Theo
pfm Member
Sadly, David at Goldring says he can't repair this one. Looks like back to ESCo...
Expert stylus
- Thread starter Carl Nyqvist
- Start date
Sadly, David at Goldring says he can't repair this one. Looks like back to ESCo...
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Theo,
I vaguely remember reading of ESCo only gluing their tips on, regardless of the original fixing. This may well be wrong, of course, and some styli are only glued to the cantilever at the manufacturing stage.
You knocking off the (Paratrace?) tip TWICE reminded me of this, although with a non-metal cantilever, maybe it's not possible to affix styli in any other way.
Was this due to your handling, or due to unexpected fragility in bonding, do you think?
I vaguely remember reading of ESCo only gluing their tips on, regardless of the original fixing. This may well be wrong, of course, and some styli are only glued to the cantilever at the manufacturing stage.
You knocking off the (Paratrace?) tip TWICE reminded me of this, although with a non-metal cantilever, maybe it's not possible to affix styli in any other way.
Was this due to your handling, or due to unexpected fragility in bonding, do you think?
Theo
pfm Member
Hi Mike,
You're spot on. Basically, a glued-on Paratrace isn't as strong as the original bonding: using the Ortofon stylus brush a bit too vigorously, and the stylus loosened (you could hear the resultant mistracking), then fell off. A warning to myself and others I suppose: it's a good way of extending the life of your cartridge but you must handle with extreme care. I suspect the best bet is actually a new Ortofon in part ex, but that's not an option for me at the moment. On the lookout for a cheapie...
You're spot on. Basically, a glued-on Paratrace isn't as strong as the original bonding: using the Ortofon stylus brush a bit too vigorously, and the stylus loosened (you could hear the resultant mistracking), then fell off. A warning to myself and others I suppose: it's a good way of extending the life of your cartridge but you must handle with extreme care. I suspect the best bet is actually a new Ortofon in part ex, but that's not an option for me at the moment. On the lookout for a cheapie...
Chris
pfm Member
I can´t see Expert using anything inferior to what the manufacturer uses to "bond" or "glue" the tips to the cantilever. There has to be another explanation. Been using cleaning liquids, IPA or stuff ? I´ll touch wood first but I use a dry Denon brush on my Escoed Troika and once in a blue one, my Audio technica vibrator.
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Yes, I know many people have warned of the dangers of using alcohol, or, in fact, any liquid, to clean styli, BUT
If you get a hardened crud accumulation, ONLY liquid will shift it. All the other cleaners, like the AT 637, dust busters, green emery (?), brushes etcetera are useful for maintenance, but not refurbishment, i.m.o.
I've cleaned Lyras and Koetsus, plus, if I remember, Roksan and Linn (Karma) and others, by gently brushing IPA (although I think it used to be surgical spirit in the seventies, eighties and early nineties) with the aid of jewellers' loupes (and Valium !). I've yet to lose a tip (touch wood *).
However, I can well imagine that cheaper cart's which aren't crimped or socketed into their cantilevers could be vulnerable. I guess I should invest in Stylast or its equivalent to see whether this does as good a job as IPA, as they are at least formulated for the purpose.
If you hold the cart. in the right position, liquid cannot travel up the cantilever, and with IPA (or IPA/water mix), evaporation is fast.
* I say all the above with trepidation, as I have to de-gunk a Benz Ebony tomorrow morning, and I haven't a clue how Benz affix their styli to the cantilever.
If you get a hardened crud accumulation, ONLY liquid will shift it. All the other cleaners, like the AT 637, dust busters, green emery (?), brushes etcetera are useful for maintenance, but not refurbishment, i.m.o.
I've cleaned Lyras and Koetsus, plus, if I remember, Roksan and Linn (Karma) and others, by gently brushing IPA (although I think it used to be surgical spirit in the seventies, eighties and early nineties) with the aid of jewellers' loupes (and Valium !). I've yet to lose a tip (touch wood *).
However, I can well imagine that cheaper cart's which aren't crimped or socketed into their cantilevers could be vulnerable. I guess I should invest in Stylast or its equivalent to see whether this does as good a job as IPA, as they are at least formulated for the purpose.
If you hold the cart. in the right position, liquid cannot travel up the cantilever, and with IPA (or IPA/water mix), evaporation is fast.
