.

Maybe this is a reason to vote Labour, as the thought of the extreme fringes of the Tories taking over the party and running the country is something that really doesn't bear thinking about.

This is how fascism will take hold if the Tories win the next election.
 
Maybe this is a reason to vote Labour
Well, I’ve always said if it’s a straight call between Tory and Labour, then the latter is, if not exactly preferable, the least worst option. Although the article’s conclusion fingers the Lib Dems, I think it applies equally to Starmer’s Labour.

It’s clear by now that he’s an unprincipled scoundrel who will say anything if he thinks it’s what his audience want to hear. As the debate is dragged further and further to the right, Starmer will become even more vile and authoritarian as the GE looms closer.

The counter-argument is, however, that in Germany the rise of Hitler was at least partly enabled by Stalin’s insistence that the German Labour Party were as bad as the Nazis- fatally dividing resistance.

Corbyn was our best shot, as was Podemos in Spain and Syriza in Greece. I can’t say what the answer is, but it’s definitely not Starmer.
 
Well, good luck! I think 2015-19 offered pretty conclusive evidence as to which way Britain's One Nation Conservatives bend, given a choice between mild social democracy and batshit right wing demagoguery. They don't like the latter but they regard the former as completely illegitimate, beneath contempt, an alien threat to their whole way of life.
Not disagreeing at all. One Nation Conservatives like Ken Clarke showed how far they are willing to bend in the Thatcher government. Of course, it’s always a lot easier to bend if you are as spineless as Clarke.

My only point is that One Nation Conservatism contains within it a commitment to closing the wealth gap and under Macmillian also had a tolerance for the post war Keynesianism that brought less inequality, both of which could be appealed to.

Of course ONC is still top down and deeply conflicted because of it. It assumes that largesse is dispensed from the top in a natural order ordained by God and his chosen Agent King. Neoliberalism has largely replaced ONC but only in so far as it has put worship of the Free Market on the same footing as God and made Global Enterprise its King to dispense largesse.

But it doesn’t dispense its generosity all the way down. It pours it in at the top and actually puts return valves in the system to keep it there. As such it cultivates and grows a growing wealth gap. Money created at the bottom goes to the top and bar a few drips, stays there

If One Nation Conservatism has important social values of greater equality, they have been undone by Neoliberalism. The principles of ONC have been betrayed by Thatcher and her followers and it is perhaps those principles that could be reignited.

The problem of course is that Labour has gone full neoliberal itself and has adopted a belief in the natural order as much as Thatcherism, and recent celebrations show how engrained a belief in a feudalistic social order still is for many people, but if there is a way to attack the foundational principles of a natural order there might be some mileage in looking back to the social aspects of The Greater Good philosophy with which One Nation Conservatism needed to compromise during the later Industrial age and which found consensus for a short time after WW2

The growing wealth gap is biggest problem we face today. The GINI coefficient started to rocket upwards in 1979 and has continuously risen exponentially ever since. The growing wealth gap is not just morally wrong in social terms, it is environmental suicide and so economically unsustainable that it will only take us into greater and more frequent economic crises.

To that end, looking at and promoting the social, economic and existential need for closing the wealth gap, wherever it exists, has to be a good thing.
 
Last edited:
Very little IMO. The problem is FPTP. A proportional system would enable voting on conscience, not on whatever the two-headed establishment beast serves up. FWIW I have far more contempt for Labour than even the Tories. I know exactly what Tories are, and they are honest to their elite imperialist colonial slave-owning landed-gentry feudal elite past. Labour should in theory place power with the masses, and they never do as they are in reality just as establishment-centred and authoritarian as the Tories. They are fundamentally anti-democracy. This is why we are where we are. If Labour weren’t shit Tory elite rule would have been ended permanently many, many decades go. It can only survive in a rigged environment.

PR would let the hardcore nutters in though - give them a platform. A risk, no?
 
PR would let the hardcore nutters in though - give them a platform. A risk, no?

Not to my mind. We currently have a FPTP system that handed absolute power to a Tory party now riddled with NF/BNP shit like Lee Anderson, Jonathan Gullis etc. This sort of bigoted racist scum would never get to a position of absolute power under PR. Not a hope in hell. They’d get a few gammons on the back benches, but that is the extent of it and they’d be more than balanced out by a very much increased Green and left vote. Splitting the real fascists and nationalists away from the mainstream Tories would also reduce the Tory vote, so that’s a win too.

