Open-Back versus Closed-Back…
- Thread starter Big Tabs
- Start date
krenzler
pfm Member
Just adding some of the work done by Sean Olive at Harman.
https://danishsoundcluster.dk/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Olive_DSD_2022.pdf
https://acousticstoday.org/he-perce...uality-what-do-listeners-prefer-sean-e-olive/
https://danishsoundcluster.dk/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/Olive_DSD_2022.pdf
https://acousticstoday.org/he-perce...uality-what-do-listeners-prefer-sean-e-olive/
i use open and closed on a regular basis.
open obviously have a more open and airy sound.
closed can be a mixed bag and the fit of the cup over the ears is more important than on closed phones.
soundstage is generally considered more accurate with open over closed.
some headphone amps / dacs also have "crossfeed" filters which can improve the soundstage of some closed headphones.
i had one of these some years ago but found myself constantly tweaking the adjustments on it rather than enjoying the music, so sold it on.
imo, you really need a good dedicated headphone amp to pair with decent headphones to get the best out of them.
most "built in" headphone amps on integrated amps, dacs etc are a bit of an "after thought"
open obviously have a more open and airy sound.
closed can be a mixed bag and the fit of the cup over the ears is more important than on closed phones.
soundstage is generally considered more accurate with open over closed.
some headphone amps / dacs also have "crossfeed" filters which can improve the soundstage of some closed headphones.
i had one of these some years ago but found myself constantly tweaking the adjustments on it rather than enjoying the music, so sold it on.
imo, you really need a good dedicated headphone amp to pair with decent headphones to get the best out of them.
most "built in" headphone amps on integrated amps, dacs etc are a bit of an "after thought"
InSides
dŵr
I would advise looking to test drive good (unfortunately meaning expensive) closed backs when comparing to open backed headphones.
I've been an open backed advocate for the past 25 years, and will never part from my HD-650s, all the way up to the "the most open-back headphones there are close to not being headphones at all, the K-1000".
But, having added the Denon AH-D7200 to the fold, two years or so back, I now see I have been missing something with closed backs. Ideally, one would own both types, in a similar style and/or price class.
Mind you - the same company may not make an equially good closed back and open back model.
I've been an open backed advocate for the past 25 years, and will never part from my HD-650s, all the way up to the "the most open-back headphones there are close to not being headphones at all, the K-1000".
But, having added the Denon AH-D7200 to the fold, two years or so back, I now see I have been missing something with closed backs. Ideally, one would own both types, in a similar style and/or price class.
Mind you - the same company may not make an equially good closed back and open back model.
Hi Guys,
If you feel that closed backs suite you need better due to Isolation requirements and such-like, then there are plenty of options available at all price points.
I just did a google for “closed back headphones” and surprise; there is no shortage of links to reviews and retailers. The choice is wide and varied amongst all price points.
Ratings.com is always a good resource.
The 6 Best Closed-Back Headphones - Winter 2023
The graphs are indicative to the final signature but because they all come of the same rig they can be relied on as pretty consistent and the results will be pretty comparable across the sample range.
Minidisc.com.au/CLOSED HEADPHONES has a pretty wide product range from all price points and while I am not recommending them they can be a good starting point for ideas if not as a retail option.
Being an Aussie, Addicted to audio is a regular Goto for me and I have used them regularly with good results. Good product range across all price points. Use for Ideas if you are not from Aussie-land and a recommendation if you are living in the land down under on the east coast of this wide brown continent.
Also don’t exclude the Bluetooth options. When used with a cable and wired to an amp both my Sennheiser Momentum 3’s (a recently retired product) and my Yamaha YH-E700A both sound pretty decent. Both units use DSP even when wired and will correct most shortcomings usually associated with closed back designs. Both of these samples can sound a little fruity in the bass regions, this is a result of the Harman tuning curve but judicious EQ can smooth out the bass. The Focal Bathys is supposed to be very good for a Bluetooth closed back as is the B&W PX8. Both are Bluetooth options with a good pedigree if you are in need something a little special but want the convenience of Bluetooth.
It's interesting to see the Sony MDR7506 come up in a few listings, I have a pair in occasional use and while I wouldn't consider them high-end, they do focus on detail, digging into the mix and telling you like it is. To my ears, for the asking coin you could do allot worse. Also; having been in production a longtime and a staple for recording studios and field recording engineers, spare parts are plentiful and will be for a long time to come.
LPSpinner.
If you feel that closed backs suite you need better due to Isolation requirements and such-like, then there are plenty of options available at all price points.
I just did a google for “closed back headphones” and surprise; there is no shortage of links to reviews and retailers. The choice is wide and varied amongst all price points.
Ratings.com is always a good resource.
The 6 Best Closed-Back Headphones - Winter 2023
The graphs are indicative to the final signature but because they all come of the same rig they can be relied on as pretty consistent and the results will be pretty comparable across the sample range.
Minidisc.com.au/CLOSED HEADPHONES has a pretty wide product range from all price points and while I am not recommending them they can be a good starting point for ideas if not as a retail option.
Being an Aussie, Addicted to audio is a regular Goto for me and I have used them regularly with good results. Good product range across all price points. Use for Ideas if you are not from Aussie-land and a recommendation if you are living in the land down under on the east coast of this wide brown continent.
