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The Great Obesity Epidemic

Discussion in 'off topic' started by gassor, Nov 27, 2014.

  1. Greg

    Greg 2t5b

    Hip to waist ratio seems to be more reliable than BMI regards T2 diabetes and other diseases:
    http://www.diabetes.co.uk/waist-to-hip-ratio-calculator.html

    "Waist Size Matters"
    "How Abdominal Fat Increases Disease Risk
    More than 60 years ago, the French physician Jean Vague observed that people with larger waists had a higher risk of premature cardiovascular disease and death than people who had trimmer waists or carried more of their weight around their hips and thighs. (1) Decades later, long-term follow-up studies showed that so-called “abdominal obesity” was strongly associated with an increased risk of type 2 diabetes, cardiovascular disease and death, even after controlling for body mass index (BMI)."

    http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/obesity-prevention-source/obesity-definition/abdominal-obesity/
     
  2. merlin

    merlin Avatar changed - Town names deemed offensive.


    Before you start accusing people of being offensive, grab a cup of coffee and have a read of this article from the New Yorker

    It's lengthy and will take around 20 mins or so but it's worthwhile as it get's beyond the BS that's been pumped out for decades and examines the issue from a scientific rather than pharmaceutical POV.

    Hopefully then you might have an idea of where I and others are coming from. With regards to my description of newly found psychiatric conditions, the changes from DSM-1 to DSM-5 has seen an increase in "recognised conditions" from something like 600 to 5000. It's reached the point where even psychiatrists accept they need to look at this differently. I therefore suggest my post is entirely valid, and it's perfectly reasonable to suggest that the descriptions of many new conditions have coincided with the massive expansion of unproven pharmaceutical solutions costing the health care industry billions.
     
  3. Daniel Quinn

    Daniel Quinn Banned

    merlin !!:confused:
     
  4. Greg

    Greg 2t5b

    any recent article which claims to seriously address the subject of depression and which doesn't even mention Mindfulness is a non-starter in my opinion.
     
  5. merlin

    merlin Avatar changed - Town names deemed offensive.

    Have you read the article Greg?
     
  6. lrt1367

    lrt1367 pfm Member

    Are you a clinical psychiatrist or even suffered with this illness, I think a clinical psychiatrist knows more on this issue than you & I have received 6 years of treatment so please refrain from making any further comments on a subject you clearly have no knowledge on with the statements you have made to me,

    please stick with the subject in hand, it has already been pointed out by tony l to do this, I can see this becoming very personal with you, why you want to say such things & cause aggravation I don't know. There is only you & the guy who started this thread that have made such comments so please don't accuse me of accusing "people" of this, others are showing some respect on this delicate subject & sticking to the thread, why have you not responded to others who hold the same view as me here?
     
  7. merlin

    merlin Avatar changed - Town names deemed offensive.

    Tony,

    I apologise if some choose to take offence.

    The simple truth is that some of us take offence when it's suggested that there is no evidence that their new cables or dac power supply improve the actual sound quality of their hifi systems.

    Some take offence when told they are overweight because they don't watch what they eat and fail to live an active enough life.

    Some will take offence when confronted with the suggestion that Freud was closer to the truth than the pharmaceutical industry would have them believe, and that there is no evidence that supports their reasoning.

    We all take offence when something we take very seriously is questioned and possibly exposed. Sadly such is the nature of forums. One can choose to not take offence by not reading the posts in question.
     
  8. merlin

    merlin Avatar changed - Town names deemed offensive.

    Firstly, have you read the article?

    Secondly, what makes you think that psychiatry is a science?
     
  9. Daniel Quinn

    Daniel Quinn Banned

    And one can bear in mind the opponent and choose not to argue , n'est-ce pas ?
     
  10. Greg

    Greg 2t5b

    Yes. Did I miss a bit about Mindfulness?
     
  11. merlin

    merlin Avatar changed - Town names deemed offensive.

    No Greg, but there was a fair nod towards the validity of meditation and talk therapy in general.

    My beef was with the modern day claims with regards to pharmaceuticals aimed at claimed chemical imbalances.
     
  12. Greg

    Greg 2t5b

    I agree with you re drugs, but there is currently a deep divide on the subject of mental illness - on one side there is an ever greater list of psychological afflictions, on the other a rejection even of diagnoses such Schizophrenia - and it seems there are compelling arguments on both sides. I might personally have zero faith in SSRIs and lots of faith in Mindfulness and physical exercise, but I as an utter layman with nothing more than personal anecdote it feels like a big step to post comments like "or any number of newly found psychiatric conditions like depression."

    Whether implied or inferred my reading of this is that depression doesn't really exist, but has been invented to justify the writing of prescriptions. If I'm reading it correctly, then I completely reject this.
     
  13. gassor

    gassor There may be more posts after this.

    Tony, if you change the name of this thread to something like the diagnosis and treatment of depression, I will restart the obesity topic sometime later on.
     
  14. John

    John pfm Member

    Not sure it's the sugar industry, the problem is more high fructose corn syrup which is added to most every food. This became popular when the food industry started the low-fat food trend and started adding HFCS to all its products. This is when the obesity problem really started to kick in.
     
  15. lrt1367

    lrt1367 pfm Member

    I thought this thread was to do with obesity not depression?
     
  16. lrt1367

    lrt1367 pfm Member

    How about when one chooses to read a thread titled obesity & find it is taken over by you talking nonsense about depression, something you obviously know nothing about having not studied the subject, there are many articles claiming all sorts on this matter as there are with hifi subjects which get the "foo" treatment, unless you have suffered this illness or have a medical degree then why don't you shut up & go away or talk about the matter in hand, the ignorance & sheer lack of understanding is astonishing & I would certainly rather have a depressed mind than a sociopathic state.
     
  17. sean99

    sean99 pfm Member

    I think I would require medication for depression / anxiety if it were not for my rather extreme exercise regimen (triathlons plus associated training) and regular meditation. The one time in my life where illness prevented me from exercising for 6 months I was very down, and hard to live with.

    Now, I'm not suggesting by any means that the depression I had compares to many who suffer far worse, but I do think the modern lifestyle of being largely indoors, sedentary and eating a bad diet could contribute to a large number of borderline people requiring medication for stress/anxiety/depression.

    I think it's the same with kids and ADHD where there are definitely children who through no fault of their own require medication, but equally there are many who are medicated when lifestyle modifications (diet, exercise, yoga/meditation) might render medication unnecessary.

    Anyone struggling with any of these symptoms has my deepest sympathy.
     
  18. sean99

    sean99 pfm Member

    I think maybe because there's some overlap in the conditions in terms of causes and mutual reinforcement ?
     
  19. SteveG

    SteveG pfm Member

    Indeed - I'm obese but I'm not depressed. While I'm sure there are a good number of people that overeat due to depression (and many more that are depressed because they're obese) I doubt that applies to anything close to the majority of us obese folks.
     
  20. Daniel Quinn

    Daniel Quinn Banned

    I am almost certain that any correlation between being obese and being depressed will not be any higher than a myriad of other coincidental variables [ blonde hair for instance ] and have zero explanatory power .

    It should be remembered that Depression is a diagnosed condition it must be diagnosed by your doctor in accordance with internationally agreed criteria .

    However it should also be remembered there is an element of subjective interpretation to the diagnosis , it is diagnosed pursuant of a dialogue between the diagnoser and diagnosee.
     

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