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Labour Leader: Keir Starmer III

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Enfield boy said:
The SNP have been able to get away with being in many ways a single issue party like UKIP but with a far stronger and historic base. They will continue to benefit until after they achieve their aim, and this they will achieve. Only then will the true skill, if it is there, become apparent.
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I disagree. They are very consistently on the progressive left, just check their voting record. Ian Blackford is also vastly better at asking proper opposition questions than anything we’ve seen leading Labour this century, and no way in hell would the SNP ever enable Tory authoritarianism and state unaccountability. As ever voting record. They (and the Greens, PC and LDs) are centre-left, Labour are right-wing. That is simple statistical fact which can be ascertained by studying how the various parties vote on key issues, who whipped for what etc.
 
h.g. said:
??? My main point:

"Some others apart from Starmer seem to be joining the effort to rebuild the credibility of the labour party with mainstream voters."

This is relevant because Starmer alone has little chance alone of restoring the lost trust in the labour party. Not just when the hard left were in control but for years prior. Whether labour has the material to do it I don't know given how ineffective they were before Corbyn but again they are doing the right thing in giving it go and it obviously helps that their competition is incompetent and establishing a poor record of governing.
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Blair/Brown ruined the Labour Party - the lack of trust is still down to the banking crash. Take the blinkers off h.g. those two did lasting damage that the party hasn't recovered from. Corbyn went some way in 2017 but was drowned by Brexit and the Blairite scabs in his own PLP.
 
“We are Israel's largest human rights group – and we are calling this apartheid”


“There is not a single square inch in the territory Israel controls where a Palestinian and a Jew are equal. The only first-class people here are Jewish citizens such as myself, and we enjoy this status both inside the 1967 lines and beyond them, in the West Bank. Separated by the different personal statuses allotted to them, and by the many variations of inferiority Israel subjects them to, Palestinians living under Israel’s rule are united by all being unequal.
Unlike South African apartheid, the application of our version of it – apartheid 2.0, if you will – avoids certain kinds of ugliness. You won’t find “whites only” signs on benches. Here, “protecting the Jewish character” of a community – or of the state itself – is one of the thinly veiled euphemisms deployed to try to obscure the truth. Yet the essence is the same. That Israel’s definitions do not depend on skin colour make no material difference: it is the supremacist reality which is the heart of the matter – and which must be defeated.”

Nothing from Starmer on this, or any of the usual suspects that screamed blue murder about anti semitism in the Labour Party it seems that the aversion to prejudice is quite prejudiced, looks like the Israel lobby has hogtied Labour and any criticism of Israel from Labour will almost certainly mean ramping up the anti semitism claims again.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jan/12/israel-largest-human-rights-group-apartheid





 
Tony L said:
Sturgeon/SNP has surgically removed both Labour and Conservative from Scotland though. She is the most effective politician in the UK IMO, and by a very long way. To show 100s of years of English establishment the door to such a degree is a real achievement. It is so annoying we don’t have anything of that calibre in Little England.
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Coincidentally, while the threads mutated to my favourite subject, Scottish politics-interesting news for Labour- Richard Leonard, their leader here has fallen on his sword today!
It’s tragicomedy depending on how you view it because while Leonard has been useless apart from dodging one inside assassination attempt recently, he stood to pick up an accidental windfall. The list vote that allocates seats to parties that didn’t get their named candidates elected to constituencies via FPTP, allocates seats to a list of party candidates on a PR basis. The Tories are expected to lose 18% of their vote that would now be expected to go to Labour in May with Labour being the official opposition in Scotland so whodunnit?
 
Excellent interview with Shami Chakrabarti about the "spy cops" and Overseas Operations bills:

https://tribunemag.co.uk/2021/01/sh...most-dangerous-pieces-of-legislation-ive-seen

This is extremely well put:

Essentially, these two bills are evil twins with each other. There are elements of overlap, but one is predominantly about over there, and the other one is about over here. What they’re really about is making it much, much harder to hold people to account under the law.

They are both violations, not just of human rights, but of the rule of law itself and that fundamental principle of equality before the law. It’s not even formal equality. It’s not even a left version of equality. It’s not even equal opportunity. It’s equality before the law, which is supposed to be a principle that even conservatives hold.