* I say all the above with trepidation, as I have to de-gunk a Benz Ebony tomorrow morning, and I haven't a clue how Benz affix their styli to the cantilever.
wylton
Naim and Mana member
mmaatt
pfm Member
As far as I can see, and I've been cleaning my Roksan Shiraz('s) for about 5years now with Art du Son or usually purified water via moistening an AT vibrating cleaner with no ill effects, capillary action can only happen if the cantilever is an open shape; a good cantilever is closed at the stylus end.
If the diamond is crimped and glued as well then I would say it is safe to use a controlled amount of liquid to clean the tip.
mat
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Certainly, with hollow cantilevers, as I remember in days of yore and Shure M55s, M75s and V15s (or am I imagining this?). Not sure how you can get capillary action with solid boron cantilevers, though, which all the cart's I've had for two or more decades have had.
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Simon, d'you mean slotted in or crimped? I can't quite relate the various definitions of 'shank' in my O.E.D. with a cantilever.
Although it's obscured by a ball of gunk, it looks like the stylus feeds through the cantilever (as in a slot or slit).
Rockhopper
pfm Member
The connection at the end of boron cantilever is normally a tiny tight fitting sleeve of aluminium that in squeezed flat and the diamond fitted through it. This is certainly the way ZYX use and most likely most boron cantilever cartridges.
The fixing that Esco use for their paratrace stylus is to lap the cantilever/stylus joint then use some sort of glue to complete the connection.
Paratrace on ruby cantilever
[
URL=http://s257.photobucket.com/user/ZYXlover/media/paratrace_ESC_2.jpg.html]
[/URL]
The fixing that Esco use for their paratrace stylus is to lap the cantilever/stylus joint then use some sort of glue to complete the connection.
Paratrace on ruby cantilever
[
URL=http://s257.photobucket.com/user/ZYXlover/media/paratrace_ESC_2.jpg.html]
Mescalito
pfm Member
Yes, I know many people have warned of the dangers of using alcohol, or, in fact, any liquid, to clean styli, BUT
If you get a hardened crud accumulation, ONLY liquid will shift it. All the other cleaners, like the AT 637, dust busters, green emery (?), brushes etcetera are useful for maintenance, but not refurbishment, i.m.o.
I've cleaned Lyras and Koetsus, plus, if I remember, Roksan and Linn (Karma) and others, by gently brushing IPA (although I think it used to be surgical spirit in the seventies, eighties and early nineties) with the aid of jewellers' loupes (and Valium !). I've yet to lose a tip (touch wood *).
However, I can well imagine that cheaper cart's which aren't crimped or socketed into their cantilevers could be vulnerable. I guess I should invest in Stylast or its equivalent to see whether this does as good a job as IPA, as they are at least formulated for the purpose.
If you hold the cart. in the right position, liquid cannot travel up the cantilever, and with IPA (or IPA/water mix), evaporation is fast.
* I say all the above with trepidation, as I have to de-gunk a Benz Ebony tomorrow morning, and I haven't a clue how Benz affix their styli to the cantilever.
I used to use the AT vibrating pad with a drop of vodka on it. Used to work a treat on my Karma & then Troika.
Chris
Mike Reed
pfm Member
That combination would have universal appeal to the fairer sex; not sure if cartridges are male or female, though ('le' or 'la'?)
Paratrace on ruby cantilever
[
URL=http://s257.photobucket.com/user/ZYXlover/media/paratrace_ESC_2.jpg.html][/URL]
Nice photo wonder where you got that from
That's good....but it won't sound like a genuine sample with the proper Koetsu parts, they just don't. Sometimes I think there are more of these 'retipped' samples around than there are the real thing. They just don't have the correct stylus shape.....
The modern koetsus don't have the same stylus shape as the originals, they also change supplier over time, so even an official koetsu rosewood bought now, today will not have a fixed point of origin in sound as it is based on supplier and who gets to do the tipping for them (assuming tips make that big a difference). They change every few years. What is a cartridge's personality even if the profile changes from products product let alone between eras and ranges?
Not an original is quite a hard thing to pin down when the point of origin is moving...
Which is more genuine? A hand made Koetsu Suigano San with a retip retaining all the coil and Alnico magnet formers, the cantilever and the body or a rebuild which is the old body but with the newest neodynium magnet and new coir assemblies and new cantilever and new stylus profile?
Not an original is quite a hard thing to pin down when the point of origin is moving...
Which is more genuine? A hand made Koetsu Suigano San with a retip retaining all the coil and Alnico magnet formers, the cantilever and the body or a rebuild which is the old body but with the newest neodynium magnet and new coir assemblies and new cantilever and new stylus profile?