Revisiting Jim Rogers JR149s
So I picked these up, and could do with some advice.
I can't really say whether they sound good or bad as I haven't hooked them up to anything that would allow me to make that judgement yet (or sorted out some basics). The drivers seem to be ok (or at least as far as running tone tests and a few tunes through them suggests).
HOWEVER, looking at the crossovers my guess would be that at some stage one got broken/ damaged and was replaced as a whole by another of the same vintage, BUT:
- On the lighter one it looks like someone has manually ceated a break in the circuit board to insert an 'aftermarket' fuse
- On the darker one one cap has been replaced at some point by the green thing
- On the darker one the resistor at 12.00 looks like its 4.7 while the equivalent on the lighter on looks like 5.6 (the rest at different brands/ batches but have the same values I think)
I'm planning to replace the caps anyway (and have the kit from Falcon - although they don't seem to do the lower tolerance version I see referenced earlier in the thread any more). But do I need to swap out that resistor also (in which case I think from the diagram a few posts up the 4.7 is correct?).
What should I do about the fuse? Remove it and reconnect the circuit board witha soldered wire?
A0C2D0EB-6B6A-4942-9711-B9BC20A1242C by Felix Hall, on Flickr
B3429D84-15CA-49AE-8934-DE7D072E361E by Felix Hall, on Flickr
4EE1DFB5-09CC-4AF9-BDE7-137146DB514E by Felix Hall, on Flickr
72AB55B1-5E37-478A-9D3F-B910EFAD0E41 by Felix Hall, on Flickr
I can't really say whether they sound good or bad as I haven't hooked them up to anything that would allow me to make that judgement yet (or sorted out some basics). The drivers seem to be ok (or at least as far as running tone tests and a few tunes through them suggests).
HOWEVER, looking at the crossovers my guess would be that at some stage one got broken/ damaged and was replaced as a whole by another of the same vintage, BUT:
- On the lighter one it looks like someone has manually ceated a break in the circuit board to insert an 'aftermarket' fuse
- On the darker one one cap has been replaced at some point by the green thing
- On the darker one the resistor at 12.00 looks like its 4.7 while the equivalent on the lighter on looks like 5.6 (the rest at different brands/ batches but have the same values I think)
I'm planning to replace the caps anyway (and have the kit from Falcon - although they don't seem to do the lower tolerance version I see referenced earlier in the thread any more). But do I need to swap out that resistor also (in which case I think from the diagram a few posts up the 4.7 is correct?).
What should I do about the fuse? Remove it and reconnect the circuit board witha soldered wire?
A0C2D0EB-6B6A-4942-9711-B9BC20A1242C by Felix Hall, on FlickrB3429D84-15CA-49AE-8934-DE7D072E361E by Felix Hall, on Flickr4EE1DFB5-09CC-4AF9-BDE7-137146DB514E by Felix Hall, on Flickr72AB55B1-5E37-478A-9D3F-B910EFAD0E41 by Felix Hall, on Flickr
Tony L
Administrator
I’d reverse-out the fuse and replace all resistors and capacitors so they are identical left/right.
Such a big difference is very odd, though my own pair suggest JR’s quality control was not the best (one different resistor left/right). There have been several versions of the crossover, at least three to my knowledge, but it is hard to define further as there is no official documentation of this aspect to my knowledge. I’d love to see a proper revision-list.
Such a big difference is very odd, though my own pair suggest JR’s quality control was not the best (one different resistor left/right). There have been several versions of the crossover, at least three to my knowledge, but it is hard to define further as there is no official documentation of this aspect to my knowledge. I’d love to see a proper revision-list.
Yes I guess I might as well. There are only 10 and I’m in there anyway.
re the difference, that’s why I suspect one sides been swapped out at some point - along with the fact that someone’s made a very deliberate mod (the fuse) on one side only, which would make no sense.
