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The 2019 F1 season.

sean99 said:
I doubt it. I mean $10million a year vs $30million a year - does it really compensate for walking away from any hope of ever winning a driver's title (not this year, but RBR-Honda will keep getting better) ? If it does then I'd say DR is not really a serious driver (and that Renault wasted their money).
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So you think Daniel didn't know all these things as he made his decision? Or was he delusional and thought the Renault car might have more potential?

I suggest he went in knowing full well the Renault would not be competitive, gambling on biding his time in a lower team for a year or two in hopes that an opportunity may eventually arise at Mercedes, Ferrari, or a resurgent McLaren. And I predict that will be a bad gamble, as those teams, when seats become available, will go with young hotshots instead.
 
Good points - at the time I thought Ricciardo genuinely thought Renault could become competitive - after all they have won the constructor's title in the past, albeit over a decade ago. It's surprising to me that they are currently performing so much worse than McLaren - doesn't bode well for the future.

As to your second thought I agree that DR has blown his chances of driving for Mercedes or Ferrari, and McLaren look unlikely to become MORE competitive than RBR IMO. He should have stayed with RBR and used the intense competition with MV to up his own game, and pinned his hopes on the Honda powerplant eventually coming to equal Mercedes / Ferrari.

I admit that I can see the lure of taking an extra $20 million for not having to compete with MV for another season, but now he's at significant risk of being outscored by Hulkenberg which will surely be the death of any aspiration of a better drive.
 
Very risky moving to Renault , I am sure they promised a big improvement in the engine and car and most would have expected them to improve this year rather than going backwards . Mclaren have shown that the engine is better so the car design must be lacking . I agree that it will now be difficult to get back to a top team as lots of good young drivers about , probably a return to RB his best bet as quite possibly Max could leave as he feels he still cannot compete with Mercdes and Ferrari
 
Tony Lockhart said:
@IanW

Has everyone learned their lesson about packaging the power plant? I’d imagine power plant upgrades would generate more heat, sometimes locally, and this could cause issues if the packaging isn’t fully understood.
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Yes and no.

No because of the following reasons; the cooling is a function of the full aero package, and that changes each year. And each year you want to make your cooling system more efficient and weigh less. So everyone struggles to get this right. This is the major reason why Mercedes have been weak at Mexico in the hybrid era, as it is by far the worst circuit for cooling and so they optimise for the rest of the circuits and then accept being slow in Mexico.

Yes, in general all the teams know how to install the engine and what gets hot etc on it.
 
peter bj said:
Very risky moving to Renault , I am sure they promised a big improvement in the engine and car and most would have expected them to improve this year rather than going backwards . Mclaren have shown that the engine is better so the car design must be lacking . I agree that it will now be difficult to get back to a top team as lots of good young drivers about , probably a return to RB his best bet as quite possibly Max could leave as he feels he still cannot compete with Mercdes and Ferrari
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Hi,

I think Daniel Ricciardo's move might have been as a result of Max Verstappen getting the best of him and the lure of money at Renault and their performance upgrade potential at that time.

However I think Daniel Ricciardo he will be at Renault for the rest of his days, there will be nothing at Mercedes until Lewis Hamilton leaves as I think Valtteri Bottas has done enough to stay as he is there to pick up the wins when things don't go to plan. Also I think Red Bull will not want Daniel Ricciardo back as they have plenty others in the pipeline who will be just as fast.

I also cannot see Max Verstappen moving anywhere, Ferrari have Leclerc as their new number one driver, Vettel might leave at the end of 2020 and they will replace him with one of the their new guys as I doubt they would want Max Verstappen and his attitute to racing against Leclerc.

The one guy that might get a move is George Russell, he seems to have the right attitude and seems to be quick, not sure where he could go but staying at Williams to further his ambitions will not work as I cannot see them getting any better in the next three to five years.

McLaren will keep their line up for the next few years I think, both seem to do well together and that car will get better.

The only place in the next few years is at Alfa Romeo when Kimi Räikkönen leaves at the end of 2020, who would go there is anyones guess.

My take on things, could be way off, but I think there is some logic in my thoughts.

Cheers

John
 
Yank said:
So you think Daniel didn't know all these things as he made his decision? Or was he delusional and thought the Renault car might have more potential?

