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MDAC first listen (part XII)

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sq225917

Bit of this, bit of that
re mdac vs Linn DS, sure you send them the same signal but that doesn't mean their output stages are set to give the same nominal value for any input signal, one could be set at 2v max and the other 2.2v max output.


With a product as successful as the mdac and especially one for which the designer is so easy to reach on the internet you are bound to get all sorts of responses and queries. Some of these will align with the majority and some of course will not. If one doesn't like a poster it is simple enough to put them on your ignore list if you think they add nothing of value.

I'm personally very thankful that John continues to develop for the Mdac and offers service on it above and beyond what IAG care to offer. I understand that he's useless with deadlines, but I also understand that he is very self deprecating when it comes to the quality of his designs. So what might be 'It should sound better' coming from John would be 'it's the biggest jump in sound quality in the history of hifi' were it coming from someone like Ash at AVI. ;-)
 
Good. Well let's hope that me highlighting this issue with nerlei will help you get your unit back sooner than six months.

This is exactly the type of post that has kept me off pfm for while.

If you like the MDAC or not it is really good that the designer engages on this forum with a genuine sense of help, he is doing it for the love of his job and to ensure customers are happy.

If the customer is happy getting it back after 6 months, as I'm sure he will, then it's job done.

Criticism of what people do and how they listen is a growing concern for me on pfm.
 
John once stated that he'll build up a support center in the Czech Republic once they start selling products. You can't pay people if you don't earn money.

Sure. I wasn't suggesting otherwise. The German retailer mod that JohnW posted details of is the model I was thinking of. JohnW would give them instructions on upgrades and we would pay these guys to perform the upgrades. Although I'm very grateful that JohnW has offered to do the work for free, I'm happy to pay for the work - especially if it means a faster turnaround.
 
My problem with dead left channel on my M-DAC reappeared again after having done the firmware check (v.099/v.0.97).

Tried the headphone test without luck, upgraded to version vA.08 also without luck.

Appreciate advices.
 
Although the headphone trick can help with a stuck relay the effects are often only temporarily. I'm afraid your MDAC needs some service.
 
I'm not sure I agree with you, anyway the M-DAC worked fine straight out of the box (arrived wednesday this week) and I really like the sound signature so far.

The pattern I've seen is that as soon as I do a power on while pressing a button simultaneously (Sel Up/Down, Volume) the problem appears.
 
Sure. I wasn't suggesting otherwise. The German retailer mod that JohnW posted details of is the model I was thinking of. JohnW would give them instructions on upgrades and we would pay these guys to perform the upgrades. Although I'm very grateful that JohnW has offered to do the work for free, I'm happy to pay for the work - especially if it means a faster turnaround.

May I ask where you live? It must be very convenient for you if this German retailer would perform future upgrades.

John wants to sell his new product range via direct marketing. That way he can get rid of all the third parties who are making things more complicate. As a result he can offer his products at a much lower price. Additionally John has already proven that his support is excellent, even with limited ressources.

As a service in return many PFM users are happy if they can help John testing new beta firmwares. To me it is the same with this mainboard upgrade. It'll be part of the MPAX and I'm sure John appreciates the feedback he gets in return.

It's a way of thanking John for incorporating so many user whishes into the MPAX design (HT bypass, stepped attenuator option, ...). Now the MPAX perfectly fits my needs.

Edit: Nevertheless, being an audiofool through and through, I always enjoy an improvement to my system :)

Michael
 
Stuck relay trick #2 to add to our toolbox besides the Headphone trick:

Power off M-DAC, remove power supply. Wait for (at least I did) some 30 mins, both channels alive and well.
 
I can live with this since It'll be turned on most of the time and I have a fix if it occurs again.
 
Stuck relay trick #2 to add to our toolbox besides the Headphone trick:

Power off M-DAC, remove power supply. Wait for (at least I did) some 30 mins, both channels alive and well.

Hi - Did I just hear that your MDAC is new and you only just received this week?!
 
My intention and hope by joining this forum, is that we by having a positive, creative, supportive attitude share experiences on how to develop and enjoy music through this component.
 
You know somehow I just can't see me sending a device as complicated as the Mdac off for 'upgrades' to a third party who know nothing about the actual parameters of the design. At least not when the designer is offering to do them for free. Though I'm sure it's a great way to drum up business for your fledgling German mods business... ;-)
 
May I ask where you live? It must be very convenient for you if this German retailer would perform future upgrades.

John wants to sell his new product range via direct marketing. That way he can get rid of all the third parties who are making things more complicate. As a result he can offer his products at a much lower price. Additionally John has already proven that his support is excellent, even with limited ressources.

As a service in return many PFM users are happy if they can help John testing new beta firmwares. To me it is the same with this mainboard upgrade. It'll be part of the MPAX and I'm sure John appreciates the feedback he gets in return.

It's a way of thanking John for incorporating so many user whishes into the MPAX design (HT bypass, stepped attenuator option, ...). Now the MPAX perfectly fits my needs.

