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MacBook Pro cross-border UK:EU warranty issue

jtrade

pfm Member
Just over 2 years ago, my sister, who lives in the UK, gave my daughter, presently at film school in Denmark, a new MacBook Pro, purchased from the UK Apple Online Store & delivered to my sister's home near Chichester. The screen started to fail a few weeks ago and today failed completely.

Apple are very clear & straightforward about their UK warranty position : https://www.apple.com/uk/legal/statutory-warranty/ . The issue is that the MacBook is in Denmark & that there are no Apple Retail Stores in Denmark, not even in Copenhagen (which in any event is a 4 hr bus ride away). I have spoken twice at length with Apple UK and my daughter has spoken with an Apple UK technician who, after various tests (a week or so ago, before complete screen failure), has confirmed that it appears to be a hardware fault and that a mail-in box can be sent to the UK invoice address.

The problem is that Apple expect the mail-in box to be picked up by their carrier within 24 hours or so of delivery - many customers literally pack it up while the courier waits. There is no time to send the darned thing to Denmark and back to the UK & Apple will not send it direct to Denmark.

As I want Apple to repair the MacBook at their expense - it could be expensive if a replacement screen is required - I want Apple UK to handle it, as I am experienced in persuading suppliers to honour their obligations under UK consumer law. So probably I will have to ask my daughter to carefully pack the machine and send it to Chichester and then onwards to Apple.

My question - sorry for the lengthy introduction - is this : does anyone know if I get my daughter to arrange & pay for the repair via Apple Online in Denmark, is it then possible to make a valid claim to recover the amount against Apple UK ? On the phone at least, the Apple representative agreed without hesitation that a screen failure in just over 2 years should be covered under UK consumer protection laws.

Unless anyone has had experience of such a claim being successful, I think the safest, if very inconvenient, route is to get the MacBook back to the UK pronto. Google has not yielded the info I seek &, btw, I am in The Netherlands.
 
My mid 2015 MacBook Pro screen was replaced by Apple (Braehead Apple Store) in 2018 outside of the three years applecare warranty, they replaced it FOC however the invoice cost was £560 or thereabouts.

I think that you would have a hard time getting Apple to pay that amount if the work was done by a third party even another Apple store outside of the UK.

I think if you have AppleCare you can send the laptop to any Apple store for replacement or repair, that used to be the case with iPhones at least.

I think the current coronavirus situation may complicate things though as in staff shortages/stores closed.
 
@Derek Wright (or other knowledgeable person) did you use the English Small Claims Court or the European Small Claims Procedure, please ? If the latter, I have to get the process started this week, pre-Brexit changes (looooong story short, the MacBook is being repaired here in NL this week by an Apple Approved Repair Centre for just under €900). I'm assuming we need to use the European version as when you buy from Apple Online in the UK, as my sister did, you are in fact buying from Apple Distribution International Ltd in Cork, Ireland.
 
Who's paying the €900 OP? Presumably not Apple, is the MBP even worth repairing at the cost of the repair?
 
A refurbed/guaranteed 2018 MBP to the same spec is around €1700, so yes, it's prob worth it*. I have spent several hours on the phone with Apple and, whilst always friendly and professional, they appear to have changed their policy concerning claims under UK consumer law : they now say (they did not say this in October) that the problem must be reported within the first 2 years, even if it did not make the product unusable till up to 6. Clearly ludicrous. My difficulty, apart from being in The Netherlands whereas my sister, who has the contract with Apple, is near Chichester, is that if a European Small Claim is to be made out of England, it must be received by Thursday this week. It seems UK courts are closed today, open tomorrow, so I will call the nearest (Worthing, I think, as Chichester Courts appear to no longer exist) in the morning....

* well, it's definitely worth it if Apple end up paying.
 
A refurbed/guaranteed 2018 MBP to the same spec is around €1700, so yes, it's prob worth it*. I have spent several hours on the phone with Apple and, whilst always friendly and professional, they appear to have changed their policy concerning claims under UK consumer law : they now say (they did not say this in October) that the problem must be reported within the first 2 years, even if it did not make the product unusable till up to 6. Clearly ludicrous. My difficulty, apart from being in The Netherlands whereas my sister, who has the contract with Apple, is near Chichester, is that if a European Small Claim is to be made out of England, it must be received by Thursday this week. It seems UK courts are closed today, open tomorrow, so I will call the nearest (Worthing, I think, as Chichester Courts appear to no longer exist) in the morning....

