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Naim Solstice officially unveiled . . .

It fascinates me how some people react to criticism of certain hallowed brands yet anything manufactured under the IAG badge is fair game and a seemingly valid target, Chi-Fi etc etc
 
For someone with so little interest in Naim you sure post a lot on Naim threads.

Maybe start some threads of your own concerning stuff you are interested in?
 
Had naim & still have an LP12, don’t feel the need to slag off either. I think the fad for super expensive TTs doesn’t make sense (to me anyway). I think I am a digital convert.
 
It fascinates me how some people react to criticism of certain hallowed brands yet anything manufactured under the IAG badge is fair game and a seemingly valid target, Chi-Fi etc etc

Perhaps it gets their back up to be criticised for the choice they made or the realisation that they were conned by 'their dealer' with endless 'upgrade paths' , who knows??:confused::rolleyes: there is definitely some brands that have devotees bordering on a Religious belief and get very defensive when any criticism is offered, laughable really :p:D
 
Hell hath no fury like a Naimee scorned.
Bit of a silly comment frankly. It’s the disproportionate level of responses in a Naim thread compared to other brands that is bewildering. The other day someone posted a thread about transformer hum on some brand of amp (I forget which one) and there followed a couple of pages of helpful advice. Spin time back a couple of months and there was a thread about transformer hum on a Naim power amp and there were 10 pages mainly of people slagging the brand off. Hmmmmmm
 
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Bit if a silly comment frankly. It’s the disproportionate level of responses in a Naim thread compared to other brands that is bewildering. The other day someone posted a thread about transformer hum on some brand of amp (I forget which one) and there followed a couple of pages of helpful advice. Spin time back a couple of months and there was a thread about transformer hum on a Naim power amp and there were 10 pages mainly of people slagging the brand off. Hmmmmmm
Sorry.It was a bit silly but then other posts were silly and ill informed.
 
I have owned Naim for about 14 years and have loved every minute of it! During that time, I’ve demoed plenty of competitive products, but Naim has stayed. Over time, I went from a Nait XS up to my current 552/300. Enjoyed each upgrade, and remain convinced that the performance improvements I heard at each step were worth it…to me. Also can’t complain about their reliability, service, or support. My Naim dealer is a real gent. Have never had a bad experience. So maybe I am just really lucky, or maybe, just maybe, Naim builds really good stuff and the vast majority of their customers have had similar experiences to me. Can’t say for sure, but suspect the latter is true.

On the question of VFM, I agree that Naim sucks. But guess what? That statement applies equally to just about every other name brand manufacturer of high quality audio gear. It’s the price we pay for wanting to own something that is manufactured in small numbers. Nothing wrong with owning only a mass-produced Bluetooth speaker. There are lots of ways to enjoy music.

On the question of why some feel the need to continually slag off Naim and Linn, well, I just don’t get it. I get not liking either brand, and I get preferring something else. I like IOS better than Android, but I would never jump on an Android thread just to be negative. Seems like a total waste of effort to me, but I guess we are all free to choose how we spend our time and energy.
 
I have owned Naim for about 14 years and have loved every minute of it! During that time, I’ve demoed plenty of competitive products, but Naim has stayed. Over time, I went from a Nait XS up to my current 552/300. Enjoyed each upgrade, and remain convinced that the performance improvements I heard at each step were worth it…to me. Also can’t complain about their reliability, service, or support. My Naim dealer is a real gent. Have never had a bad experience. So maybe I am just really lucky, or maybe, just maybe, Naim builds really good stuff and the vast majority of their customers have had similar experiences to me. Can’t say for sure, but suspect the latter is true.

On the question of VFM, I agree that Naim sucks. But guess what? That statement applies equally to just about every other name brand manufacturer of high quality audio gear. It’s the price we pay for wanting to own something that is manufactured in small numbers. Nothing wrong with owning only a mass-produced Bluetooth speaker. There are lots of ways to enjoy music.

On the question of why some feel the need to continually slag off Naim and Linn, well, I just don’t get it. I get not liking either brand, and I get preferring something else. I like IOS better than Android, but I would never jump on an Android thread just to be negative. Seems like a total waste of effort to me, but I guess we are all free to choose how we spend our time and energy.

