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REVIEW: MHDT Labs - Orchid - An Awesome Analogue Sounding DAC

I've found the Taiwanese made chips from 97 and 98 tend to have a more dynamic sound to the Dutch made chips.

Both of these S chips are Taiwanese ones - I think according to the sources I got them from?. I was chatting with Peter at Dutch Audio Classics, and he thinks the N2 Dutch made chips are amazing.
 
Very good review. I like the appeal of the R1. Or maybe the S2. I can understand about not wanting to add too much of a "Hifi" clarity.

The R1 is great, theres no real reason to change it to be honest - I think you'll really like the Orchid out of the box by what you have said. I think if I can find some money I will try an N2 at some point so I can complete the set, and then maybe source out one of these 97-98 standard chips @Mike P talks about
 
Yes, I'm going to consider an Orchid for the future. I've decided that I prefer the Audionote TDA1543 DAC than the Marantz CD94 with the TDA1541. I've spent hours going back and fourth. I think if the Marantz was modified it would be amazing. Someone has a Marantz CD12/DAS12 KI version on Ebay. £7500! That might just be the one. But for someone else.
Thanks for your reviews.
 
An explanation of the serial numbers is available here:

http://www.dutchaudioclassics.nl/Philips-TDA1541.asp

Although the 1988 HSH chip did go to Taiwan for assembly it's the chips which actually have the word Taiwan printed at the end which people generally refer to a being 'produced' in Taiwan. By most peoples classification your S1 is Dutch and the S2 Taiwanese.

The earliest Taiwan marked chip I have is 1994*.

*Edit: actually, it's 1995. I do have a 94 chip but that's not marked Taiwan.

Here's an extract from the same website which may explain why some find the chips made in 97 and 98 so good.


The "select" version TDA1541A S1 progressed to become the TDA1541A S2, with an even stricter selective standard and a so-called double crown mark. In fact, previous "select" product levels were ealisy exceeded through improvements in the manufacturing process and manufacturing precision of the device.
 
Last edited:
An explanation of the serial numbers is available here:

http://www.dutchaudioclassics.nl/Philips-TDA1541.asp

Although the 1988 HSH chip did go to Taiwan for assembly it's the chips which actually have the word Taiwan printed at the end which people generally refer to a being 'produced' in Taiwan. By most peoples classification your S1 is Dutch and the S2 Taiwanese.

The earliest Taiwan marked chip I have is 1994.

Here's an extract from the same website which may explain why some find the chips made in 97 and 98 so good.


The "select" version TDA1541A S1 progressed to become the TDA1541A S2, with an even stricter selective standard and a so-called double crown mark. In fact, previous "select" product levels were ealisy exceeded through improvements in the manufacturing process and manufacturing precision of the device.

Interesting, that may explain the more 'linear' sound in the S1 I have. I definitely think I'll have to try this N2 , apparently "Thanks to manufacturing techniques around in 1995/1997 Philips was able to produce this chip with a performance which was better then the older S1 chip. So for price/quality this N2 chip is a stunner"
 
My understanding of the design of these multi-bit converters is that they contain a set of resistors which have been trimmed to be as close as possible to the sequence R, 2R, 4R, 8R etc, one for each bit of the digital signal. Due to manufacturing variation, these will actually be more like R, 1.9998R, 4.0002R etc, and the deviation from the perfect sequence is what is being measured as part of the binning process.

Notice that this means that for a given version (say R1 or S1) there is no 'chip sound' since different instances can have their deviation from the perfect sequence in different places, so you'll potentially have two R1s, for example, having their deviation from perfect appearing in more or less audible places.

BTW, I grew up with these converters and still have a player from the 80s that uses it, and it sounds mighty fine.
 
Hi guys, this is my first post from here, as I wanted to share my experiences here too.
I´m a MHDT orchid owner since August (I´m the one who purchased it from Ebay from a very kindly UK audiophile/compatriot yours).

First of all, the review posted here is very accurate in my opinion, very close to the reality ;)


I always wanted to try a TDA1541 based DAC, as I´m feeling since long time some “rebirth” from the famous R2R NOS dacs against the currently and widely used Delta-sigma dacs (and now specially with the high-tech ESS 9038pro dacs). Oh yes I´ve owned the Chord 2qute too… and frankly to me it was a total disappointment, very “hollywood-sci fi hifi sound”.