I’m pretty sure things would roughly follow national voteshare stats with >60% being basically progressive, <40% right-wing. That is a functional system. It will never be as progressive or radical as some of us would like, but neither would it facilitate the system we have now where a minority Tory elite have gang-raped the country for over 90 of the past 120 years. There are some variables, e.g. those who currently understand they are disenfranchised in safe seats and don’t vote are an unknown number and may or may not balance out evenly. I certainly do not fear democracy, though the current FPTP system terrifies me as it is so clearly leading us to fascism.

If in any doubt about PR ask yourself why the Conservatives, like their Republican equivalents fear real democracy so much? The answer is they understand full well that it will end them. They know they can never obtain power democratically as the majority of people oppose their ideology.
 
Voters get to play Democracy-Monopoly. Land on Mayfair - you're all right, Jack. Land on Old Kent Road and can't afford a house there; it's your own fault; don't collect £200; go to jail. The board is rigged, the dice loaded. Welcome to Toryland.

John

I'm sure many voters would agree with that (populists and comrades), conversely many would not (everyone else).
 
The place is full of hardcore nutters already. It's the Tory party itself that gives a thin veil of decency to them by selecting them as candidates. Voters will often not know what they're getting because they consider themselves to be Tory voters and not Nazis.

There are some, yes, but letting more of them in (more overt extremists, for example) would potentially = a workable majority.

The next election will determine how well NatCon ideology plays with the voters. My guess is not that well.
 
The next election will determine how well NatCon ideology plays with the voters. My guess is not that well.

Mine too. I think this rigtward 'thing' is beginning to dwindle now worldwide having failed to deliver anything for the 'man in the street' and is perhaps why they're now trying to become ever more extreme. I'm expecting Anderson to be shown the door for one...
 
Mine too. I think this rigtward 'thing' is beginning to dwindle now worldwide having failed to deliver anything for the 'man in the street' and is perhaps why they're now trying to become ever more extreme. I'm expecting Anderson to be shown the door for one...

I’m not so sure. Much of the Tory party including many high profile ministers lined-up to speak at the highly dubious dark money-funded far-right National Conservatism conference. It appears they are selling fascism from now until the next election at least. Whether they regroup to something more moderate after that I’ve no idea, but the extent it is dragging Labour rightwards is terrifying. The Overton Window is leaving skid-marks on the road.

In any sane country the Nat-C conference should be viewed as the NF/Trump/Qanon/InfoWars-grade far-right conspiracy theory bullshit and bigotry it is, yet every Tory up to and including the PM endorses it. The Conservative Party Chairman and the Home Secretary were two of the most extreme and unhinged speakers there, no better or worse than batshit crazy extremists like Murray and Starkey.
 
Mine too. I think this rigtward 'thing' is beginning to dwindle now worldwide having failed to deliver anything for the 'man in the street' and is perhaps why they're now trying to become ever more extreme. I'm expecting Anderson to be shown the door for one...
Not so sure. NatCon is not a new phenomenon, it is the logical extension of an ideology to make the rich richer while making the poor poorer that has failed to deliver anything for the ‘man in the street’ in the last 50 years of so. In fact the man in the street has voted for it.

Outside of PFM I’ve heard very little about NatCom, my ‘man in the pub’ (we don’t have streets ‘round here!) hasn’t heard of it. As such I see no sign of any widespread protest at the Tories, and therefore Labour, becoming more extreme.
 
I’m not so sure. Much of the Tory party including many high profile ministers lined-up to speak at the highly dubious dark money-funded far-right National Conservatism conference. It appears they are selling fascism from now until the next election at least. Whether they regroup to something more moderate after that I’ve no idea, but the extent it is dragging Labour rightwards is terrifying. The Overton Window is leaving skid-marks on the road.

In any sane country the Nat-C conference should be viewed as the NF/Trump/Qanon/InfoWars-grade far-right conspiracy theory bullshit and bigotry it is, yet every Tory up to and including the PM endorses it. The Conservative Party Chairman and the Home Secretary were two of the most extreme and unhinged speakers there, no better or worse than batshit crazy extremists like Murray and Starkey.

That's what I'm saying. This turn to the extreme is a response to their position in the polls and to the election defeat.
 


advertisement


Back
Top