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Do AV amps have a place in Hi Fi stereo?

A

avole

The wise never post on Internet forums
I ask the question because they seem to offer a lot more features, bags more power plus, of course, the chance to be deafened by your favourite movie/game.

I'm mulling an amp change (lack of remote is driving me up the wall) and am wondering whether there really is as much difference now as there used to be. I've tried an AV amp before and quickly dumped it, but that was ten years ago, and what I heard in a local AV/HiFi dealer the other day sounded pretty decent in 2 channel mode.

Plus, of course, on paper they're much better value for money.
 
I've tried a couple of AV amps in the £1000-ish price range and none of them matched the stereo quality of much cheaper stereo hi fi amps. I've reconciled myself to using a stereo hi fi amp with an AV amp for surround sound only using HT bypass mode -i.e. - stereo amp driving front channels and AV amp driving sub and rear speakers.
Since surround sound usage is less than 1% of my total listening, the stereo sound is my most important consideration.
It is possible that higher end AV amps do much better with stereo but I feel that a decent hi fi amp would alway beat a much higher priced AV amp for stereo
 
Depends on what you want out of it, if you want new or used and what you want to spend.

Pound for pound, 2 channel amps tend to be better than multichannel amps but there are a few exceptions.

All of linn's multichannel preamps are excellent and are relative bargains and the AV5125 is superb too.... And upgradable!

The 5103 has some reliability issues but given that it cost £3750 new and was good at that and can be picked up for as little as £250, it might be worth the risk (there are many more still working than not).

If it's in budget, the exotik DA/Akutate Kontrol/0 is fantastic.

Classe have made some stunning multichannel preamps too.
 
I use a processor. This allows good two channel and the other three channels to be part of the AV system. Most mid to higher AV amps/receivers have pre out which can be fed to many good two channel systems with an AV input. You then get the best of two worlds, with only a few down sides.
 
I subjectively compared a €600 Yamaha AV receiver against a NAD C326BEE and preferred the NAD.

Sighted though.
 
I had a separate Sony (can't remember the model) AV set up. Once the novelty wore off, I got tired of the speakers and their associated wires all round the room. These days I have a decent two channel system, with an optical link over to the TV/DVD for when I want a bit more oomph with film. (TV is centred between the speakers). Even my fairly hairshirt TeddyP gear has a remote volume control, and there are plenty of 2-channel amps out there with remote. The Sony amp was definitely inferior SQ-wise.
 
Max, that was my impression, too, but hopefully things have evened out since;

Secondhand or new - preferably the latter - budget around the price of an ECI 5, which I can get for 2900€.
 
They definitely have a place. The factors governing their performance as regular 2 channel amplifiers are the same as those for regular hi-fi amps. Bit wasteful though, especially for the bigger and more feature laden models if you just use them for 2 channel.
 
mudlark said:
I use a processor. This allows good two channel and the other three channels to be part of the AV system. Most mid to higher AV amps/receivers have pre out which can be fed to many good two channel systems with an AV input. You then get the best of two worlds, with only a few down sides.
Click to expand...

I use a similar configuration, I'm on my second Yamaha DSP-E800...sadly discontinued :(

This provides the rears, centre, and sub, whilst passing the L,R to my HiFi stereo amps (it has no L & R amps on board itself). I've found that blanking off the centre at the AV amp/processor is even better, putting the front three channels through my HiFi gives a way better sound than using a centre from the AV, particularly with music blurays etc.

It's a shame that no one has come out with a more up to date replacement for the old DSP-E800...or I've not spotted one
 
WAD62 said:
I use a similar configuration, I'm on my second Yamaha DSP-E800...sadly discontinued :(

This provides the rears, centre, and sub, whilst passing the L,R to my HiFi stereo amps (it has no L & R amps on board itself). I've found that blanking off the centre at the AV amp/processor is even better, putting the front three channels through my HiFi gives a way better sound than using a centre from the AV, particularly with music blurays etc.

It's a shame that no one has come out with a more up to date replacement for the old DSP-E800...or I've not spotted one
Click to expand...