To my mind, it seems to be that more and more people are claiming a “more analog and natural” sound for their Hifi systems, aiming for a mix of “feeling with a tinge of nostalgia”.. that´s why TDA1541 chip (among others) is always a reference from the beginning of the golden era of early digital players.


I´m a declared perfectionist, an audiophile that wants to try as much material as possible, tweaking/improving it at the maximum that the device is capable of… trying to find the sweet spot in my system, according to my tastes.


At the moment of the purchase of the Orchid, I don´t really need it frankly, as I was pretty satisfied with my Rega DAC-R. Despite being a Delta-sigma dac (it uses 2x Wolfson 8742 D/A) it´s conception is very minimalistic and it follow a similar path about using the minimal processing/manipulation of the signal as possible ( No upsampling here, nor digital volume control or DSD decoding without any other fireworks). But it has a nice “house” sound, similar to Naim that I find it very attractive and a true foot tapping. The soundstage is impressive, huge, and in general it´s very enjoyable. BUT, as always I was curious and I wanted to try the MHDT and compare it against my Rega in my equipment.


The stock orchid sounds good, with a transparency levels a bit uncommon for a tube based dac: it´s detailed and articulate at the top but above all , it has a nice, beautiful midrange. It Clearly showed its strengths more easily playing with instrumental / vocal music: Here is when it shines, you can feel the good, rich and natural tone.

The bass was correct (but nothing special, however) and it was there… but on the other hand it didn´t have the slam or weight of the Rega and its soundstage was a bit more shrinked in comparison… also, I felt the top extreme of the Rega to be more revealing and resolving (but this could be normal, because of the nature of the NOS function, without any digital filter applied) so in the end I was partially divided between the two. If I could choose the strengths of the two in a single unit, it would be the perfect Dac for the price.

But here comes the best part: the orchid is an absolute chameleon: In stock form when you get it from the factory yo need to think that it´s only a origin point, only the beginning of a path that if you take care of choosing the right components, it rewards you with a much better sound that In the end it´s worth the upgrade.

To get the best of the Orchid, I strongly recommend doing the following:



1 ) Replace the stock R1 chip. I talked with Peter from Duchaudioclassics and I purchased a N2 “new old stock / never used” chip , latest batch from year ’97 “HBH” code. For me, it clearly had the best price/performance ratio, and for about 85€ with whipping included it was a good point and for an upgrade.

On the other hand I asked for the price from a S2 double crown (as you know, the “holy grail” of the TDA1541 production) from him but I was shocked when I knew the price… he sells it for a whopping 800€ !! Almost the cost of another Orchid…. So in the end, it wasn´t for me.



What about the final result? Not completely day/night , but to sum up I will say that the N2 chip is clearly superior to the stock R1. The midrange is even more accurate, with a touch more fuller/organic sound in general , plus an increased sense of transparency and treble definition, without a hint of aggresive.



As an Orchid owner, I highly recommend upgrading the chip for a N2, at last. It gives you a even more polished sound and elevates its performance a bit more, without breaking the bank.

One thing to note: I even tried some interesting solutions for chip rolling, going more far than a proper TDA1541A chip.

For example a X8 TDA1387 paralleled dac adapter (and this probably could be the 4th best Phillips multibit chip of the history and it was sadly forgotten… Funny thing it was the chip used into the Sound Blaster AWE 64 sound cards ).



This is the converter I tried: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/1185-...0001&campid=5338728743&icep_item=132130954983

And this one too ( but 4 chips) http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/1185-...0001&campid=5338728743&icep_item=253669815803


BUT sadly they DON´T work in the Orchid, so don´t waste your money here… This type of replacement based in the 1387 chips, works in some players and dacs but the designers of these modules warns that it may don´t work in some desings, so it´s not a 100% guaranteed drop-in replacement. In the end, with the Orchid I confirm that unfortunately these modules don´t work, as they are incompatible.

It´s a pity because with these modules sounds surpringsly good, and for 9 € they are a real bargain. maybe a steal and worth a try if you have one cd player that uses the TDA1541 chip.



2) Replace the stock tube. The original GE tube isn´t bad, it certainly has a good balance and it maintains a good overall compromise, but there are much better tubes out there that can turn the Orchid into a much more capable musical machine, and this dac is VERY sensitive to Tube rolling as you probably have read.

