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Guitar talk: acoustic, bass, classical, twelve string? You name it! Pt III

I am thinking of getting rid of all my pedals not least as I am moving back up North (I am sort of semi-retiring on health grounds). My pedals for the longest time now have been Big Muff / Xotic SP Compressor/ JHS Morning Glory and I 90% of my playing I could do without the Big Muff. The only other effect I use with any regularity is tremolo, my repeated and ongoing attempts to get into delay notwithstnading.

By the way, talking of nylon strings, you might enjoy this cover of GOAT.

 
He's got a tutorial for it on his channel! Gav and I will expect a progress report next week :)
 
PS Josh’s ‘horrible solid state amps’ thing last week was great! He is such an underrated player IMO. Each week there are at least three riffs that could be developed into really good songs on the JHS show. Great band too.

Yeah that was fun. But kind of deceptive I think. He reminds me of one of those demo reps who used to tour the country going from music store to music store to demonstrate the latest stuff from Roland or Korg or whoever. They'd always make it sound fantastic, there's be a pile of the items being demonstrated by the sales counter as you left the store, and a lot of them would sell. Guys would get the amps and pedals home, and never sound 1/100th as good as the demo guy.
 
Yeah that was fun. But kind of deceptive I think. He reminds me of one of those demo reps who used to tour the country going from music store to music store to demonstrate the latest stuff from Roland or Korg or whoever. They'd always make it sound fantastic, there's be a pile of the items being demonstrated by the sales counter as you left the store, and a lot of them would sell. Guys would get the amps and pedals home, and never sound 1/100th as good as the demo guy.

The thing he gets so right IMO is he isn’t trying to be anyone else. Whatever the kit in use he is just Josh being Josh. He may say he’s channelling such and such a band, but in reality he’s only adding a few % to his own style and approach. It all goes to hell in a handcart if you attempt to emulate others IMO. I suspect that is where a lot of the disappointment lies. I’ve never gone that route. I’m frustrated I’ve never really grown as a player, but I’m happy I never wasted ages trying to be someone else.
 
I think a lot of what Josh does so well on his channel is the recording side. He seems to capture the just guitar, bass and drums playing in a room thing really well, although I am not sure if this is because what he does is very simple or years of effort and expensive equipment at his pedal shop makes it seem effortless.

Also agree on his playing. He's one of the few youtube guitar creators where I actually like listening to the music he plays mainly because the jams they come up with sound like records I would go out and buy. It's no accident I almost always like the suggestions on his Record Time slot his questionable views on Oasis notwithstanding.
 
I'm impressed by the way Josh will talk freely about competitors' products, even while pushing his own gear.
 
I think a lot of what Josh does so well on his channel is the recording side. He seems to capture the just guitar, bass and drums playing in a room thing really well, although I am not sure if this is because what he does is very simple or years of effort and expensive equipment at his pedal shop makes it seem effortless.

I suspect a lot of that is down to Nick who really seems to know his stuff. He did answer some questions about how he did it a while back and he’d thought about things I didn’t know e.g. measuring the drum overhead mics so they are both exactly the same distance from the snare to preserve phase. He writes/records all the themes, interludes etc too so very much a team effort rather than just Josh.
 
I'm impressed by the way Josh will talk freely about competitors' products, even while pushing his own gear.

Yes, he’s managed to retain a real enthusiasm, obsession and all-round geekery for the whole subject. It all comes across as very natural and genuine. I’d love to know who he dislikes or thinks make crap, there will inevitably be some!
 
As regards my playing, I am going for the outsider art angle and am satisfied that years after my death my Ableton files will be discovered and it will become known that I am a musical genius and have invented a whole new type of music.
 
As regards my playing, I am going for the outsider art angle and am satisfied that years after my death my Ableton files will be discovered and it will become known that I am a musical genius and have invented a whole new type of music.

Excellent. I've hardly played since home schooling - still recovering from the effort.
 

Interesting 5 Watt World Short History of Mesa. An amp brand I’d misunderstood as I only associated them with the very worst kind of ‘80s hair/spandex metal. Sure, they did that, and it was/still is pretty nasty, but the early combos seem really nice and have really great clean tones a plenty. I particularly like the look of the early wood finish MkIs, IIs etc with the cane grilles. Very cool. They sound like a really versatile amp too. Not something I’d touch myself as I’ve heard way too many repair techs hating on them (overly complex, hard to disassemble, PCBs that can actually become conductive etc), but I’ve far more respect for them than I had. I’m currently playing Santana’s Moonflower as that’s what Keith cited as a definite early Mesa Boogie sound. Very good it is too. Playing it upstairs through ‘tone appropriate’ EL84s too!

PS I wonder if they’ll be another brand that just goes to Gibson to die, e.g. Steinberger?
 
I watched that last night and am glad it wasn't just me who thought they were only made the triple rectifier, gain monsters. Although mostly I was disabused when I saw those £££ California amps they made which were the sweetest sounding things ever.

I think someone here has one of the really nice ones? Yank maybe? Or possibly I am getting confused with another place where I discuss guitars.
 
Bakithi Kumalo breaks-down his favourite bass lines.

Scott's Bass Lessons featured a lovely vid 2-3weeks ago from this wonderful bassist talking about his favourite instruments; now, we are given a masterclass - Bakithi Kumalo at play:


JOY!
 
Bakithi Kumalo breaks-down his favourite bass lines.

