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Post-Trump: III (decline, further tantrums, legal proceedings, book deals etc)

Discussion in 'off topic' started by Yank, May 19, 2021.

  1. Yank

    Yank Bulbous Also Tapered

    The rules are for everybody else...
     
    Mullardman likes this.
  2. wacko

    wacko pfm Member

    ^ yet so many who vote for Trump say "we don't like him but we like his (Old Testament) policies". Exactly how large is the American Taliban ?
     
  3. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr Pending

    We should rename the GOP as the Republiban party.
     
    tonerei and wacko like this.
  4. Nick_G

    Nick_G pfm Member

    Nah. The Gilead Republicans.
     
  5. TheDecameron

    TheDecameron Unicorns fart glitter.

    President Trump is a righteous man, he has followed God’s laws and he exhorts other to lead a life of righteousness.
     
  6. kendo

    kendo Prussian bot

    President Trump is a shitehouse man, he has fallowed God's laws and he extorts others to lead a life of self-righteousness.
     
    Nick_G, James and Durmbo like this.
  7. tones

    tones Tones deaf

    I desperately hope that this WaPo essay is unduly pessimistic, but I fear that it isn't:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/09/23/robert-kagan-constitutional-crisis/

    Contrary to the title of this thread, I think Trump and his acolytes are in the ascendant. His grip on the Republican Party seems to be absolute, and I think that only ill-health will prevent him from running and winning again, courtesy of all the mechanisms the Republicans are putting in place to steal the election. This is not going to end well. Civil War, Part 2? Hopefully not.
     
  8. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    Very scary article. If Trump or a clone does get in then America probably needs another civil war IMHO. They should certainly not be allowed to turn the USA into a dictatorship built upon racism and religious fundamentalism without a fight.
     
  9. wacko

    wacko pfm Member

    ^ agreed all very plausible.
    GOP are the Trump Party and, like their leader, using every trick/lie/cheat to win 2022/24.
    Expect Putin to do anything he wants to do fairly soon...
     
  10. Ali T

    Ali T pfm Member

    Robert Heinlein might just turn out to have been right.
     
  11. Nick_G

    Nick_G pfm Member

    #CHAOS
    #DivineRepublicOfGilead
     
  12. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    My Centrist Dad views.

    1) Trump is going to be spending most of his time in the near future in various legal fights. He's also very sick. Not convinced he will end up running in 2024 and think it will be DeSantis.
    2) Trump is the perfect gift to Democrat elections. If you you cannot motivate your turnout and independents based on him there is no hope. Remember his base is not enough to get him elected.
    3) Manchin and Sinema are the immediate problem that needs to be fixed. Although I am not sure how.
    4) America needs political will and reform, not a civil war.
     
    sean99, Hook, Rob998 and 1 other person like this.
  13. russel

    russel ./_dazed_and_confused

    Yes it is a scary article but a civil war in country with many thousands of nuclear weapons is not the best way to go about solving americas problems, much as Russia and China may wish and go about fomenting
     
  14. Le Baron

    Le Baron pfm Member

    I can't read that article because of a subscription blockage, but in any case I'm sceptical that he would get elected because in the last election all his acolytes were exhorted to go out in droves to vote and he still lost. Only yesterday the seemingly endless Arizona recount finally declared that Biden had actually received more votes than even the original declaration had recorded. And the democratic vote was likely a lot more split than the Republican vote.

    With the number of disillusioned Trump voters now in evidence I think they'll start looking for a new messiah. Though anything is possible. When they fail to find a new crackpot and if Trump declares he is running, maybe they will flock to him. I wonder though if the Republican party machinery really would freely allow this person, who is now a figure of derision, to be their nominee?
     
  15. tones

    tones Tones deaf

    They have no choice, as Trump has the Republican Party totally in his grip. Some excerpts from the article:

    The United States is heading into its greatest political and constitutional crisis since the Civil War, with a reasonable chance over the next three to four years of incidents of mass violence, a breakdown of federal authority, and the division of the country into warring red and blue enclaves. The warning signs may be obscured by the distractions of politics, the pandemic, the economy and global crises, and by wishful thinking and denial. But about these things there should be no doubt:

    First, Donald Trump will be the Republican candidate for president in 2024. The hope and expectation that he would fade in visibility and influence have been delusional. He enjoys mammoth leads in the polls; he is building a massive campaign war chest; and at this moment the Democratic ticket looks vulnerable. Barring health problems, he is running.

    Second, Trump and his Republican allies are actively preparing to ensure his victory by whatever means necessary. Trump’s charges of fraud in the 2020 election are now primarily aimed at establishing the predicate to challenge future election results that do not go his way. Some Republican candidates have already begun preparing to declare fraud in 2022, just as Larry Elder tried meekly to do in the California recall contest.

    Meanwhile, the amateurish “stop the steal” efforts of 2020 have given way to an organized nationwide campaign to ensure that Trump and his supporters will have the control over state and local election officials that they lacked in 2020. Those recalcitrant Republican state officials who effectively saved the country from calamity by refusing to falsely declare fraud or to “find” more votes for Trump are being systematically removed or hounded from office. Republican legislatures are giving themselves greater control over the election certification process. As of this spring, Republicans have proposed or passed measures in at least 16 states that would shift certain election authorities from the purview of the governor, secretary of state or other executive-branch officers to the legislature. An Arizona bill flatly states that the legislature may “revoke the secretary of state’s issuance or certification of a presidential elector’s certificate of election” by a simple majority vote. Some state legislatures seek to impose criminal penalties on local election officials alleged to have committed “technical infractions,” including obstructing the view of poll watchers.
     
  16. Bob Edwards

    Bob Edwards pfm Member

    The view of US constitutional scholars is that your understanding is not correct, as Article 1, Section 8, Cl. 1 (provide for the common defense), Cl. 12 (raise and maintain armies), and Cl. 13 (provide and maintain a navy) all envision defending the country with a standing military. The Framers are understood to have envisioned maintaining a small standing army that required regular Congressional attention, hence the requirement that no appropriation for the army could be for more than 2 years; interestingly, no such limit was put in place for the navy.

    Also note the Bill of Rights, including the Second Amendment, was not ratified until 1791, three years after the Constitution was ratified.
     
  17. Le Baron

    Le Baron pfm Member

    That's certainly a real threat and there is a constitutional crisis brewing (much as there are related crises now all over the globe). This though:
    Is the only way they could achieve power, because it won't be by being elected, not like 2016. Which will unleash more than just a squabble about election tampering.
     
  18. tones

    tones Tones deaf

    Thanks for that comment, Bob, as you've no doubt realised, I'm no constitutional scholar. So, I presume that this standing army you mention is not the same thing as the "well-regulated militia" to which the Second Amendment refers. So, did the Founding Fathers envisage a small core of a standing army + "Minutemen" as needed?
     
  19. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    Such epic bad faith from Sinema.

    "However the battle over President Biden’s agenda turns out, this ugly saga will accomplish something crucial: It will separate Democrats who take their role as public servants seriously from those who are operating with such epic levels of bad faith that they are essentially insulting the intelligence of their own constituents.

    Rep. Katie Porter (D-Calif.) just delivered a sharp dressing down to Sen. Kyrsten Sinema (D-Ariz.) that neatly crystallizes this contrast. While many progressives are hammering Sinema, Porter’s broadside captures something essential about what we’re seeing from Sinema, and by extension, about the crossroads that Democrats now face."


    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2021/09/30/porter-sinema-reconciliation-msnbc/
     
  20. tones

    tones Tones deaf

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