dave
Plywood King
PS bought new but not at RRP so dam good value
Two three-tier arrays cost me eleven pieces of Mana sold to a friend plus 75 cents;-)
Fraim time !!
- Thread starter linnaudio
- Start date
Two three-tier arrays cost me eleven pieces of Mana sold to a friend plus 75 cents;-)
Yeah, mine. It's a Naim system, only with good amplifiers and speakers. There's more hogwash written about Naim on teh intarwebs than any other subject, apart from religion. Naim's become its own religion, and the Naim forum is where it all originates.
SteveS1
I heard that, pardon?
You are pushing against an open door Dave, Bub didn't seem to be suggesting that setting your system up wasn't worth attention. Rather he was teasing some of the more lunatic exaggerations.
I certainly believe in keeping an eye on the old system set-up. Why even my car drives better when I've cleaned and detailed it.
Never had a single problem with cables touching walls/other cables. mine touch everything on there way to where they are going and it still sounds excellent, if guiding them on their own makes an improvment then thats a bonus. Also Its a fact that Naim stuff does take a while to sound its best but ive never been disappointed in any one of mine straight from the box.
dave
Plywood King
You are pushing against an open door Dave, Bub didn't seem to be suggesting that setting your system up wasn't worth attention. Rather he was teasing some of the more lunatic exaggerations.
I certainly believe in keeping an eye on the old system set-up. Why even my car drives better when I've cleaned and detailed it.
Steve,
Someone's inability to hear certain adjustments means nothing to me to be honest. Again, If you or Bub believe some of these suggestions are lunacy, please feel to twist your Burndies and place used chocolate wrappers around your connectors.
I know one user here that permanently runs a single speaker cable in a pair "backwards" just to thumb his nose at the concept of directionality. I admire him, he puts his money where his mouth his.
regards,
dave
So naim make bad amps aswell now do they, first the 552 was crap now the 300 & 500 are too? an by the way i actually chose naim speakers over the more expensive B&Ws so IMO the speakers cant be that bad either. Didnt like the older ones though ill give you that. I would actually argue now that you havnt heard any of these set up in a proper system, and i dont mean a 1hr demo in a show or a shop
SteveS1
I heard that, pardon?
Dave,
Don't be silly, there is a world of difference between being careless with your set up and some of the idiot fodder that is spouted about perfectly good components being ruined by cables touching or spending months 'coming on song'. If it makes people think they have golden ears or are privvy to some kind of magic, fair enough. As you say, the world still turns.
Steve
Don't be silly, there is a world of difference between being careless with your set up and some of the idiot fodder that is spouted about perfectly good components being ruined by cables touching or spending months 'coming on song'. If it makes people think they have golden ears or are privvy to some kind of magic, fair enough. As you say, the world still turns.
Steve
dave
Plywood King
Steve,
I've found some Naim source or preamp cables touching other objects can affect the sound under certain circumstances -the changes are small but audible and repeatible.
I've yet to hear a Naim component take more than eight days (CDS mk1) to sound its best. Even then, they only take that long on the first couple of power cycles IME. *Most with my experience are at max performance within five days if not less when they are new. All future power cycling seems to bring them up to snuff within 24 hours with the exception of the CDS2 which still takes four days here even though this is a seven year old unit.
YMMV and all...
maniacally yours,
dave
*olive only - I have no experience w/ref gear other than a NAPSC2 which really doesn't count.
I've found some Naim source or preamp cables touching other objects can affect the sound under certain circumstances -the changes are small but audible and repeatible.
I've yet to hear a Naim component take more than eight days (CDS mk1) to sound its best. Even then, they only take that long on the first couple of power cycles IME. *Most with my experience are at max performance within five days if not less when they are new. All future power cycling seems to bring them up to snuff within 24 hours with the exception of the CDS2 which still takes four days here even though this is a seven year old unit.
YMMV and all...
maniacally yours,
dave
*olive only - I have no experience w/ref gear other than a NAPSC2 which really doesn't count.
dont often turn mine off but when i do i think its back to normal after an hr or so of listening. IME i would say about a week or so from new where you can still hear a difference. I have been told though the 552 can take months but mine is now 2 weeks old i think, am noticing no difference now. As i said earlier i was more than happy with it from the box, no arsin round with cables, just pluged in and played. One thing that i wil say though is mains quality is certainly a factor with the higher end Power supplies. For instance mine is now sounding much more open and detailed than at 5 oclock this afternoon. Is this a downfall of Naim or just it is of such quality it will show up these small differences in the mains? i know what i think
dave
Plywood King
I've heard main differences depending on time of day with all sorts of gear so it's not just Naim.
The one thing I've read from some Naim (and non-Naim users spreading myths) is the nonsense that cold Naims sound like *shite* but suddenly *great* when warmed up. Sorry, but it's one or the other. Warmup affects sound but it isn't that big of a deal.
Again, your warmup periods should get less as the boxes age with some possible exceptions.