Scott's Bass Lessons featured a lovely vid 2-3weeks ago from this wonderful bassist talking about his favourite instruments; now, we are given a masterclass - Bakithi Kumalo at play:


JOY!

Great video, brilliant player.

On the bass front, something I've never really understood is "growl" and how to get it. Is it simply a small amount of overdrive distortion, or does it come from the guitar, the type and length of strings, the amp? If you play a low note on a good piano, you can hear a "growl" in the string sound. The sound I'd like is the way a Music Man Stingray can sound ( I know...buy a Stingray! but that ain't happening now)

Playing bass in a (pub Blues) band, I always struggled to get a sound I liked. If I cranked up the treble enough to make the bass stand out, the thinner strings ( D and G ) would start to sound too twangy for blues. I never resolved this, to my annoyance. Bass was/is a Warwick active thing ( entry level, cost about £450, 15 years ago ) amp was an Ashdown 300w combo with single 15" driver.

( Another problem we never resolved was a lead singer who, when excited, would hold the Shure SM58 hard against his lips and sing/shout too loud, creating a "day-centre-bingo" sound that occupied the full audio spectrum making everything sound shite. I sometimes wondered if we should make him sing with a budgie cage on his head to train him in mic technique)

Mind you, nowadays I'd kill for the chance to stand in the corner of a busy, sewaty pub and belt out "Key to the Highway", pint by my side...sigh.
 
On the bass front, something I've never really understood is "growl" and how to get it.

If we are both thinking of the same thing (for me the bass on Miles Davis’s Tribute To Jack Johnson or On The Corner is the unattainable goal) I’m pretty convinced it is a valve amp and high volume, i.e. a combination of valve crunch and compression and a bit of speaker breakup. I’ve actually succeeded far better using plug-ins in Logic than through any amp I’ve ever owned (all solid state). I now no longer have a bass amp and just plug into the little Rift guitar amp for noodling about and straight into Logic if I ever want to record anything. I do have a Boss BBX1 Bass Driver (actually up for grabs in the musical instrument classifieds), which kind of gets some way towards it and would make a good ‘always on’ pedal to fatten things up, but I think a lot of what I want is classic valves and high volume, e.g. Ampeg tube head and 15” horn cab at gig volume.

PS For classic vintage blues etc flat-wounds may help.
 
Great video, brilliant player.

On the bass front, something I've never really understood is "growl" and how to get it. Is it simply a small amount of overdrive distortion, or does it come from the guitar, the type and length of strings, the amp? If you play a low note on a good piano, you can hear a "growl" in the string sound. The sound I'd like is the way a Music Man Stingray can sound ( I know...buy a Stingray! but that ain't happening now)

Playing bass in a (pub Blues) band, I always struggled to get a sound I liked. If I cranked up the treble enough to make the bass stand out, the thinner strings ( D and G ) would start to sound too twangy for blues. I never resolved this, to my annoyance. Bass was/is a Warwick active thing ( entry level, cost about £450, 15 years ago ) amp was an Ashdown 300w combo with single 15" driver.

( Another problem we never resolved was a lead singer who, when excited, would hold the Shure SM58 hard against his lips and sing/shout too loud, creating a "day-centre-bingo" sound that occupied the full audio spectrum making everything sound shite. I sometimes wondered if we should make him sing with a budgie cage on his head to train him in mic technique)

Mind you, nowadays I'd kill for the chance to stand in the corner of a busy, sewaty pub and belt out "Key to the Highway", pint by my side...sigh.

You are after one of the holy grails that folks spend a fortune on trying to get via expensive basses and amps. I think you can partially get there with equipment but I think it is really down to the player. One of my hero’s was Japan’s Mick Karn and his amazing fretless sounds on a Wal bass. I have a friend who met him and watched him play on a junker Squirer fretted and he still sounded like Mick Karn!

That said, if I were you, I would lose the active Warwick and Ashdown and buy a nice Fender J bass copy into a Ampeg or similar. Try to get a valve head or even just a valve stage. Both the Warwick and Ashdown have a very clean sound with that modern punchy active vibe, not really old fashioned blues IMO.

Also stick with the heavier strings and dig into the bass a little, your tone will change as you stress the strings and bass. Don’t try to wind up too much treble, it will get lost anyway unless you are super high in the mix, the mid and bass will cut through best.Try to get a trusted friend to listen in the crowd for your sound and tweak accordingly.

A Stingray is a fab thing and well worth getting, would sound lovely but they do seem to have got expensive recently.
 
If we are both thinking of the same thing (for me the bass on Miles Davis’s Tribute To Jack Johnson or On The Corner is the unattainable goal) I’m pretty convinced it is a valve amp and high volume, i.e. a combination of valve crunch and compression and a bit of speaker breakup. I’ve actually succeeded far better using plug-ins in Logic than through any amp I’ve ever owned (all solid state). I now no longer have a bass amp and just plug into the little Rift guitar amp for noodling about and straight into Logic if I ever want to record anything. I do have a Boss BBX1 Bass Driver (actually up for grabs in the musical instrument classifieds), which kind of gets some way towards it and would make a good ‘always on’ pedal to fatten things up, but I think a lot of what I want is classic valves and high volume, e.g. Ampeg tube head and 15” horn cab at gig volume.

PS For classic vintage blues etc flat-wounds may help.

Cheers Tony. I shall check out the Miles Davis number. "classic valves and high volume" ...sounds good!
 


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