I kind of wonder why. Though I’ve been a member for a few years, I’m not privy to the
the deeper history of Naim discussions. Having visited the Naim forum when I owned Naim I was struck by the often overly precious evangelising and sermonising behaviours of some members on that forum and it seems that it continues today from some discussions on here. Perhaps this is a legacy and threads are fraught with tension because of this? I don’t know. As I said, I have owned Naim and enjoyed some of its attributes but for me it is overpriced and I felt uneasy about the upgrade path. It is what I would term as mid end hifi. If I were using a car analogy I would choose a modern Skoda. Not quite a Merc or BMW but certainly no Porsche. And that’s not being unkind or provocative for those who remember the original Skoda. Skoda now are well built, well engineered and perform above expectations. Porsche are the pinnacle of mainstream cars and you would expect that a that a tyre replacement would cost £5-600. But in a Skoda you wouldn’t expect this. I would expect Naim servicing to be exemplary as the brand relies heavily on its legacy and longevity though I hear stories on here of dissatisfaction and queries from Naim owner which betrays an unsettlement of a kind. I may be wrong, I may be way off beam but I suspect that these may be some of the issues that underpin the discussions and some of the the perceived tension?
 
On the question of why some feel the need to continually slag off Naim and Linn, well, I just don’t get it.

I think there are a few reasons for it. Personally, I feel that the way Linn and Naim have marketed and promoted their products is borderline dishonest and certainly manipulative. I try to point this out to even up the playing field a bit. If people want to buy Naim, or any other brand, it's a free country and I don't care but I would at least like them to go in with their eyes open and understanding that there are cheaper alternatives.

Both Linn and Naim are targeting lifestyle buyers these days. Just like Rolex re-positioned itself in the marketplace using advertising and product placement, Linn and Naim want to be hi-end brands bought by the well heeled who value perceived quality and social status over actual performance. I care about the music and value so I don't respect that. I want people to have great sounding music and systems which are satisfying, not get suckered into a never ending cycle of dissatisfaction, frustration and expensive upgrading.

And you need to understand that the latter situation is exactly what Linn, Naim and their dealers want. They pretend otherwise but it's a lie. If you are genuinely satisfied with a product, you don't change it. Customer satisfaction is of no use to a Hi-Fi dealer.
 
I think there are a few reasons for it. Personally, I feel that the way Linn and Naim have marketed and promoted their products is borderline dishonest and certainly manipulative. I try to point this out to even up the playing field a bit. If people want to buy Naim, or any other brand, it's a free country and I don't care but I would at least like them to go in with their eyes open and understanding that there are cheaper alternatives.

Both Linn and Naim are targeting lifestyle buyers these days. Just like Rolex re-positioned itself in the marketplace using advertising and product placement, Linn and Naim want to be hi-end brands bought by the well heeled who value perceived quality and social status over actual performance. I care about the music and value so I don't respect that. I want people to have great sounding music and systems which are satisfying, not get suckered into a never ending cycle of dissatisfaction, frustration and expensive upgrading.

And you need to understand that the latter situation is exactly what Linn, Naim and their dealers want. They pretend otherwise but it's a lie. If you are genuinely satisfied with a product, you don't change it. Customer satisfaction is of no use to a Hi-Fi dealer.

Oh, I do get it. You have said many times that you are on a mission to save all of us "suckers" from these two evil hi-fi manufacturers and dealers.

Look, I get that Naim isn't the same company that Julian founded anymore. As much as I enjoyed the legend and lore of the early years, I am convinced that without change, the company would have ceased trading many years ago. Have already commented on VFM - it doesn't exist anymore. But most of their so-called "lifestyle" products are affordable. They have kept the brand alive, and allowed for continuing most of the classic lines (with occasional upgrades) and maintaining a quality service org. Had they discontinued all of their legacy products and service offerings, then IMO maybe your "lifestyle" criticism would have more teeth.

Sorry, but in my view, you are merely (repeatedly) expressing your own personal experience and bias, and nothing more. Just like the rest of us, it is simply how you choose to spend your energy here. Good luck with that.
 
I kind of wonder why. Though I’ve been a member for a few years, I’m not privy to the
the deeper history of Naim discussions. Having visited the Naim forum when I owned Naim I was struck by the often overly precious evangelising and sermonising behaviours of some members on that forum and it seems that it continues today from some discussions on here. Perhaps this is a legacy and threads are fraught with tension because of this? I don’t know. As I said, I have owned Naim and enjoyed some of its attributes but for me it is overpriced and I felt uneasy about the upgrade path. It is what I would term as mid end hifi. If I were using a car analogy I would choose a modern Skoda. Not quite a Merc or BMW but certainly no Porsche. And that’s not being unkind or provocative for those who remember the original Skoda. Skoda now are well built, well engineered and perform above expectations. Porsche are the pinnacle of mainstream cars and you would expect that a that a tyre replacement would cost £5-600. But in a Skoda you wouldn’t expect this. I would expect Naim servicing to be exemplary as the brand relies heavily on its legacy and longevity though I hear stories on here of dissatisfaction and queries from Naim owner which betrays an unsettlement of a kind. I may be wrong, I may be way off beam but I suspect that these may be some of the issues that underpin the discussions and some of the the perceived tension?