I have purchased a special tube adapter in order to allow me install regular e88cc/6dj8 tubes into the 6N3 type tube socket that Mhdt uses, as I had already some of these tubes around in my house. If you want to do more tube rolling, you may want to buy an adapter like this.
I have tried a small selection tubes: Tesla PCC88 (good punch and overall balanced, but the highs are a bit rolled off), Siemens ECC85 (more cheap than the ECC88 equivalents, OK tube, clean but a bit thin sounding), Telefunken PCC88 (very good and almost identical performance than its E88CC equivalents, more cheaper) but for me, when the Orchid really shined was with the Mullard CV2493 military-selected low noise. Creamy mids, good punch and "liquid" treble, airy and open sounding.


I *highly* recommend investing in a good tube instead of other "tweaks" (see later) that matches your system the best as possible. For now, I find the Mullard valve to be a very good match for the Orchid, extracting all the juice of the DAC and giving a very good results, but of course there are a lot of other good sounding tubes, just need try the best for your system/tastes.


3) Other tweaks. Without going into deep modifications to the unit (void warranty and other possible headaches, not always for a better sound, just "different") , along with the tube rolling other interesant tweak would be the fuse. Yes, upgrading the fuse changes the sound character too, but according to my test, I have realized that the designer has voiced/engineered the MHDT orchid with the stock fuse (glass Bussmann/Eaton brand) in mind. This means that going with "boutique" fuses has an effect of "tuning" the sound (like an "EQ") but not always for better sound. In fact, the sound is worse, and I have tried supposedly the best fuse on the market, the newest Synergistic research Blue.



Other fuses I have tried:



AMR gold
Synergistic research black
Padis
Schurter SMD/SPT gold plated ends (inexpensive)
Eaton/bussman ceramic fuse (inexpensive)
Aucharm silver alloy (chinese, affordable)
Each of them has its own character, you only need to try to hear it, if your system is a resolving one (and in case you don´t have "wood ears" ) , but I need to admit that the sock nickel glass fuse brings the most accurate sound signature that better complements the orchid: Tight bass, very good mids and airy treble. Just sound good.


Enjoy!
 
This site contains affiliate links for which pink fish media may be compensated.
Does the Mullard CV2493 drop in to the original socket or do you need an adapter?
Thanks
David



Hi guys, this is my first post from here, as I wanted to share my experiences here too.
I´m a MHDT orchid owner since August (I´m the one who purchased it from Ebay from a very kindly UK audiophile/compatriot yours).

First of all, the review posted here is very accurate in my opinion, very close to the reality ;)


I always wanted to try a TDA1541 based DAC, as I´m feeling since long time some “rebirth” from the famous R2R NOS dacs against the currently and widely used Delta-sigma dacs (and now specially with the high-tech ESS 9038pro dacs). Oh yes I´ve owned the Chord 2qute too… and frankly to me it was a total disappointment, very “hollywood-sci fi hifi sound”.

To my mind, it seems to be that more and more people are claiming a “more analog and natural” sound for their Hifi systems, aiming for a mix of “feeling with a tinge of nostalgia”.. that´s why TDA1541 chip (among others) is always a reference from the beginning of the golden era of early digital players.


I´m a declared perfectionist, an audiophile that wants to try as much material as possible, tweaking/improving it at the maximum that the device is capable of… trying to find the sweet spot in my system, according to my tastes.


At the moment of the purchase of the Orchid, I don´t really need it frankly, as I was pretty satisfied with my Rega DAC-R. Despite being a Delta-sigma dac (it uses 2x Wolfson 8742 D/A) it´s conception is very minimalistic and it follow a similar path about using the minimal processing/manipulation of the signal as possible ( No upsampling here, nor digital volume control or DSD decoding without any other fireworks). But it has a nice “house” sound, similar to Naim that I find it very attractive and a true foot tapping. The soundstage is impressive, huge, and in general it´s very enjoyable. BUT, as always I was curious and I wanted to try the MHDT and compare it against my Rega in my equipment.


The stock orchid sounds good, with a transparency levels a bit uncommon for a tube based dac: it´s detailed and articulate at the top but above all , it has a nice, beautiful midrange. It Clearly showed its strengths more easily playing with instrumental / vocal music: Here is when it shines, you can feel the good, rich and natural tone.

The bass was correct (but nothing special, however) and it was there… but on the other hand it didn´t have the slam or weight of the Rega and its soundstage was a bit more shrinked in comparison… also, I felt the top extreme of the Rega to be more revealing and resolving (but this could be normal, because of the nature of the NOS function, without any digital filter applied) so in the end I was partially divided between the two. If I could choose the strengths of the two in a single unit, it would be the perfect Dac for the price.