What these pieces of legislation do is depart from that norm, which is an international and domestic norm that says that whether you are British, or non-British, or French, or non-French, American, or non-American, whether you’re a politician, or a soldier, or a policeman, or an undercover agent, you’re still subject to the rule of law.

These bills are carving out all sorts of exceptions to that vital principle. That should upset any democratic person. What’s happened in America of late should really be a wake-up call to people, and not just people who read Tribune: readers of the Times should be a little bit more excited and animated about this, too, because democracy is fragile. Without the rule of law, there is no civilisation, let alone democracy.

It's no coincidence that scumbags on the right of the PLP were recently briefing against Chakrabarti. She's one of the few Labour politicians with any principles left, and they hate her for it.
 
She might if there were more than a couple of decent ones. As it is she has spent a lot of time working for a political party that could seriously work for the majority. Sadly a sizeable chunk of that majority feel that voting for anyone but tories or almost tories would lead to disaster. It doesn't matter how many times we're told Change UK (who..the f) or Clegg, Cable, Swinesdottir, Vaguely who bl00dy cares will be the next coming. They won't. We had a chance, we sniffed and looked away. I truly fear nothing will change without disaster.
 
Tony L said:
Shami is way, way too good for her political party. She should defect to the Greens.
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The clarity of her analysis in that interview stands in stark contrast to Starmer's lack of principle. Ironic that he used to be a human rights lawyer.

Which reminds me, I came across this earlier:

https://thegrayzone.com/2020/06/05/...and-us-national-security-establishment-links/

I'm not a fan of "X met Y who works for company Z, which is owned by... Dr. Evil!" type arguments (they are often used to smear figures on the left by association) but the above article appears to be thoroughly researched and doesn't over-reach.

In any case, it's clear that Starmer has sold out whatever principles he ever had.
 
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doctorf said:
Such a good person that she was rewarded by Corbyn for a report which was proved a pile of crap by the EHRC.
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I've read the EHRC report and can't find a single criticism of the Chakrabarti report. Can you?

Why repeat these smears, which are really fcking disgusting?
 
Seanm said:
I've read the EHRC report and can't find a single criticism of the Chakrabarti report. Can you?

Why repeat these smears, which are really fcking disgusting?
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Everyone knows it was a whitewash.
And she ended up in The House of Lords.
 
ks.234 said:
EHRC proved nothing about the Chakrabarti Report, it didn’t even mention it as far as I recall.
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The EHRC report was not commissioned to assess or comment on the Chakrabarti report.
It's conclusions, however, proved that her report was not as accurate as her Ladyship suggested.
 
doctorf said:
Such a good person that she was rewarded by Corbyn for a report which was proved a pile of crap by the EHRC.
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Disgusting smears aside, what do you think of Chakrabarti's argument in the article: that human rights are universal and indivisible, and that any exceptions undermine not just democracy, but civilisation itself?

Personally, I think she's talking crap. I mean, I can't think of a single example of one group of people being treated as less worthy of human rights than everybody else, and suffering as a result.
 
doctorf said:
Everyone knows it was a whitewash.
And she ended up in The House of Lords.
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Balls. Nobody credible has ever said it was a whitewash. Even the BoD came out cautiously in favour of it on its release. If by "everyone knows" you mean "there's been a campaign of smears and innuendos against a left wing woman of colour based on nothing and orchestrated by some of the worst, most cynical scumbags in politics" then sure. And if you want to identify with those people work away. I did think better of you.

ks.234 said:
EHRC proved nothing about the Chakrabarti Report, it didn’t even mention it as far as I recall.
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It mentions it a lot: it leans on it in fact. Some of its most damaging claims concern its recommendations not being carried out.
 
doctorf said:
The EHRC report was not commissioned to assess or comment on the Chakrabarti report.
It's conclusions, however, proved that her report was not as accurate as her Ladyship suggested.
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Again, another uninformed smear, with a condescending innuendo for seasoning. It proved nothing of the sort - quite the opposite.

You haven't read either report. You're identifying with lying, cynical scumbags. I'd just delete the posts personally.
 
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