We always hear stories of dissatisfaction. When someone is pissed off, it gives them some minor temporary satisfaction to rant about it. We've all done it.

Even the best manufacturers/distributors/dealers can screw up once in a while. I judge them by how they handle their mistakes. In my case, the one single hardware problem (noise from a SuperLine) I had in 14 years was fixed quickly, without question, and at no cost even though it was outside the warranty period. Am sure it helped that I had emailed a suspicion a couple of weeks before that end date, but it was very intermittent, and I could not be sure where in the chain the problem was without testing (and patiently waiting for it to return).

Again, am I the only one who was lucky enough to receive good service? Doubt it. So the question I've asked is: are these negative posters the norm, or are they merely a very vocal minority? Seems to me it is the same few posters here saying the exact same thing, over and over. As I said, it's their choice to do so, and it is everyone else's choice whether or not they bother to take notice.
 
I have two dealers near me who stock naim, one who stocks Linn & Naim. Really like them both & always had honest advice from them. Most recent experience was when I went to listen to a Rega P10, he basically advised me to stick with what I had as I have a brilliant TT already.

I probably will do Kore/Karousel at some point but I wasn’t pressured into doing so in any way. Each to their own & I am sure there are some bad apples out there but I don’t think this is down to naim & linn.

If I had the money/inclination I would possibly look at a Linn or DCS digital front end. I do think some are guilty or gullible & project their own anxieties upon certain brands. I had a naim system unchanged for about 15 years & not touched my TT for more than that. According to some I should be deeply unhappy?
 
Sorry, but in my view, you are merely (repeatedly) expressing your own personal experience and bias, and nothing more.

Isn't that what everybody does? Why isn't that ok? I assume you think it is ok for Naim fans to repeatedly suggest that every expression of dissatisfaction with Naim products be addressed by buying more of it?

I'm not sure what you mean about maintaining legacy products and being affordable. Have to looked at their product lineup and price list recently? The cheapest pre-amp is £5,300. Cheapest power-amp is £4,300, nothing below the 250 anymore. A hi-cap is £1,600. Really? A transformer in a box.

Kept the brand alive? Bullshit! Milking the reputation of the brand for every penny more like. Do you think JV would approve of this? Shareholders just out to make money? And if you think JV would not approve, and I don't think he would, why is it wrong for me to not approve?
 
Isn't that what everybody does? Why isn't that ok? I assume you think it is ok for Naim fans to repeatedly suggest that every expression of dissatisfaction with Naim products be addressed by buying more of it?

I'm not sure what you mean about maintaining legacy products and being affordable. Have to looked at their product lineup and price list recently? The cheapest pre-amp is £5,300. Cheapest power-amp is £4,300, nothing below the 250 anymore. A hi-cap is £1,600. Really? A transformer in a box.

Kept the brand alive? Bullshit! Milking the reputation of the brand for every penny more like. Do you think JV would approve of this? Shareholders just out to make money? And if you think JV would not approve, and I don't think he would, why is it wrong for me to not approve?

The Muso and Uniti lines are affordable compared to their direct completion. The volume sales of these products are what allows Naim to continue supporting the considerably less affordable and lower volume Classic and Statement lines. Was that more clear?

As far as JV, why would you assume that his views wouldn’t have changed over time? Appreciate the history, but TBH, what JV’s ghost might or might not think is utterly irrelevant. Had he lived, maybe he would have decided to close the doors. Who knows?

And no, not everybody posts their bias ad nauseum like you do.
 
The Muso and Uniti lines are affordable compared to their direct completion. The volume sales of these products are what allows Naim to continue supporting the considerably less affordable and lower volume Classic and Statement lines.

None of that makes sense to me, sorry.

And it's too bad if you don't like my opinion, I really don't care. Live with it.
 
Kept the brand alive? Bullshit! Milking the reputation of the brand for every penny more like. Do you think JV would approve of this? Shareholders just out to make money? And if you think JV would not approve, and I don't think he would, why is it wrong for me to not approve?
Julian was a pretty astute businessman. He'd approve of whatever it took to keep the company profitable. If the current management get the market wrong then Naim will go bust, but for the time being they seem to be surviving well in a difficult market. One thing's certain - just trying to market to the rapidly shrinking numbers of old hi-fi farts is a recipe for commercial disaster.
 
None of that makes sense to me, sorry.

And it's too bad if you don't like my opinion, I really don't care. Live with it.

So when someone finds your arguments less than persuasive, you resort to petulance. How very mature.

Feel free to have the last word. I will not be reading or replying to any more of your rants going forward.
 


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