Also don’t exclude the Bluetooth options. When used with a cable and wired to an amp both my Sennheiser Momentum 3’s (a recently retired product) and my Yamaha YH-E700A both sound pretty decent. Both units use DSP even when wired and will correct most shortcomings usually associated with closed back designs. Both of these samples can sound a little fruity in the bass regions, this is a result of the Harman tuning curve but judicious EQ can smooth out the bass. The Focal Bathys is supposed to be very good for a Bluetooth closed back as is the B&W PX8. Both are Bluetooth options with a good pedigree if you are in need something a little special but want the convenience of Bluetooth.
It's interesting to see the Sony MDR7506 come up in a few listings, I have a pair in occasional use and while I wouldn't consider them high-end, they do focus on detail, digging into the mix and telling you like it is. To my ears, for the asking coin you could do allot worse. Also; having been in production a longtime and a staple for recording studios and field recording engineers, spare parts are plentiful and will be for a long time to come.
LPSpinner.
Which BD's are they. THe DT770's, DT700 ProX or the uber-posh DT1770 Pro's
the Amiron Wireless Hi-Res Audio Headphone/Headset look quite nice but a bit overkill for the office... networked Mettings over Zoom or Teams will never sound as good again.
the Amiron Wireless Hi-Res Audio Headphone/Headset look quite nice but a bit overkill for the office... networked Mettings over Zoom or Teams will never sound as good again.
Which BD's are they. THe DT770's, DT700 ProX or the uber-posh DT1770 Pro's
the Amiron Wireless Hi-Res Audio Headphone/Headset look quite nice but a bit overkill for the office... networked Mettings over Zoom or Teams will never sound as good again.
700 ProX
Nice ...
The more expensive Beyerdynamic's use the same 42mm but have the driver placed forward of the earcup center and angle the driver toward the rear of the head as if to try and mimic the placement of an open field speaker. I have not heard it myself but it does sound an interesting concept.
LPSpinner.
You may also be right...
I'm also a card carrying sceptic.. allot of times completely new driver means that they could no longer source the original baffle paper that surrounds the driver so the new suppler equals a new driver design (yes; I know, I'm cynical). I think they still use the same basic driver arrangement, and that's a good thing, if it "aint-broke" don't fix it. They probably tweak the voice coil wire gauge to get a different impedance. I do know that on the 700 and 900 as well as the 1770 & 1990 they introduced an extra layer of "cover cloth" over the driver to subdue the 8 kHz "Beyer-bump" found across the 770, 880 & 990. Being an old fart (over 55) the Beyer-Bump actually works in my favour to spice up my failing top end sensitivity. I still like the 700 and 900.
It does appear however, that Beyerdynamic did address the less than perfect sizing adjustment used on the older 770, 880 and 990 models and that a good thing indeed.
If you are curious, Custom Cans does regular Videos about headphone Mods. Jason does teardowns and mods on plenty of different headphones and the Beyers appear quite often.
LPSPinner.
I'm also a card carrying sceptic.. allot of times completely new driver means that they could no longer source the original baffle paper that surrounds the driver so the new suppler equals a new driver design (yes; I know, I'm cynical
). I think they still use the same basic driver arrangement, and that's a good thing, if it "aint-broke" don't fix it. They probably tweak the voice coil wire gauge to get a different impedance. I do know that on the 700 and 900 as well as the 1770 & 1990 they introduced an extra layer of "cover cloth" over the driver to subdue the 8 kHz "Beyer-bump" found across the 770, 880 & 990. Being an old fart (over 55) the Beyer-Bump actually works in my favour to spice up my failing top end sensitivity. I still like the 700 and 900.It does appear however, that Beyerdynamic did address the less than perfect sizing adjustment used on the older 770, 880 and 990 models and that a good thing indeed.
If you are curious, Custom Cans does regular Videos about headphone Mods. Jason does teardowns and mods on plenty of different headphones and the Beyers appear quite often.
LPSPinner.
I have the BD Amiron wireless and the T5/3. The wireless have an app where you cane tune them to your hearing which actually works quite well.
I alternate the T5 with my Sennheiser HD 820 depending on what mood I’m in. The Sennheiser are very smooth, detailed and spacious for a closed back. The T5 are more in you face and forward in their presentation which I do like sometimes. I would quite happily live with any of them if I had to pick just 1.
I don’t have an EQ as imo if you have to eq, you have the wrong headphones….
I alternate the T5 with my Sennheiser HD 820 depending on what mood I’m in. The Sennheiser are very smooth, detailed and spacious for a closed back. The T5 are more in you face and forward in their presentation which I do like sometimes. I would quite happily live with any of them if I had to pick just 1.
I don’t have an EQ as imo if you have to eq, you have the wrong headphones….
agreed and preferably with your own equiptment
Caledon1297
pfm Member
Interesting - any models that you particularly liked, @PerF ?
As I don't require the obvious advantage of closed-back designs (less 'leaky'), as well of the received wisdom that open-back offered better performance, I've never tried any closed-back headphones, but now I'm wondering if that refers more to superficial Hi-Fi things (openness/air, soundstage, imaging...) rather than actual musical ability/performance?
Bourneendboy
pfm Member
I have just bought a pair of Beyerdynamic DT 700Pro X after using HD600's for the last 10 years or so. I'm really enjoying them and haven't noticed any disadvantages over open backed as yet