I suggest he went in knowing full well the Renault would not be competitive, gambling on biding his time in a lower team for a year or two in hopes that an opportunity may eventually arise at Mercedes, Ferrari, or a resurgent McLaren. And I predict that will be a bad gamble, as those teams, when seats become available, will go with young hotshots instead.
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I couldn't disagree with this more. In F1 at the moment you need to be in a 'works' car to win. By that I mean a car whose engine supplier is the primary partner. Currently there are four engines and hence four 'works teams', Ferrari, Mercedes, RB/Honda and Renault. If you listen to the mid season documentary with Daniel you will hear his reasons for leaving RB, he was basically in the same place with Verstappen as Webber was with Vettel and what did Webber ever win? There was an opening at Renault and he reasoned that having won all his races powered by a Renault and the fact that Renault were making the right noises about getting back to the Renault of the mid-2000s it was a sensible move. Whether it does or does not work out like that is yet to be seen, but I remember reading the same sort of rhetoric when Hamilton left the proper racing team that was McLaren to go to the marketing exercise that was Mercedes... that turned into a complete disaster didn't it?

I'm not saying Renault will work out the same way, but I can see his reasons for going and they are not all about money or biding his time. As for future opportunities should Renault not work out then should a seat be available in a top team next to a youngster I can't think of anyone better to put in the sister car than DR. He is a genuinely nice guy with the right amount of dedication to his sport such that he will give 100%, but not compromise a team mate unlike... Vettel (not a criticism, just an observation).
 
tiggers said:
I couldn't disagree with this more. In F1 at the moment you need to be in a 'works' car to win. By that I mean a car whose engine supplier is the primary partner. Currently there are four engines and hence four 'works teams', Ferrari, Mercedes, RB/Honda and Renault. If you listen to the mid season documentary with Daniel you will hear his reasons for leaving RB, he was basically in the same place with Verstappen as Webber was with Vettel and what did Webber ever win? There was an opening at Renault and he reasoned that having won all his races powered by a Renault and the fact that Renault were making the right noises about getting back to the Renault of the mid-2000s it was a sensible move. Whether it does or does not work out like that is yet to be seen, but I remember reading the same sort of rhetoric when Hamilton left the proper racing team that was McLaren to go to the marketing exercise that was Mercedes... that turned into a complete disaster didn't it?

I'm not saying Renault will work out the same way, but I can see his reasons for going and they are not all about money or biding his time. As for future opportunities should Renault not work out then should a seat be available in a top team next to a youngster I can't think of anyone better to put in the sister car than DR. He is a genuinely nice guy with the right amount of dedication to his sport such that he will give 100%, but not compromise a team mate unlike... Vettel (not a criticism, just an observation).
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Excellent post, I was going to write something but found you had done it already.
 
I was reading comments on other sites that Mexico is the most compromised race for Mercedes and they never realy do well there. Surely it would be worth changing their complete powertrains as the penalty impact will be minamized?
 
Copperjacket said:
I was reading comments on other sites that Mexico is the most compromised race for Mercedes and they never realy do well there. Surely it would be worth changing their complete powertrains as the penalty impact will be minamized?
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They had a horrendous time with tyre management last year but they have a much better handle on the tyres this year (probably the best) so I don't think they will be so bad. However despite the Ferrari taking chunks on the huge straight maybe even a second and the fizzy drink boys being right in there I suspect Merc will be closer this year. McLaren for 4th best again, maybe even challenge for 3rd best.
 
Be nice to see maclaren back up there. Landon Norris and sainz jnr seem a good pairing.
 
Copperjacket said:
I was reading comments on other sites that Mexico is the most compromised race for Mercedes and they never realy do well there. Surely it would be worth changing their complete powertrains as the penalty impact will be minamized?
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I explained why Merc have struggled in post #1024 at Mexico. As Ferrari and Merc have gradually moved closer together in performance (i.e. tracks where they will be strong or weak at), then these problems will gradually have been dealt with , if they can in an efficient way. Merc has the resource to sort this out without much impact elsewhere.

So it will be interesting to see whether they have actually dealt with the core problem or are happy to stick with their core concept that has worked very well for the past 6 years.
 
Renault and its drivers penalized for the illegal brake system used in Japan. Strange Racing Point could write a 14 page report during raceweekend or maybe other exclusions/penalties for other races to follow ??
 
I think if most of us had had the wealth and success at a young age that Hamilton enjoyed we would probably have "lived a bit" without regard to our environmental impact. It's to Hamilton's credit that he has realized this while still relatively young and is now making an effort where he can. I'm really pleased that he has matured this way and quite happy to forgive any past excesses.
 
Yank said:
Maybe he'll go to Formula E? :rolleyes:
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Yes , a real boost to his 'green' credentials and a big boost for formula E

Formula E is the only credible motor sport really as fossil fuel cars are now dinosaurs, this would be good for the development of electric power plants.
 
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