The one thing I've read from some Naim (and non-Naim users spreading myths) is the nonsense that cold Naims sound like *shite* but suddenly *great* when warmed up. Sorry, but it's one or the other. Warmup affects sound but it isn't that big of a deal.
Again, your warmup periods should get less as the boxes age with some possible exceptions.
I hate to break it to you (that's a lie), but the 300 and 500 are extremely expensive ways of buying a mediocre power amp. You actually chose Naim speakers? They must have seen you coming a long way away.
ive never heard one go form shit to good over time, if its sounds bad then something is a miss elsewhere IMO, the biggest change is from new to about a week or so after use but not that much, if it was am sure Naim would have them run in at the factory or everyone would be sending them back saying it was nothing like the demo one they heard. Personally i dotn turn mine off so ive nothing to worry about either way
or the speakers must of been better than you think ? why cant you get it through your head that maybe, just maybe I like the combo of naim preamps and power amps better than any others ive heard, and that maybe the ovators sound good when with the top end naim they were designed to be with, if you want cheap amps and pretend to yourself they are good then so be it, ill quite happily spend the money on Naim because i think they are worth it. oh and not only did i buy one i have ordered another 2, thats how bad they are
dave
Plywood King
exactly...
dave
Plywood King
LOL...you'll get to know Bub. It's Gospel if he likes it and A Lie if he doesn't. There is no in between like opinion or individual perception.
rontoolsie
pfm Member
Returning to the OP topic...this isn't about how good/bad/ok Naim power amps/speakers are, but how a Fraim may or may not give a sonic upgrade. As I mentioned in an earlier post, I intended to try out another Sonority platform under the XPS2, to be used in conjunction with the one already resident under the CDS3.
For some reason, I intuitively thought that these platforms should work better under the CDS3 head unit than say the XPS2.
But I can honestly say-based on listening to just three disks so far- that the magnitude of improvements under the XPS2 eclipses those of when I placed the first one under the CDS3. And by 'improvements' I mean ones that would be admired or even lusted after by the most fervent flat Naim devotee. Notes start quicker, and stop quicker, but not in a 'Mana' fashion...with it comes a sense of ease and flow with a very significant increase in subjective tonal purity. Plucked double basses now sound like a real goddam instrument instead of a disembodied one. Vocals and background harmonies start to make sense and to be resolved from one another. And the background is not silent, but instead has the ambience of the recording. Kinda spooky.
Yep, the Fraim is great....BUT not with the glass.
For some reason, I intuitively thought that these platforms should work better under the CDS3 head unit than say the XPS2.
But I can honestly say-based on listening to just three disks so far- that the magnitude of improvements under the XPS2 eclipses those of when I placed the first one under the CDS3. And by 'improvements' I mean ones that would be admired or even lusted after by the most fervent flat Naim devotee. Notes start quicker, and stop quicker, but not in a 'Mana' fashion...with it comes a sense of ease and flow with a very significant increase in subjective tonal purity. Plucked double basses now sound like a real goddam instrument instead of a disembodied one. Vocals and background harmonies start to make sense and to be resolved from one another. And the background is not silent, but instead has the ambience of the recording. Kinda spooky.
Yep, the Fraim is great....BUT not with the glass.
dave
Plywood King
Or maybe just not *as* great ehhh?;-)
Interesting observations about the Sonority platform under the XPS2, Ron. Reminds me of my post-Mana days when I was demming new racks. I had just enough Fraim sent by dD to create a stack supporting my CDS mk1 head unit and 102 with an empty shelf between which left my CDPS, HC and 250 on an AF/BASE rack.
Results were quite beyond my expectations, enough so that I had Dave and Chris send me a second three-tier stack to try under the "brawn" stack. I really didn't expect much difference but was shocked again to find the Fraim just as effective under the power supplies and 250.
regards,
dave
Interesting observations about the Sonority platform under the XPS2, Ron. Reminds me of my post-Mana days when I was demming new racks. I had just enough Fraim sent by dD to create a stack supporting my CDS mk1 head unit and 102 with an empty shelf between which left my CDPS, HC and 250 on an AF/BASE rack.
Results were quite beyond my expectations, enough so that I had Dave and Chris send me a second three-tier stack to try under the "brawn" stack. I really didn't expect much difference but was shocked again to find the Fraim just as effective under the power supplies and 250.
regards,
dave
Sounds legit ;-)
Dave J
Übermember
Me too. I had been using Corian under my CDP until recently when I moved to Sonority. The Corian was very much better than the standard glass, the Sonority better still.
I have a spare 'Fraim sized' Corian shelf available if anyone wants to try. PM me if you're interested.
Cheers
Dave
Derek Wright
pfm Member
To clarify
From what I have read above there is a Sonarity product that replaces the glass in the Fraim - looking at the Sonority web site which product is that - and do you replace the ball bearings
Thanks for any info
From what I have read above there is a Sonarity product that replaces the glass in the Fraim - looking at the Sonority web site which product is that - and do you replace the ball bearings
Thanks for any info