The watch thread: pocket, wrist, sporty, showy? You name it!

[-alan-]

Hmm.

From Rolex's own website -

Where are Rolex watches built ? :

"In Les Acacias, the work that is done in terms of production is the final assembly and final quality control. To a large extent, it is to here that the components from Rolex’s other factories come in order to be assembled. The factory consists of groups, and each group in the final assembly facility is totally autonomous. Furthermore, they work under two to three-month rotations. Things done here include things like dial & hands assembly, crystal assembly, and ensuring no dust is inside the watch, and lastly of course, stringent and touch tests to ensure each watch is up to par."

That one must have managed to slip through under one of the rotations of the little known Blind Watchmakers of Les Acacias cadre

 

[Hazelberry]

I've been told by a Dealer that Seiko want to rise there prices to £500 and above and stop dealers giving a discount
Under £500 will be Seiko 5
Plus there going to discontinue the lower priced Grand Seiko range to make way for King Seiko

To justify its higher prices & a desired new image Seiko needs to improve its QC (e.g correcting dials with misaligned & misprinted chapter rings); install more sapphire crystals; improve its notoriously poor customer service; & ditch its pedestrian 21,000 bph movements for adjusted 28,000 bph ones like ETA's & Sellita's. Until then it can't compete with the Swiss or even some Chinese & microbrand watches, certainly in its midrange models. This century, even when Seiko prices were lower, it couldn't compete with Citizen in any of the aforementioned areas.

All in all it I feel that Seiko is on the decline. It's come to rely too heavily on its past with cynically expensive reissues & limited editions. The (awful, IMO) SRP "Turtles" are cheapened by a myriad of colour variations that started with the 2nd generation Monsters. Its masterful "grammar of design" principle appears to have been consigned to history. I last bought a Seiko a decade ago & see no more purchases on the horizon. It's a pity as on the whole I prefer the best Seiko designs to most Swiss ones.

 

[hockman]

Unfortunately, as a vintage Seiko fan, I have to agree with this assessment. Their pricing has gone up substantially while their QC has gone down without any seeming improvement in recent years. Ask any seasoned Seiko watch tech or dealer and they will tell you that the quality and reliability of Seiko movements have declined over the last 2 decades. Their endless special and limited editions and reissues at very elevated price levels is symptomatic of a company that has lost its direction.

 

[tones]

The Watchfinder video on the double-nine Rolex:

 

[paulfromcamden]

^ fantastic that neither the dealer or customer initially noticed. Reminds me a bit of the Invisible Gorilla.

 

[tones]

^ fantastic that neither the dealer or customer initially noticed. Reminds me a bit of the Invisible Gorilla.

I know from my relatively humble experience of writing patent specifications that, if you've been through multiple drafts, as is usually the case, you start to see what ought to be there, as opposed to what actually is there. You really do need a third-party to read it and ask, "What exactly were you drinking and/or smoking when you wrote this?"

In this case, the 9 and the 3 are basically the same shape, so once the initial error had been made, everyone else just read what should have been there.

 

[JensenHealey]

It's a bit like my old uni final year project report. Hand typed by me on a hired typewriter. Took ages. No more than 1 tippex error allowed (my rule) or it was re-typed. I re-read it multiple times to correct errors. Some others also proof read it for me. Several years later I found my copy at home and found spelling mistakes!

As said, your eyes often see what they want to see, your ears hear what you want to hear. Stage Magicians and Illusionists make strong use of this phenomenon.

 

[julesd68]

Unfortunately, as a vintage Seiko fan, I have to agree with this assessment. Their pricing has gone up substantially while their QC has gone down without any seeming improvement in recent years. Ask any seasoned Seiko watch tech or dealer and they will tell you that the quality and reliability of Seiko movements have declined over the last 2 decades. Their endless special and limited editions and reissues at very elevated price levels is symptomatic of a company that has lost its direction.

What do you think of the 6R35 movement? I like the look of the '63 MAS' which uses it - great power reserve but stated accuracy figures aren't great for a watch around 1k.

 

[stevec67]

What do you think of the 6R35 movement? I like the look of the '63 MAS' which uses it - great power reserve but stated accuracy figures aren't great for a watch around 1k.

I have it in my Alpinist, which I wear "for best". It's great, keeps good time, easy to set and doesn't take half the night to change the date over. The cheaper movements take for ever to change the date, they start changing about 1130 pm and don't complete the job till about 3 in the morning.

 

[JensenHealey]

My 6R35 green Alpinist is great too - although it does lose a bit of time and I would love to get it calibrated back. (where?). I use it as the daily wear.

For 'best' or evenings out I have a nice old Breitling Aero solid titanium quartz (super slim) or a gold plated chunky Raymond Weil to choose from.

 

[julesd68]

For a 'dress watch' I have a black Tissot Ballade chronometer which has very nice ‘Clous de Paris’ engraving on the bezel. I’m very fond of it.

 

[paulfromcamden]

I never dress smartly enough to need a dress watch

 

[John]

I have it in my Alpinist, which I wear "for best". It's great, keeps good time, easy to set and doesn't take half the night to change the date over. The cheaper movements take for ever to change the date, they start changing about 1130 pm and don't complete the job till about 3 in the morning.

I can’t believe this would be an issue with most folks. Who’s awake during those hours?

 

[Nero]

It’s a hi-fi forum

 

[Jezzer]

What do you think of the 6R35 movement? I like the look of the '63 MAS' which uses it - great power reserve but stated accuracy figures aren't great for a watch around 1k.

I have the 62MAS and it seems to keep good time though I notice that after a week it seems to be running about a minute fast. The 70 hour power reserve is great!

 

[hockman]

This level of performance is acceptable to you guys? It would not be for me. Many 40+ year old Seikos would perform better than that (after proper service and calibration of course).

My 6R35 green Alpinist is great too - although it does lose a bit of time and I would love to get it calibrated back. (where?)

I have the 62MAS and it seems to keep good time though I notice that after a week it seems to be running about a minute fast. The 70 hour power reserve is great!

 

[JensenHealey]

But mine has not been serviced or calibrated.... It loses about 15s a day I reckon.

 

[-alan-]

This level of performance is acceptable to you guys? It would not be for me. Many 40+ year old Seikos would perform better than that (after proper service and calibration of course).

I can't think of many areas of my life these days where being a minute late (or early..) would make a huuuuge difference.
But then again, I live in Ireland, where even meetings traditionally are scheduled as being something like starting at 8 - 8:30(ish)

 

[John Phillips]

But mine has not been serviced or calibrated.... It loses about 15s a day I reckon.

My daily wearer since 2014 has been a 6R15C movement Seiko SARB-035. It's badly adjusted (not adjusted at all I expect) so the rate is very variable across orientations and state of wind.

When I was working and I wore it regularly it was actually very well regulated for that pattern of use - perhaps 5 seconds a day slow. Now I wear it less regularly and it loses perhaps 20 seconds a day. I do wonder if I should get it serviced. Given its lack of adjustment I doubt it could be regulated much better without some skilled attention to its variability. Good adjustment is something I expect from my higher cost watches but not from the reasonably modern Seikos I have.

 

[John Phillips]

I can't think of many areas of my life these days where being a minute late (or early..) would make a huuuuge difference.
But then again, I live in Ireland, where even meetings traditionally are scheduled as being something like starting at 8 - 8:30(ish)

ISTR a "hippie watch" from the 1960s which had just an hour hand and markings that read "One-ish", "Two-ish", "Three-ish", etc. Or is my memory of that era playing tricks?