Oh Britain, what have you done (part ∞+3)?

[eternumviti]

...What EV says makes total sense.

Thank you Rich. That strikes up a first!

 

[eternumviti]

In which case stop blaming the EU!

Eh? Blaming the EU for what?

 

[stevec67]

I'm afraid it is, Steve. It is entirely the fault of successive generations of politicians here, in Europe and within the institutions of the EU who repeatedly refused to acknowledge the concerns of the electorates as to the style and the direction of the EU, to the progressive loss of self-determination and its replacement with top-down regulation and a sense of impotence in the face of anonymous and unnaccountable élites in the EU institutions,(etc)

It has nothing to do with me being naive about the power of the corporates and so on post-Brexit, its about what very many people actually feel. People feel as if they have no control over their destinies, that its has all been taken over by vast, remote, unaccountable organisations, amongst which are Whitehall and Westminster, the EU, the bankers and the corporates.

Eh? Blaming the EU for what?

If the top 2 quotes are not "blaming the EU" then I would like to know what is.

 

[sean99]

More Brexiteer hypocrisy

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-44313941

"Lord Lawson has been accused of hypocrisy by anti-Brexit campaigners after it emerged he is applying for a French residency card.
The Conservative peer, who chaired the Vote Leave campaign, said he had started the "tiresome" paperwork to prove he is legally resident in France."

 

[eternumviti]

If the top 2 quotes are not "blaming the EU" then I would like to know what is.

Absolutely, I do blame the EU, and I blame the EU absolutely, if not uniquely. The charge is levelled at successive generations of our own politicians too. You told me I should stop. Why?

You seem to be insinuating that I've contradicted myself somewhere, but I can't see where or what you mean.

 

[sean99]

On the matter of agricultural workers, I spoke to a farmer friend the other day - he too is finding it very difficult to hire workers. The reason for the shortage, as given by the agency he uses, has nothing to do with Brexit. It is because the rising economies in countries like Poland are now offering job opportunities and pay rates that compete with those on offer here, so there is simply no need for them to look for work elsewhere.

Your anecdote might have some truth in it (though that implies the EU is helping to improve the Polish economy).

However I feel it's more likely that the data in this link showing the precipitous fall in EU net migration following the Brexit vote is playing a larger part in the shortage. There is still a small amount of net migration from the EU to the UK but the drop is pronounced.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopula...ebrexitvotewhatschangedinsixcharts/2017-11-30

 

[eternumviti]

Your anecdote might have some truth in it....

It is indeed an anecdote, and I was completely open about the fact that it was such. Your italic accentuation of the word insinuates that I wasn't.

 

[richardg]

Thank you Rich. That strikes up a first!

If I could be arsed I could probably prove that noone in this thread has agreed with one thing a brexiteer has said, no matter how moot or sound the point.

 

[stevec67]

Stop blaming the EU"

Eh? Blaming the EU for what?

Absolutely, I do blame the EU, and I blame the EU absolutely, if not uniquely. The charge is levelled at successive generations of our own politicians too. You told me I should stop. Why?

You seem to be insinuating that I've contradicted myself somewhere, but I can't see where or what you mean.

Right there.
The top post implies that you aren't blaming the EU, the second says you do. Do you need to make your mind up?

 

[eternumviti]

More Brexiteer hypocrisy

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-44313941

"Lord Lawson has been accused of hypocrisy by anti-Brexit campaigners after it emerged he is applying for a French residency card.
The Conservative peer, who chaired the Vote Leave campaign, said he had started the "tiresome" paperwork to prove he is legally resident in France."

Looks like 'Best for Britain' trying to make hay from a bit of barren paddock to me. Lawson is a resident of France, the French authorities have told him that he needs to apply for a residency permit, he is doing so. And the apparently pro-Brexit biased BBC seems to be climbing onto the bandwagon in publishing this piece of non-news.

 

[eternumviti]

Right there.
The top post implies that you aren't blaming the EU, the second says you do. Do you need to make your mind up?

Steve, are you playing mind-games here? You posted the 'top post' - you said 'then stop blaming the EU!', not me.

Look, I know what you your are trying to do (I think). You are trying to twist something that I actually did say to represent a meaning quite different from the one intended.

Give it up, FFS

 

[stevec67]

Lawson doesn't need to apply for residency, he's British. I lived in France for 3 years and didn't need anything. I had a "Numero social" or whatever so that I could pay French tax, but other than that I was left alone. I told them I lived at my address, and they sent a bill for local residents' charges. I think that at some point they wanted to see my UK passport. It was hardly arduous.

 

[stevec67]

Steve, are you playing mind-games here? You posted the 'top post' - you said 'then stop blaming the EU!', not me.

Look, I know what you your are trying to do (I think). You are trying to twist something that I actually did say to represent a meaning quite different from the one intended.

Give it up, FFS

No, you're trying to be clever. YOU give it up FFS.

 

[eternumviti]

No, you're trying to be clever. YOU give it up FFS.

How is this referred to....a 'face in hands moment', or somesuch?

Anyway, I'm having one of those.

 

[russel]

More Brexiteer hypocrisy

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-44313941

"Lord Lawson has been accused of hypocrisy by anti-Brexit campaigners after it emerged he is applying for a French residency card.
The Conservative peer, who chaired the Vote Leave campaign, said he had started the "tiresome" paperwork to prove he is legally resident in France."

Bet he will have a house well above sea level, despite claiming global warming is a hoax.

 

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

I

If I could be arsed I could probably prove that noone in this thread has agreed with one thing a brexiteer has said, no matter how moot or sound the point.

I don’t think you could Rich, which goes to that idea that we see what we want to see.

 

[TheDecameron]

Lawson doesn't need to apply for residency, he's British. I lived in France for 3 years and didn't need anything. I had a "Numero social" or whatever so that I could pay French tax, but other than that I was left alone. I told them I lived at my address, and they sent a bill for local residents' charges. I think that at some point they wanted to see my UK passport. It was hardly arduous.

After Brexit they should kick him out- as a matter of principle.

 

[richardg]

I

I don’t think you could Rich, which goes to that idea that we see what we want to see.

lol....another one for the tally.

 

[stephen bennett]

Looks like 'Best for Britain' trying to make hay from a bit of barren paddock to me. Lawson is a resident of France, the French authorities have told him that he needs to apply for a residency permit, he is doing so. And the apparently pro-Brexit biased BBC seems to be climbing onto the bandwagon in publishing this piece of non-news.

It was first published in that rabidly Europhile publication the Daily Express.

Stephen

 

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

lol....another one for the tally.

I think if you were to ask EV, you'd find that I've agreed with things he's said (though I may not have agreed with the conclusion he drew), as have others here. EV is generally acknowledged to be the poster here who expresses the most cogent pro-Brexit arguments, and this has been recognised many, many times. If you don't see that, not my problem.