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Party Wall Agreement

Aethelist

Aethelist

pfm Member
Anyone here have any experience of Party Wall Agreements?

Mother in Law lives in a semi and new neighbours are about to move in (after 60 years)

They've just called 'round and given her a letter saying that they intend to remove the chimney breast on the ground floor and first floor bedroom wall as well as extending the (adjoining) living room outwards and also intend knocking down a few internal walls.

They're in the building trade apparently.

Should she sign the letter? Do we need a surveyor?
 
I'd want details about what is happening to the shared chimney stack, in writing, before signing anything.

In fact, I'd not sign anything at all in such a case, ever. Signing a piece of paper to remain in your own home???????????? You MUST be joking. The logic defeats me, unless they are brazen enough to manoeuvre her into becoming responsible for any arising costs.
 
I would at least ask to find out how they intend to support the chimney Brest as otherwise the part from the roof to the loft will be just hanging there, also what about structural integrity removing internal walls, do they have approved plans?. At least go to citizens advice.
 
Did I say Breast? How naughty. Thanks for the correction there.

And Err. No Vinny. I'm not joking. TBH I've no experience of such matters , nor has the Mother in Law.

That's why I'm asking for some help.
 
Aethelist said:
Anyone here have any experience of Party Wall Agreements?

Mother in Law lives in a semi and new neighbours are about to move in (after 60 years)

They've just called 'round and given her a letter saying that they intend to remove the chimney breast on the ground floor and first floor bedroom wall as well as extending the (adjoining) living room outwards and also intend knocking down a few internal walls.

They're in the building trade apparently.

Should she sign the letter? Do we need a surveyor?
Click to expand...
WTF is it they want her to sign?
Get a copy of letter and take it to citizens advice and send it to the local council asking for advice on what building regs they must comply with and how it can be enforced.
 
They want her to sign consent to do the work because they share a wall on which major work is to take place so they need written consent. They have to give her notice at least 2 months before the work is to start which sounds like they may not be doing. I would talk to them and see how you feel about what they are planning, how they talk about it, if you're in any way not happy don't sign it. They then have to appoint a surveyor and you can either appoint theirs or appoint your own. They have to pay all costs regardless but it's not extortionate. The surveyors will then draw up a party wall agreement that legally stops them damaging your property without you having recompense and ensures the work is done to an adequate standard. It may be best to go this route as you know nothing about them. I would be doing the surveyor thing if it were me in that situation.

More info here:

Party walls and building work
 
I would get a good record of the state of your Mother's property before they start any work.

But otherwise above covers it IIRC. The RICS should be able to give a list of party wall surveyors in the area.
 
Thank s tiggers. She doesn't know them from Adam. But she did say they looked a bit "shifty"?

Obviously she doesn't want to upset her new neighbours but I don't want her to worry about anything. She's quite a frail 80 odd year old ( cancer survivor - total trooper)
 
Aethelist said:
Thank s tiggers. She doesn't know them from Adam. But she did say they looked a bit "shifty"? (she says that about everyone though tbh)

Obviously she doesn't want to upset her new neighbours but I don't want her to worry about anything. She's quite a frail 80 odd year old
Click to expand...

Sounds totally fair enough me. They shouldn't be upset and if they are that will tell you all you need to know. Maybe you can speak to them and just say you want a party wall agreement for her peace of mind. The surveyors usually act pretty quickly so it shouldn't hold things up and like I say it isn't massively expensive.
 
Have a look at the government guide here, and check that the letter they’ve given her conforms to the example included. It should offer the option of having the plans looked at by a mutually agreed surveyor, or her own, if she’s worried about the structural integrity of the building. The letter should also offer a detailed description of the planned work.

This is all quite routine and legit, I think: the letter is designed to avoid having to get professionals involved when they don’t need to be. We were in the opposite position recently and very grateful to our neighbour that she signed without making us wait or hire a surveyor.

Maybe a bit more involved here, with the chimney, so might be worth taking advice. I think they have to pay for it.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/party-wall-etc-act-1996-guidance
 
Its been a while since i have dealt with this but she can insist upon getting a party wall surveyor to do a condition survey pre and post construction at their expense and she may choose the surveyor too. If its a shared chimney breast the use of a gallows bracket arrangement would not normally be appropriate as it limits her or future owners doing the same at a later date. You would in these instances run a steel beam supported both ends on to load bearing walls picking up the stack a plate may be introduced at the base for supporting the side walls and suitable ventilation added top and bottom although the latter would not normally be an issue for a neighbour.
 
If they tend to extend and also knock down walls then its most likely that they'll also need a structural engineer to do the calculations and stipulate what steel and concrete is required in the new build. Get this wrong and part (maybe a big part) of the house might collapse.

Cheers,

DV
 
My only knowledge of such things comes from watching British remodeling TV shows like “Make My House Bigger” on Amazon Prime. But I have watched several episodes about basement dig outs and underpinning where party wall agreements were key, often taking months to figure out and get signed before work began. In each case, side neighbors hired surveyors for their own protection. This expense was always borne by the home owner doing the remodeling. The agreement should clearly define who is responsible for any costs/damage to neighbors resulting from the remodel, which seems only reasonable for homes with party walls.
 
Just to re-emphasise some of the above: get your own party wall surveyor. The other party has to pay for it and you will have the reassurance of a professional looking out for your interests.
 
Party wall agreements are actually guided by a pretty comprehensive set of simple rules; and there are pfm members of long standing here who specialise in it; let's hope one contributes ( or contacts you via PM)

OP - the key is, your MIL is under no compunction whatsoever to sign anything whatsoever, until adequately advised and and issues arising addressed to satisfaction. The route to achieve that, is written into the Act, and again, very clear *. The risks - including time to achieve any such agreement - entirely lie with the Party wanting to undertake the work.


(*even the RIBA guidance only runs to about 6 pages, and I'm no such specialist)
 
Former Party Wall surveyor here. The works described require a party structure notice to be served two months before the intended start date. The work cannot start without your mother's consent. I would normally advise against giving consent. If your mother does not reply within 14 days, dissent is presumed to arise and one or more party wall surveyors must be appointed to resolve the dispute by making a party wall award. Good suggestions above about research material and contacting the RICS.

Good luck with it all.
 
Make sure they have insurance if they are builders and ask to see the original document. Check the level of cover and any exclusions.If they aren’t suggest telling them to sling their hook. They may also just be looking to turn it around so will do the cheapest job they can get away with.
 
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