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Met police to hand in weapons and stop killing black Britons

Seeker_UK said:
I would say it's a small (*) part of a bigger issue around how the police deals with parts of the population with certain protected characteristics, which it seems this thread is migrating to anyway.

(*) clearly not for those who have lost a loved one from such an incident.
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Yes that’s the context required to make sense of the figures IMO. Fatal police shootings are just the most dramatic kind of uh police-adjacent deaths, and many such deaths are symptomatic of more general forms of police violence and racism.
 
Ponty said:
No, that’s your interpretation. We simply don’t know the full facts.
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What does “no smoke without fire” mean? That’s your interpretation of the facts. It is literally an innuendo and a very crude one at that.
 
Seanm said:
Yes that’s the context required to make sense of the figures IMO. Fatal police shootings are just the most dramatic kind of uh police-adjacent deaths, and many such deaths are symptomatic of more general forms of police violence and racism.
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Assuming you choose to live in the UK, why? You really don’t seem to like it or have much good to say about it.
 
Ponty said:
Good God, it’s a genuine question. Thanks for the additional, now deleted comment, very becoming. Think I’ll leave you to your imagination. Best of luck.
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It's where Tories always end up, in a pinch: if you don't like it go back to your own country.

I did think better of my initial post, but not because it didn't reflect my feelings on the matter.
 
droodzilla said:
And, just like that, you switch to, "If you don't like it here, leave!". Proper fash response to the legitimate questioning of authority.
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No, I didn’t, you choose to twist it that way. It was a genuine question. If I chose to live in say, Italy, and spent the whole time slagging it off, many would find it puzzling at to why I’d want to live there. Irrelevant now, I’m not interested in an answer as the party concerned cannot engage with civility.
 
But aren't you often having a pop at things you don't like about the UK; benefit scroungers, people over-stretching themselves on credit and, just today, corrupt police in Liverpool?

Having a good old whinge about things is a fine old British tradition, probably dating back to Saxon times.
 
Joe Hutch said:
But aren't you often having a pop at things you don't like about the UK; benefit scroungers, people over-stretching themselves on credit and, just today, corrupt police in Liverpool?

Having a good old whinge about things is a fine old British tradition, probably dating back to Saxon times.
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To correct you, I’m certainly not saying police in Liverpool are corrupt, I’m suggesting there seems to be a strong criminal fraternity.

I’ve said many times, on balance the UK is the best country in the world and I wouldn’t choose to live anywhere else.
 
Ponty said:
No, I didn’t, you choose to twist it that way. It was a genuine question. If I chose to live in say, Italy, and spent the whole time slagging it off, many would find it puzzling at to why I’d want to live there. Irrelevant now, I’m not interested in an answer as the party concerned cannot engage with civility.
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Well I guess for most folk here it's the country of their birth, where their family is, where their employment is, where they feel their home is for better or worse.

Then there's also the fact that post Brexit the choice to live elsewhere in Europe has effectively been removed for many of us.

But aside from all that, asking whether people really like the UK just because they are critical of policing seems a bit daft tbh.

I lived in Japan for two years and adored it - like seriously head over heels in love with the place - but it would be a bit odd if I didn't also recognise that it's a society with some very serious problems and has a long way to go on things like sexual equality and LGBTQ rights.
 
Ponty said:
No, I didn’t, you choose to twist it that way. It was a genuine question. If I chose to live in say, Italy, and spent the whole time slagging it off, many would find it puzzling at to why I’d want to live there. Irrelevant now, I’m not interested in an answer as the party concerned cannot engage with civility.
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You seem to struggle with the concept of civility in the same way you do the idea of innuendo. Whether or not the question was genuine or not it wasn’t civil. To respond to a criticism of the police with a suggestion that I might choose to live elsewhere assumes rootlessness on my part, a difference from others, and reduced right to participate in questions like this. You wouldn’t say it to an English member any more than it would occur to you to ask an Italian why he lived in Italy, if he happened to object to Italian police violence.

Hope this helps. It’s an objectively racist (uncivil, if you prefer) thing to say, in the same way as “no smoke without fire” is objectively an innuendo.

Born and bred in the U.K. by the way. If this answers your genuine question you might want to ask yourself why.
 
I doubt that many people are unreservedly supportive of their own country, however much they like it, and even if they would never want to live anywhere else. Indeed, I would say that only extreme nationalists and fascists would never have anything bad to say about their home country.
 
Joe Hutch said:
I doubt that many people are unreservedly supportive of their own country, however much they like it, and even if they would never want to live anywhere else. Indeed, I would say that only extreme nationalists and fascists would never have anything bad to say about their home country.
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The whole thing of interpreting a criticism of the police as a criticism of *the country* - it’s either coming from a place of extreme nationalism or of racism. I can’t see any other options.
 
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