But here comes the best part: the orchid is an absolute chameleon: In stock form when you get it from the factory yo need to think that it´s only a origin point, only the beginning of a path that if you take care of choosing the right components, it rewards you with a much better sound that In the end it´s worth the upgrade.

To get the best of the Orchid, I strongly recommend doing the following:



1 ) Replace the stock R1 chip. I talked with Peter from Duchaudioclassics and I purchased a N2 “new old stock / never used” chip , latest batch from year ’97 “HBH” code. For me, it clearly had the best price/performance ratio, and for about 85€ with whipping included it was a good point and for an upgrade.

On the other hand I asked for the price from a S2 double crown (as you know, the “holy grail” of the TDA1541 production) from him but I was shocked when I knew the price… he sells it for a whopping 800€ !! Almost the cost of another Orchid…. So in the end, it wasn´t for me.



What about the final result? Not completely day/night , but to sum up I will say that the N2 chip is clearly superior to the stock R1. The midrange is even more accurate, with a touch more fuller/organic sound in general , plus an increased sense of transparency and treble definition, without a hint of aggresive.



As an Orchid owner, I highly recommend upgrading the chip for a N2, at last. It gives you a even more polished sound and elevates its performance a bit more, without breaking the bank.

One thing to note: I even tried some interesting solutions for chip rolling, going more far than a proper TDA1541A chip.

For example a X8 TDA1387 paralleled dac adapter (and this probably could be the 4th best Phillips multibit chip of the history and it was sadly forgotten… Funny thing it was the chip used into the Sound Blaster AWE 64 sound cards ).



This is the converter I tried: https://www.ebay.es/itm/1PC-new-4-parallel-TDA1387-Module-Can-replace-TDA1541/253669815803?ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649


BUT sadly they DON´T work in the Orchid, so don´t waste your money here… This type of replacement based in the 1387 chips, works in some players and dacs but the designers of these modules warns that it may don´t work in some desings, so it´s not a 100% guaranteed drop-in replacement. In the end, with the Orchid I confirm that unfortunately these modules don´t work, as they are incompatible.

It´s a pity because with these modules sounds surpringsly good, and for 9 € they are a real bargain. maybe a steal and worth a try if you have one cd player that uses the TDA1541 chip.



2) Replace the stock tube. The original GE tube isn´t bad, it certainly has a good balance and it maintains a good overall compromise, but there are much better tubes out there that can turn the Orchid into a much more capable musical machine, and this dac is VERY sensitive to Tube rolling as you probably have read.

I have purchased a special tube adapter in order to allow me install regular e88cc/6dj8 tubes into the 6N3 type tube socket that Mhdt uses, as I had already some of these tubes around in my house. If you want to do more tube rolling, you may want to buy an adapter like this.
I have tried a small selection tubes: Tesla PCC88 (good punch and overall balanced, but the highs are a bit rolled off), Siemens ECC85 (more cheap than the ECC88 equivalents, OK tube, clean but a bit thin sounding), Telefunken PCC88 (very good and almost identical performance than its E88CC equivalents, more cheaper) but for me, when the Orchid really shined was with the Mullard CV2493 military-selected low noise. Creamy mids, good punch and "liquid" treble, airy and open sounding.


I *highly* recommend investing in a good tube instead of other "tweaks" (see later) that matches your system the best as possible. For now, I find the Mullard valve to be a very good match for the Orchid, extracting all the juice of the DAC and giving a very good results, but of course there are a lot of other good sounding tubes, just need try the best for your system/tastes.


3) Other tweaks. Without going into deep modifications to the unit (void warranty and other possible headaches, not always for a better sound, just "different") , along with the tube rolling other interesant tweak would be the fuse. Yes, upgrading the fuse changes the sound character too, but according to my test, I have realized that the designer has voiced/engineered the MHDT orchid with the stock fuse (glass Bussmann/Eaton brand) in mind. This means that going with "boutique" fuses has an effect of "tuning" the sound (like an "EQ") but not always for better sound. In fact, the sound is worse, and I have tried supposedly the best fuse on the market, the newest Synergistic research Blue.



