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Labour Leader: Keir Starmer III

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Show me a child psychologist, educator or even parent who is arguing that at this point keeping the schools open is the right way to go.

Everyone understands that there is a balance to be struck. What you don’t seem to be able to process is that the health system will collapse if this measure isn’t taken - like, within days or weeks. That is going to have a terrible impact on everyone’s health, including children’s.

There are plenty of teachers and parents who will want schools to remain open.

On your second point, why on earth are unions, councillors, teachers and government not working together to make schools safe to return rather than just calling for them to close?

How could it have come to this when we all knew they were returning in September yet four months later here we are?
 
First of all ‘teaching unions’ have not called for schools to close, ‘a’ teaching union has called for schools to close.

Second, Starmer pledged to stand up for working people, not stand aside for fear of how the Daily Mail might paint him.

Third, the open letter is a call to look at the science, to follow the science, and for this government to publish the science. To paint this in political terms is an attempt to deflect from the science and the principle of open government.

Four, not seen the ‘open celebration’ of Williamson’s u-turn that you allude to, but Williamson is a Tory right winger who is putting lives in danger, and as such, I don’t understand why any Labour voter would wish to sympathise with him or find it unbelievable that he should be criticised.

Five, it is true that the evidence seems to suggest that the most deprived will fall further behind, but anyone genuinely interested in the education of the most deprived would speak up for them regularly and often, not at selective points in time to score a political a point.

Finally, teachers always act in the best interests of children, that’s why they become teachers. A teaching union primary purpose is to represent the best interests of it’s members, and always does so with the best interest of pupils and education to the fore. To suggest they do otherwise is u sustainable.

It is not in the interests of pupils to return to a school where teachers are dropping like flies and they end up being taught by supply teachers or being taught in a situation where several class groups are rolled together and taught by a single teacher, and a teacher who is likely to be a non specialist.

To put the blame for this situation on teachers and teaching unions is a distraction from where the blame should lie, and for the Labour Party and Labour voters to engage with the blame shifting of this government, to perpetuate their lies and distortions and to do the work of this government, is why this situation will continue to be mismanaged

Starmer wouldn’t exactly be sticking up for working people if he endorsed a policy that would mean many would have to make childcare arrangements or not work.

As I’ve said in another post, the leader of Greenwich Council is quoted as saying he was “absolutely delighted” at Williamson’s u-turn. So there are people who appear to be openly celebrating this.

Safety of teachers and other staff and children is of course of paramount importance but I think the actual education of children in all this isn’t being considered by the NEU, Labour councillors or people on here. As a Labour person, I think it’s important for children to get educated and it doesn’t make me right-wing to do so.

I’ve come to the conclusion though that we’re never going to agree, so maybe best to agree to disagree. A lot of people on this forum are far more to the left than the majority of folk and I would say are out of tune with what many think but I’ll leave it at that.
 
There are plenty of teachers and parents who will want schools to remain open.

According to the polls there are more that don’t

On your second point, why on earth are unions, councillors, teachers and government not working together to make schools safe to return rather than just calling for them to close?

The government refuses to consult with those unions who represent the overwhelming majority of teachers. They also refuse to publish the data on which they based their decision to keep schools open.

How could it have come to this when we all knew they were returning in September yet four months later here we are?
Yes, but to keep blaming the unions is not the answer.
 
Safety of teachers and other staff and children is of course of paramount importance but I think the actual education of children in all this isn’t being considered by the NEU, Labour councillors or people on here. As a Labour person, I think it’s important for children to get educated and it doesn’t make me right-wing to do so.

I hope you didn’t intend it, but I find this more than a little offensive. I have worked as a Head of Department in a secondary school and as a union caseworker for one of the larger unions representing teachers. As a teacher I have done nothing but consider the most deprived and taken the greatest pleasure in getting result for those with most disadvantages, getting C’s a B’s for children predicted E’s and D’s far outweighs all the A’s and A*’s put together. As a caseworker the number of teachers I have represented who did not deserve to be in trouble far outweighs those that did. Bullying good teachers, teachers with a solid record of raising the standards of pupils, is not helping pupils. That this happens is down to government policy.

To keep blaming teachers and teacher unions for this mess and the wider mess in education might not make you a right winger, but on this issue you are siding with a right wing government and media and repeating their propaganda for them.
 
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Here you go: https://twitter.com/LauraPidcock/status/1345406798287798273

Mostly supportive. One of the bitterest pills of the 2019 election was seeing Laura lose her seat. Had she survived she would have almost certainly won the deputy leadership of the party and might have balanced Starmer's worst instincts. Instead, Rayner has well and truly sold out.

Anyway, it looks like Starmer might be about to break his silence: https://twitter.com/siennamarla/status/1345684105279795205
One of her supporters reckons she will be PM one day. Hilarious, lost a very safe seat I seem to recall. Thankfully she’s not deputy Leader & I hope the party can move on from those heavily tainted by failure. I still don’t like Starmer’s non position though.
 
One of her supporters reckons she will be PM one day. Hilarious, lost a very safe seat I seem to recall. Thankfully she’s not deputy Leader & I hope the party can move on from those heavily tainted by failure. I still don’t like Starmer’s non position though.
What is about Piddock’s politics that you disagree with so?
 
Safety of teachers and other staff and children is of course of paramount importance but I think the actual education of children in all this isn’t being considered by the NEU, Labour councillors or people on here. As a Labour person, I think it’s important for children to get educated and it doesn’t make me right-wing to do so.