Tony am I right, scanning the thread, that while initially the match with your Leak was poor, once you’d restored them it was good? Which setting in the Leak did you end up with?
re the difference, that’s why I suspect one sides been swapped out at some point - along with the fact that someone’s made a very deliberate mod (the fuse) on one side only, which would make no sense.
Tony am I right, scanning the thread, that while initially the match with your Leak was poor, once you’d restored them it was good? Which setting in the Leak did you end up with?
ToTo Man
the band not the dog
The fuse isn't an after-market mod.
Are you sure? I mean I know a lot aren’t.
But as I say, it is on one side not the other. And as you can see above someone has cut/ scraped the section of circuit board off and run wires through to the fuse.
Which is completely different to others I’ve seen.
Tony L
Administrator
Yes, they are a superb match with the Leak. I prefer the 16 Ohm tap. The comparison with the Falcon LS3/5A (now fitted with ‘Gold Badge’ crossovers) is fascinating. No winner, just different solutions to the same problem.
I suspect that one is. Certainly the fused boards I have are very different and are clearly designed to be fused (i.e. different layout, no cut tracks), not manually hacked.
ToTo Man
the band not the dog
You could be right but one of my pairs has the exact same fuse holders with cables running from them, I'll see if I can find a photo.
EDIT - From post #1022:
Tony L
Administrator
Interesting, it may have evolved as a factory hack before the next board generation. I know a lot were going back with tweeter failures, I assume folk just playing them too loud. That was certainly the reason for the fuse being introduced. I have no idea why just one of this pair would have the hack.
Tony L
Administrator
Yes, you are right. The holder and board drilling is identical, so it looks like an intermediate factory step. The only way I can explain the mismatched pair is maybe one blew, was repaired under warranty and received the board hack and fuse when there? I’d have thought both would have gone back though given both speakers fit in the one shipping box.
PS Are these red or gold logo? My assumption is all gold logo would have the later fused board revision, front-baffle foam and deadsheet, but I may be wrong.
PS Are these red or gold logo? My assumption is all gold logo would have the later fused board revision, front-baffle foam and deadsheet, but I may be wrong.
ToTo Man
the band not the dog
Mine are gold logo, but both of Felix's units appear to be red logo (based on the style of label under the aluminium base).
They are red. But with the extra foam/ deadsheet, which I think means later ones. Serial no on one is 8881. Sticker's fallen off the other.
As you say, looking at yours it is exactly the same. So I was wrong on that. Apologies. Presumably it was a factory thing. But only on one side so either a replacement board as a whole or a repair, I guess, as you say, Tony.
Re the resisters - assume they are 5a rated? Does brand/ type make any difference (apologies - I can solder but I couldn't read a circuit diagram to save me life)
Tony - thank you. I know you disapprove of my modified TL12Pluses but my hope is they like these speakers and start to form a second system.
Tony L
Administrator
5 Watt, I used Kiwame from HiFiCollective, which is not the cheapest option but they are nice resistors and have the values printed on in text which is useful if, like me, you struggle to read colour bands. HFC actually individually bag each value so even ones with colour bands aren’t confusing, though I do double-check everything with my meter just to be sure.
I can’t recall disapproving of your amps, but my stock early champagne coloured ones love the 149s and LS3/5As. They seem to have just a little more power on tap than a Stereo 20, though that does fine too. Just don’t expect too much volume, but the B110 will likely give out before the Leak! I think I work them pretty hard though, it wouldn’t surprise me if they were delivering the full ten or twelve Watts on the absolute transient peaks of some very well recorded and dynamic jazz at the circa 76-80db median (C weighted) levels I tend to listen at. Just on the very top of a loud drum hit or whatever.
TonyScarlett
pfm Member
My last pair of JR149s were early gold logo, serial no's in the 9000's. iirc. They still had unfused crossovers with the four individual pin connectors rather than the plastic connector block on the later fused crossovers. May still be some pics upthread.
TS
TS