Other fuses I have tried:



AMR gold
Synergistic research black
Padis
Schurter SMD/SPT gold plated ends (inexpensive)
Eaton/bussman ceramic fuse (inexpensive)
Aucharm silver alloy (chinese, affordable)
Each of them has its own character, you only need to try to hear it, if your system is a resolving one (and in case you don´t have "wood ears" ) , but I need to admit that the sock nickel glass fuse brings the most accurate sound signature that better complements the orchid: Tight bass, very good mids and airy treble. Just sound good.


Enjoy!
 
This site contains affiliate links for which pink fish media may be compensated.
This site contains affiliate links for which pink fish media may be compensated.
Thanks. With the adapter is it a simple matter of plugging it in or do I need to adjust bias or anything?
Thanks again.
David
 
Just another enthusiastic endorsement of the MHDT Orchid. I've had mine for nearly a week and probably have somewhere around 100 hours on it. It is a wonderful sounding DAC, and it is burning in very nicely. It's good enough that I've almost made up my mind to stop looking at other DACs.
 
Great review. Can I ask where in the uk you can purchase this dac? Also is it CE certified for Euro safety laws?
 
Also, one other comment about tube rolling in the Orchid. I used the 5670 to 6DJ8 adapter to roll in an Amperex made in Holland 6DJ8 and i think it is a worthwhile upgrade. Tones are more fully fleshed out, decays seem more extended, timbres are prettier. Kinda like going from a cheap grand piano to a really really good one.
 
Here we are, a year later.
I have an 'Havana' mhdt dac, though amended-here's the description
"This very unit convinced me to sell my Esoteric X-03se SACD/CD player. After the upgrades were installed the Havana thrashed the X-03 almost everywhere, with a noticeably more colourful mid and gorgeous top end. The one area that the '03 bettered it was in the bass depth and speed - but not by much (and we're talking about one of the best cd players in it's price range at £6000 here!)

This unique DAC was very extensively upgraded last year by our very own Earl of Sodbury at Wychwood Audionics - with higher spec (lower distortion) DAC chips, Mundorf Supreme caps, power supply upgrades, higher value caps and resistors throughout. I have also fitted a very rare 1950s JW Western Electric 2C51 valve - these alone fetch £40-50 on E-Bay. The valve sounds far nicer than the GE 5670 supplied by MHDT.

The standard Havana is already a highly-reviewed unit - the upgrades have brought superior clarity/insight, superb tonal colour. more detail and noticeably deeper/controlled bass. In fact i've never heard any NOS DAC that does bass like the Havana."
...... the ad on the Wam;
I was lucky to see it just after it was posted. I'd owned a Paradisea at that time, so snapped it up.
it's only now i wonder exactly what the 'higher spec' chips are. Maybe I should open it up and look?
Anyway, never had any inclination to change.
 
Thought I'd revisit this thread, now that I'm well into my second year of ownership, and share a few thoughts.

It is a superb sounding DAC. How does it compare with other DACs? Frankly, it's good enough that I haven't compared it to anything else. I've stopped looking to upgrade my digital front end; there are other more pressing priorities for upgrading my system.

With this DAC I've been able to compare my early vinyl pressings of vintage jazz to their digital counterparts. The digital versions sound good enough that I am not stressed about missing anything much when I stream them. I'm content. That's a great destination to shoot for.

A comment about chip-swapping in the Orchid. I was able to track down a late-production Taiwanese chip on the 'bay. In corresponding with the seller, he advised that by the late 90s, the Taiwanese factory had refined the process to the point where virtually all the chips coming off the line were at the "crown" level. He said that once the final order for single and double-crown chips was filled the "sorting cell" was taken down. The implication being that there was no business case for maintaining the sorting cell. Remember that at the time, these chips were being turned out by thousands and were not really considered the "big deal" they are nowadays. They were just chips heading for the shelves of various customers and supply houses. I have not swapped chips, even though I have a ground strap and tube-puller.

On the Audiogon forum there's a poster who goes by the name of Grannyring. He's a capable, technically savvy DIY tweaker. A couple years ago when he had his Orchid he did extensive modifications to it. His feeling was that the stock chip is plenty good enough. There's little to be gained from switching it out for a more esoteric version of the TDA 1541. That influenced me to not take the chance of damaging my unit by swapping chips. I still think about it from time to time.

Another comment about tube-rolling. I have four friends who've also purchased Orchid DACs. So far, the two who tried swapping in the 6DJ8 with the tube adapter have both been delighted with that change and have stuck with it. It's a very worthwhile upgrade. And it doesn't require a fancy-grade "select" low-noise tube either.

Markus
 


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