* well, it's definitely worth it if Apple end up paying.

Can your sister not take Apple to court via Moneyclaim (think that's what it's called)?

We don't have that here in Scotland we have to go through the small claims court which is useless and not worth the hassle frankly but the moneyclaim thing in England seems to work very well and it can all be done on-line at low cost, you should also check out www.moneysaving expert.com which is a great site for all things consumer related.

https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/web/mcol/welcome
 
Did I use the English Small Claims Court - No I did not.

First I spoke to the selling and repairing company, they did not know of the Apple web site re repairs. After a 10 minute discussion with the repair organisation they still were disagreeing with my request for the cash back, they redirected me to Apple, I spoke to the first Apple person (the filter person) who redirected me to the person who could make decisions. He listened and agreed with me, he contacted the English company who then refunded me the repair costs. No hassle just a matter of time and process to get to the person who knew English law and could make decisions.
 
There is no "Apple UK" or "Apple Denmark" in the sense that you're implying. For repairs, you are dealing with Apple Europe, and the people you spoke with are probably all based in Ireland anyway.

The situation you're in is very common for business purchasers, so there are already mechanisms in place to help you : you just have to ask properly. My experiences with Apple repairs have been reasonably good, but as ever, you get a long way by being polite, patient and friendly.

One you've secured a repair order from the agent, just ask for repair collection to be carried out in Denmark, either by mailback box or to an Apple Premium reseller there. I think the repairs are done in Ireland or the Netherlands anyway, so being picked up in UK versus Denmark doesn't matter much. Whatever happens, be prepared for the repaired item to be sent back to the original invoice address, not to Denmark.
 
Am I missing something, just send it to your sister to deal with, she's in UK, she purchased it. There's no other mechanism
 
Am I missing something, just send it to your sister to deal with, she's in UK, she purchased it. There's no other mechanism

Rather a lot, actually, but thanks for trying :rolleyes:

... and thanks for all your replies. Although it probably doesn't seem like it, I am experienced with UK litigation and contract law itself and in addition to commercial litigation have succeeded in all 10 or so Small Claims actions I have used over the last 40 or so years. The key to success is invariably submitting the claim correctly and described clearly & convincingly, referring to exactly the correct part of the applicable law.

If Apple UK Ltd existed and/or had supplied the MacBook to my sister, it would be an entirely straightforward "not fit for purpose" claim, as it is reasonable to expect a high-end laptop to operate without hardware issues for more than 2.5 years. However, although the "Apple UK online buying experience" (my words) leads you to think you are buying from Apple UK, you are not, you are buying from Apple in Ireland, as I mentioned in my first post today. So, you have to claim against the party with which you have a contract & by far the easiest way to do this is to use the European Small Claims procedure, which allows a claim for a purchase of this type to be initiated in the EU country of purchase (UK), rather than a normal County Court type claim which would have to be made in Cork County Court (or whatever it happens to be called) at much greater expense. BUT that means the claim has to be received by the UK court by Thursday (Brexit) & the only member of my family who is going to make it happen is me (although I'll make the point to my sis that sq225917 says that she should get off her lardy ass and do it herself :D) !

I'll let you know if I can get the claim in on time and, months later, if we get the dough...
 
Ireland has very similar Sales of Goods legislation to the UK, but I'm pretty sure that unless the item was first delivered to Ireland, it is the UK, not Irish law that applies here, and thus you have six years cover under the UK Consumer Rights Act.

(if you bought as a business or educational institution customer, things are different, of course)

However, because Apple runs its support and repairs as a pan-European operation, once you get it to accept your right to repair under the UK law, you should be able to arrange direct pickup from Denmark.
 
Ireland has very similar Sales of Goods legislation to the UK, but I'm pretty sure that unless the item was first delivered to Ireland, it is the UK, not Irish law that applies here, and thus you have six years cover under the UK Consumer Rights Act.

(if you bought as a business or educational institution customer, things are different, of course)

However, because Apple runs its support and repairs as a pan-European operation, once you get it to accept your right to repair under the UK law, you should be able to arrange direct pickup from Denmark.

MacBook is being repaired this week in Amsterdam. My question today is only about UK litigation channel : if I can find the right channel in time, I will get Apple to pay up, even it takes a few months.
 