Indeed, it was a no-brainier solution IMO. Some AV amps have pre outs that can serve the same purpose.
 
Personally I wouldn't give the time of day to most AV amps, but that's only based upon a fairly limited set of experiences with some a few years ago.
Have to say that I'm not expecting there to have been any dramatic improvements (regardless of the BS written in mags). At the end of the day, absolute sound quality is NOT just about silicon chip types, it's also heavily driven by the quality of the PSUs, pre-amp stages, volume controls, and most of those really haven't gone anywhere from a technology point of view.

Having said all of that, I do use Meridian processor as a stereo pre-amp and DAC, but that's only because they put genuine effort into doing a damn good job, and I rate it as good as any stereo dac/pre-amp I've come across. The fact that it also includes surround capability AND room correction is just a really nice bonus.
 
Ive been trying to get decent stereo sound out of an AV amp, and decided to buy a top of the range Pioneer sclx86 as the basis for the system. I have to say from a musical perspective it is underwhelming. Currently considering using the preouts and adding a good stereo power amp for the L&R stereo channels to see if this moves the game on significantly.
I quite fancy the Meridian 557 in the classifieds....
 
I think there are some fairly decent bits of A/V gear out there. Depends on budget and expectations. Several years ago I had an Anthem AVM-30 processor and Anthem MCA series amps for the 5 channels, and have to admit, it raised my eyebrows a bit. I felt it was actually quite good and had a lot of I/O and software goodies to tailor bass response, and all the typical do-dads one would want-maybe too many. Wasn't cheap, although I did get the AVM-30 at 1/3rd the price new on closeout.

While I wasn't much for using most of the gadgets, it certainly was very good and on normal 2-channel music and such, would have rated it very highly. It had a very good DAC section and power supply in the thing and felt like it was just a very well engineered piece of gear.

I have heard very good things about Anthems recievers too, but have not spent much time playing or listening to them. I eventually sold off the A/V system a few years ago.

I would guess that there is no reason why there cannot be very good A/V gear out there that do very good justice to music even in normal 2-channel modes, but I would expect again, a price has to be paid like any two-channel setup to get the most out of it. Also, be aware of power ratings on a lot of the A/V amps, many will rate on continuous power for 2 channels only, supplies dip when running 5 or 7 channels heavily, although it is doubtful all channels would be rocking, depending on source material of course. FWIW....
 
I run an Onkyo 608.The stereo in pure music mode is easily the equal of the Nad I used to own.I run it through B&W 8CMs with a Vortexbox and Clearaudio Emotion as sources. It is a very engaging system and a few friends have been very surprised by the quality of sound .The new Sony range and Marantz AV amps are equally as good in stereo mode. I think the gap is narrowing very quickly and high quality convergence is now easily possible,unlike 10 years ago.
Del
 
Over the years I,ve owned a Tag av32r dp , Rotel 1570, Marantz Av7005 and my current Anthem Mrx700. The Tag at the time from memory was pretty reasonable , but they all lacked clarity and messed things up for 2ch to some extent. No matter what pure direct or music mode was implemented as mentioned the best way is to bypass them.

Easily the best sound I've had from my system is direct from my modified Fusion MDAC acting as a pre.

Cost wise I,ve not ventured into the 4 to 10k processor range of Bryston and ADA or Anthem, but found the lower priced Anthem receiver meets my needs for AV.

Multi channel music I,ve not really examined in any great detail. I have a Steve Wilson 5.1 mix of Close to the Edge which via the Anthem is a real hoot. Not sure if it's just a novelty and can't justify the expenditure for the extra music channels. Where as for 2 ch music I,m far more critical and notice the slightest differences in presentation soundstage and imaging.
 
Mr_Sukebe said:
Personally .... At the end of the day, absolute sound quality is NOT just about silicon chip types, it's also heavily driven by the quality of the PSUs, pre-amp stages, volume controls, and most of those really haven't gone anywhere from a technology point of view.
Click to expand...

That's my view too, and good sound is not about maximum power output, it's about minimum power output. I.e. how does the system get from (near) silence to making music.
 
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