Ignoring the inherent contradictions in your statement.. let me just say this...

Education at all levels is in chaos. It is obviously and profoundly unsafe to have kids back in school and Students back at Uni while the new variant of Covid is surging through the population. Add the fact that such education as can be managed in these circumstances falls far short of what all learners need and deserve.

So.. my conclusion is that we need to do one thing at a time...and the one thing we need to do now is to bring all hands to the pump in a HUGE effort to get everyone in the country vaccinated and to employ sanctions in the workplace, or on public transport, etc., etc., for those who refuse without good reason. While this is happening we stay in lockdown and we suspend all education and any other fundamentally unsafe and non essential activity. Remember.. previous Govts have been very happy to use extended school leaving ages to mask unemployment. Covid is a FAR more important issue than that.

When we have the virus under control.. then..we re-start education etc..properly. If necessary..we repeat years at the top end and we delay entry at the bottom end..
Education can wait. Exams, unemployment etc.. etc.. can all be fixed. Dead people cannot.
 
Ignoring the inherent contradictions in your statement.. let me just say this...

Education at all levels is in chaos. It is obviously and profoundly unsafe to have kids back in school and Students back at Uni while the new variant of Covid is surging through the population. Add the fact that such education as can be managed in these circumstances falls far short of what all learners need and deserve.

So.. my conclusion is that we need to do one thing at a time...and the one thing we need to do now is to bring all hands to the pump in a HUGE effort to get everyone in the country vaccinated and to employ sanctions in the workplace, or on public transport, etc., etc., for those who refuse without good reason. While this is happening we stay in lockdown and we suspend all education and any other fundamentally unsafe and non essential activity. Remember.. previous Govts have been very happy to use extended school leaving ages to mask unemployment. Covid is a FAR more important issue than that.

When we have the virus under control.. then..we re-start education etc..properly. If necessary..we repeat years at the top end and we delay entry at the bottom end..
Education can wait. Exams, unemployment etc.. etc.. can all be fixed. Dead people cannot.
Very much agree with a lot of that, but we must think very carefully about how those pupils taking the brunt of this, of this big kick in their life chances, are not made to suffer more. If we need to take a pause, and those due to take life changing tests of their ability do not do so until some point in the future, that needs very careful planning.

Such forward planning, or thinking, is I fear, very much beyond the capability of our current Sec of State for Education.

PS. Or indeed anyone in the opposition cabinet
 
Ignoring the inherent contradictions in your statement.. let me just say this...

Education at all levels is in chaos. It is obviously and profoundly unsafe to have kids back in school and Students back at Uni while the new variant of Covid is surging through the population. Add the fact that such education as can be managed in these circumstances falls far short of what all learners need and deserve.

So.. my conclusion is that we need to do one thing at a time...and the one thing we need to do now is to bring all hands to the pump in a HUGE effort to get everyone in the country vaccinated and to employ sanctions in the workplace, or on public transport, etc., etc., for those who refuse without good reason. While this is happening we stay in lockdown and we suspend all education and any other fundamentally unsafe and non essential activity. Remember.. previous Govts have been very happy to use extended school leaving ages to mask unemployment. Covid is a FAR more important issue than that.

When we have the virus under control.. then..we re-start education etc..properly. If necessary..we repeat years at the top end and we delay entry at the bottom end..
Education can wait. Exams, unemployment etc.. etc.. can all be fixed. Dead people cannot.
A number of Primary schools will not be reopening fully tomorrow due to teachers following union advice. I am not sure if this counts as strike action but members of the brains trust will be along shortly to advise.
 
A number of Primary schools will not be reopening fully tomorrow due to teachers following union advice. I am not sure of this counts as strike action but members of the brains trust will be along shortly to advise.
My union advice is to turn up for work. Which unions are advising to not turn up to work?
 
My union advice is to turn up for work. Which unions are advising to not turn up to work?

Just put him on ignore - I don't have anyone else of pfm on ignore except this troll, he just can't seem to help himself
 
As far as I can tell Labour is still not calling for all schools to be closed.

Am I missing something (Starmer's statement was maddeningly vague)?
 
As far as I can tell Labour is still not calling for all schools to be closed.

Am I missing something (Starmer's statement was maddeningly vague)?
Has Starmer made a statement? Front page news? Second? Third? Still looking.....
 
A number of Primary schools will not be reopening fully tomorrow due to teachers following union advice. I am not sure if this counts as strike action but members of the brains trust will be along shortly to advise.
It's not a strike, I think under health and safety legislation you have a duty of care to yourself as well as others.
 
He said something along the lines of more school closures ‘inevitable’, I read it that he wants schools to stay open in areas where the virus is not as virulent?

Numbers in Sheffield are essentially the same as pre Xmas so existing risk assessment should be sufficient. It is rather chaotic as parents are being told this evening that their school is not opening in the morning.
 
I am not sure if this counts as strike action but members of the brains trust will be along shortly to advise

Considering that you’re wife’s a head teacher, I’d have thought you’d be sat right next to the answer to your own question?
 
What is about Piddock’s politics that you disagree with so?
What is it about her that makes her such a rising star? Ideally I like MPs & politicians to have some life experience & expertise outside of politics. Her skills appear to have been rejected at the last election but I have nothing against her personally.
 
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