It's not clear from your original post that you have exhausted the company's customer support channels. The UK legislation gives the purchaser a six-year reasonable life, and Apple, it seems, concurred. Apple runs quite a few "silent recall" actions on its hardware, where known problems are given goodwill repair, even out of warranty - and this model may be one of them.

Going down the litigation route will make this a pyrrhic victory at best, especially if you put value on your time, and doubly so if you could have secured a reimbursement simply by contacting Apple themselves and asking for it. The fact that they were willing to send a mail-in box indicates that they were going to pay for the repair, provided you could get the laptop to the original purchase address. Contact them, explain the difficulties, lay on the Covid excuses, and ask nicely for the repair cost to be refunded because exceptional circumstances prevented you returning the unit to the UK.

Jumping straight to the legal option is the wrong way to approach this. Work the system. From what you said, they were actually trying to help you.
 
It's not clear from your original post that you have exhausted the company's customer support channels. The UK legislation gives the purchaser a six-year reasonable life, and Apple, it seems, concurred. Apple runs quite a few "silent recall" actions on its hardware, where known problems are given goodwill repair, even out of warranty - and this model may be one of them.

Going down the litigation route will make this a pyrrhic victory at best, especially if you put value on your time, and doubly so if you could have secured a reimbursement simply by contacting Apple themselves and asking for it. The fact that they were willing to send a mail-in box indicates that they were going to pay for the repair, provided you could get the laptop to the original purchase address. Contact them, explain the difficulties, lay on the Covid excuses, and ask nicely for the repair cost to be refunded because exceptional circumstances prevented you returning the unit to the UK.

Jumping straight to the legal option is the wrong way to approach this. Work the system. From what you said, they were actually trying to help you.

Thanks for trying to help, Kris, but you seem to have missed the part where I said I have spent several hours hours on the phone with Apple, escalating to their senior support staff each time, AND that they have changed their policy since last October with regard to honouring the 6 year consumer protection warranty. The last guy I spoke to was VERY careful in his wording in saying that "unless the problem was reported within the first two years, we will not accept it for a warranty repair under UK consumer protection laws". How can that possibly comply with a 6 year fit-for-purpose legal requirement? It can't and Apple know this, but they also know that 99% of consumers do not have the wherewithall to take them to court (major car manufacturers do the same thing, but that's another story).

So, I have not jumped "straight to the legal option", but experience tells me that when it's time to pull the trigger, stop faffing around & pull it. There's nothing pyrrhic about €900 for a retired old git like me (even though I am doing this for my very generous sister). Capisce ?
 
I think that a problem that has been reported on any copy of the specific model in the first two years of life will enable the specific product to be repaired in 6 years of use.

So in my case the problem I was experiencing with my MacBook Pro had been seen and reported earlier so I think I got on the warranty bandwagon - that is my interpretation of the events.
 
I think that a problem that has been reported on any copy of the specific model in the first two years of life will enable the specific product to be repaired in 6 years of use.

So in my case the problem I was experiencing with my MacBook Pro had been seen and reported earlier so I think I got on the warranty bandwagon - that is my interpretation of the events.
That is a very important point and, having spent the afternoon researching what the 6 year consumer protection law really is - & it is not a no-holds-barred 6 year warranty by any means - I can see why Apple are keen to draw some kind of 2-year timeline under potential claims.

I also discovered that the UK courts are closed this week, meaning I've missed the European Small Claims boat, so I decided to double-check that Apple do not have a UK office to which I could serve a standard UK Small Claims action... by phoning Apple ! Using my report / case number, I was quickly escalated to a senior advisor when I calmly explained that the sole purpose of my call was to discover the address to which I should send my legal claim. The senior adviser was absolutely top notch and succeeded in giving me the impression that he truly wanted to get Apple to pay for the repair, as well as giving me their UK legal address in the event that they did not. He also gave me his direct email contact details & said he would be in charge of this case from here on in : no new personnel every time contact is made.

I will wait & see how this turns out, but hopefully I now have the more straightforward approach of a standard English Small Claims action if needed. My guess is that Apple's legal department know exactly where they stand : If they expect to lose such a case, they'll refund the payment sooner rather than later; if not, it'll be up to Uxbridge Magistrates Court (if such a court exists)... I'll report the outcome as & when.
 


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