Gary Lineker vs. BBC

It's an error, that is for sure. But it doesn't really carry much weight in the subtopic of UK not being as fascistic as some pfmers that live there think.

 

Also wrong, at least the first part - the Conservatives polled nearly 44% of those who voted. Labour under Corbyn got 32%.

 

I agree that UK is not free enough. No country I have lived in has felt free enough. France feels less free than UK, though. I also recognise that UK may be seen as less open in coming reports. I also agree that the UK voting system is shit.

 

It's one reason why I don't think it's good data. It tends to disqualify the whole thing, IMV.

 

Terf is generally used as insulting shorthand to mean 'someone I won't listen to' (at best). Further down the scale is one you've mentioned in your post - 'they get moved on' (i.e sacked or run out of their jobs) because they have an opinion. I raised the issue in relation to your post as the way I see it the 'wedge' is being used by both sides to stifle decent conversation/debate and paint the other side as some kind of demented enemy, rather than listening to the often sensible and reasonable points made.

 

ok, have some more:

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/freedom-index-by-country
https://www.democracymatrix.com/ranking
https://freedomhouse.org/countries/freedom-world/scores?sort=desc&order=Total%20Score%20and%20Status

 

In the situation as I see it nobody would be "moved on" "because they have an opinion". Rather, a small and unrepresentative group who currently enjoy a near total monopoly of the media space are likely, at some stage, to be forced to make concessions to the people who actually produce and consume their products. What form that might take I don't know but that just seems like a very likely outcome of cultural organisations getting clogged up at the top with people who hold unpleasant views that are directly at odds with those of people who work for them and buy their stuff.

 

Thanks. EV will protest.

 

I don't want to divert the thread any further, but looking just at that first one: do you really view a freedom index produced by the Cato Institute (Koch Bros. etc.) as a good source for rating democracies?
Thanks for the links anyway. They're interesting, if only because of how differently each approaches the subject.

 

Sorry, I'm behind the loop.

What am I to protest about?

 

But as an immigrant (whites are ex-pats, blacks are immigrants?), where do you live? In a Paris or Marseilles banlieue? Or in a nice village?
I live in a village on the edge of Plymouth, and it is very nice here. The council estate in Manchester from where I moved, less so.
There was nice Al Jazeera piece a while back about black footballers' experiences in the two countries which highlighted the differences.

 

I'm really just knocking them off on Google top ranked search. I can keep going. But in fact it's possible to discredit all research. I used to work for TNS and Nielsen. I know how it goes.

 

Actually you are right. I always need to remind myself to stop comparing UK with France when I only know the places I have lived in. I can't really spread it that far. But I'm from Hull. And it is fairly tough. we were getting broken into once every couple of years. Couldn't get insurance due to flooding. Then I moved to Strasbourg, which probably compares to nothing at all in UK. Never been broken into and can get insurance! However, as i said in a post upthread, the thumbs up for France comes mainly from slightly better weather, slightly better food, a willingness to immerse myself in language and much cheaper holidays.

 

As lecturers* have been known to say, Google is not research.
*Not mine, I left school at 16; apparently just before they expelled me.

 

Pfft. Italy's better, and it's not French! But they both shut for August, which is a bugger when you had plans and didn't realise that!

 

Italy certainly has it's charms. I loved living/working in Milan even though it was only for six months.

Shame about the fascist prime minister really.

 

i must say i like the prices! its the cheapest near holiday for us from strasbourg, we got pizza for 8 euros and bottles of table wine for 8 euros in la spezia restaurants!