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Gas and Electricity Prices

Discussion in 'off topic' started by gordonscobie, Sep 14, 2021.

  1. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    The obvious palliative is to scrap the VAT on energy and do a Tesco (every little helps). 5% won't rock the boat either way but it will show that our masters are at least being conciliatory.
     
  2. Stuart Frazer

    Stuart Frazer pfm Member

    Probably true and the way the Tories look at it. It should be about doing the right and fair thing though. Looking after the poorest.
     
  3. Stuart Frazer

    Stuart Frazer pfm Member

    It's an option, but the Government is now trying to increase tax revenues, not lower them. As well as your 5% VAT suggestion, they could also scrap the green energy levy until we are over this hump. I have no confidence they will do anything though, until it's far too late.
     
  4. Bob McC

    Bob McC Living the life of Riley

    He didn’t say that at all.
    You can exceed £1277 a year depending on consumption.
     
  5. mansr

    mansr Objectionist

    I hate it when they report that whatever expense is going up by X pounds without specifying the underlying calculation. I get that the average person is (assumed to be) an idiot who can't do multiplication, but surely they could still mention actual change.
     
    Stuart Frazer likes this.
  6. MikeMA

    MikeMA pfm Member

    I'm staggered by the numbers of people who seem not to have the faintest idea what their actual utility consumption is.
     
  7. Caledon1297

    Caledon1297 pfm Member

    Last edited: Sep 24, 2021
    Mike Reed likes this.
  8. mansr

    mansr Objectionist

    Worse, many don't seem to understand what utility consumption is as a concept.
     
  9. MikeMA

    MikeMA pfm Member

    For many it will be a transcendental abstraction, though they probably don't know it.
     
  10. kensalriser

    kensalriser pfm Member

    The Tory party's entire reason for existence is to protect and extend the interests of the rich and powerful.
     
  11. Mullardman

    Mullardman Moderately extreme...

    Anyone remember a certain M Thatcher..who flogged off all of our major utilities to the private sector?

    Anyone recall that we have been 'in hock' to Russia for gas forever?

    Should I bother mentioning French built and Chinese funded Nukerlear Power Stations?

    This was always going to happen.
     
    Richard Lines and Snufkin like this.
  12. MikeMA

    MikeMA pfm Member

    And to think we once owned all our own utility companies, had lots of our own gas, and were world leaders in nuclear power - and lots of other interesting things too, like aviation and computers - and now all gone down the plughole of history.
     
  13. Snufkin

    Snufkin pfm Member

    The idea of Tories lowering or removing tax is, well, hilarious. The Tories are the Party of high taxation. Tories love tax as long as it’s the little people who pay it. For example one of the first things they did in 1979 was raise VAT, a tax that disproportionately hurts the least well off; I still haven’t forgiven them.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Value-added_tax_in_the_United_Kingdom#Historical_rates
     
  14. Mike Reed

    Mike Reed pfm Member

    If he didn't actually say it, it came across as such; he did say that if you're switched (to a VRT) you'll at least have that ceiling. I must admit that the showman-like aspect of that prog. and the frequent interchange between his assistant and him does cloud the detail for me. Maybe you can explain WHAT the cap actually refers to, Bob.

    My energy supplier, Octopus, puts my gas consumption figure as about 10 X what my meter readings are. Elec. is as per the readings. Is there a multiplier involved, maybe connected to gas being measured in therms (as was?). I thought, when kWh was introduced, that the meter reading was the consumption figure.
     
  15. garyi

    garyi leave blank

    Well I did'nt watch it but I expect the cap relates to the max price per KWH. I would reallly love 1277 was the max they could charge me lol.
     
    Stuart Frazer and lordsummit like this.
  16. Aethelist

    Aethelist pfm Member

    If you're with Octopus the Calculation used to convert cubic metres to Kw/H is shown on your bill next to the Gas used section (well it is on mine)
     
  17. laughingboy

    laughingboy pfm Member

    Yes. VAT is regressive. It hits the poorest hardest. Coincidentally, Conservative chancellors love raising VAT. All the main VAT rate hikes (in bold) have been Conservative:

    1973 - 10%

    1974 - Labour cut to 8% (accompanied by new higher-rate luxury goods VAT 25%)

    1976 - Labour cut 'luxury' higher rate VAT to 12.5%

    1979 - Conservatives raise all VAT to 15%

    1991 - Conservatives raise VAT to 17.5%

    1994 - Conservatives introduce 8% VAT on domestic fuel and power

    1994 - Conservatives lose vote in parliament to raise fuel and power to 17.5%

    1997 - Labour cut fuel and power rate to 5%

    1997 - Labour cut insulation products to 5%

    2001 - Labour cut sanitary products to 5%

    2001 - Labour cut car seats to 5%

    2001 - Labour cut domestic building renovation to 5%

    2006 - Labour cut contraceptive products to 5%

    2007 - Labour cut smoking cessation products to 5%

    2008 - Labour cut main rate of VAT to 15% from 17.5% as a stimulus measure

    2010 - Labour restore main rate of VAT to 17.5%

    2011 - Conservatives increase VAT to 20%

    2020 - Conservatives zero rate PPE (May to October 2020)

    2021 - Conservatives zero rate sanitary products

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Value-added_tax_in_the_United_Kingdom#Historical_rates
     
  18. Caledon1297

    Caledon1297 pfm Member

    The 'price cap' is actually a tariff cap; the oft-quoted 'headline figure' is based upon what is deemed to be medium usage (3100 kWh electricity/12000 kWh gas, IIRC) - an individual's price on SVR (Standard Variable Rate) will depend on their usage, the energy region in which they live, method of payment and meter type.

    The calculator linked above will let you work out the 'headline figure' for your own circumstances.
     
  19. Seeker_UK

    Seeker_UK Booyakashah, check out my avatar...

  20. Bob McC

    Bob McC Living the life of Riley

    Several posters have explained the reality.
     

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