Michael

In the UK. I was originally thinking that, like what the German guys are doing, I could buy my new M-DAC through a UK retailer, pre-modded rather than having to send it back and forth to JohnW. I mentioned that idea to JohnW on this forum a while ago. He said he liked the principle and would look into it.

As for your comments re. John's business selling Lakewest, that is entirely another issue and I was not suggesting that he sells these products through a retailer. I was only talking about modifications to the M-DAC motherboard or potentially sourcing a third-party PSU that I could use (possibly modded to be compatible with the M-DAC) that would be available sooner than the M-PAX (which is more than just a PSU).

Note that the upgrade for the M-PAX comprises of two parts: the "Sovereign" upgrade; and then a further daughter card which potentially we could add ourselves (assuming we can get the screws out!). Some may not feel comfortable doing that themselves.

As for the rest of your comments. That's all fine and I have no issue with it.

To be clear, it appears to me that the M-DAC is a good technical design. The manufacturers wanted to sell it at high volume and therefore wanted to keep costs low - naturally making compromises in order to do so.

It appears to me that from a SQ point of view the M-DAC competes with products that are far more expensive. If M-DAC didn't exist I'd have spent far more on a DAC. I therefore have no problem with the concept of buying the M-DAC and having it upgraded to be more reliable and to have a better SQ - and to pay for that. To me, that could still represent value for money.

All I have done is asked whether that is possible and mentioned potential aspects that I would be interested in. This was in response to JohnW posting details of what the German retailers are doing. Again, that was JohnW's posting, not mine. Those guys are performing a specific, non-approved upgrade. I simply asked whether it might be an idea (I simply asked JohnW for his views) to get these guys to also do JohnW's M-DAC motherboard upgrades and maybe one or two others he recommends. I didn't say anything about the retailers being involved in Lakewest products.

Maybe JohnW would even get a commission for each upgrade. I'm happy to pay and I'm happy to provide feedback - it's in my interest anyway for future products. I don't need someone to do something for free for me first.

I just don't like the idea of possibly losing my hi-fi for six-month stretches, nor shipping things back and forth with inadequate insurance.

Furthermore, the less time JohnW spends doing soldering for us (for free) the more time he can spend finishing the new products such as MPAX and MAMP (for sale). He gets money, we get new products.

It's both amusing and disturbing that so many people on this forum (I'm not saying you) take issue with me asking about paying someone to do upgrades.
 
My intention and hope by joining this forum, is that we by having a positive, creative, supportive attitude share experiences on how to develop and enjoy music through this component.

Was your reply in response to mine? I was just simply looking to confirm when you had received your MDAC. The reason I ask, is that I am about to send mine back for a third one and wanted to confirm that there are still potential issues even with the more current batches. Thanks.
 
Was your reply in response to mine? I was just simply looking to confirm when you had received your MDAC. The reason I ask, is that I am about to send mine back for a third one and wanted to confirm that there are still potential issues even with the more current batches. Thanks.

Vinbob.

Just out of interest, what problems have you experienced and did your retailer swap you with a new one each time or did you have to get the previous one repaired?
 
@VinBob and whoever:
I received my unit, as stated previously, Wednesday 2012-08-29 ~17:00 CET, I was aware of some quirks in the component before ordering. No probs, resolved by assistance of fellow PFM's and some own skills. As of now, in the comparison state with the Audio-Gd Ref 5, I'm leaning towards one of the other ...

/Rgds
Lars
 
Vinbob.

Just out of interest, what problems have you experienced and did your retailer swap you with a new one each time or did you have to get the previous one repaired?

Hi ether,

I had the relay problem with the first one where the right channel would cut out - it was eventually swapped out with a new one after the next shipment arrived in mid February. The replacement now has the Crystal issue which will go back to IAG via the dealer.

The dealer will get a new replacement from IAG and provide me with a new one - however, my fear is how long will the new one last...?! Thats what worries me and as much as I hate to go down another route, I am thinking this may be my best course of action as I don't want to have to deal with another issue again in a few months from now and have to deal with the whole shipping and time in not being able to listen to my music...
 
Which is why we are all awaiting with bated breath for Lakewest products, at least there won't be any issues WRT component quality.
 
The dealer will get a new replacement from IAG and provide me with a new one - however, my fear is how long will the new one last...?! Thats what worries me and as much as I hate to go down another route, I am thinking this may be my best course of action as I don't want to have to deal with another issue again in a few months from now and have to deal with the whole shipping and time in not being able to listen to my music...

Shush. Careful what you say. That's blasphemous don't you know. The zealots will rush you from the hills.

I have the same concern as you. It's hard to know whether there is a reliability problem or not. There's been quite a few reports on PFM but naturally we'd only hear of the problems, not when one works as expected. Perhaps you were just particularly unlucky.

If you decided to ask for a refund, what would you buy instead? Item Audio has quite a range (including the M-DAC) and offers a home loaner programme by which they'll send you the devices; you just pay for carriage.
 
Which is why we are all awaiting with bated breath for Lakewest products, at least there won't be any issues WRT component quality.

I'm sure you're right, but don't forget that both the MAMP and MPAX rely on the MDAC. If that goes, the whole lot goes. I believe the same for MTRAN.
 
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