1. Things you need to know about the new ‘Conversations’ PM system:

    a) DO NOT REPLY TO THE NOTIFICATION EMAIL! I get them, not the intended recipient. I get a lot of them and I do not want them! It is just a notification, log into the site and reply from there.

    b) To delete old conversations use the ‘Leave conversation’ option. This is just delete by another name.
    Dismiss Notice

Cracking to bay window after double glazing

Discussion in 'off topic' started by hifinutt, Sep 26, 2021.

  1. hifinutt

    hifinutt hifinutt

    Once again can i trouble you guys over an issue . I had double glazing fitted to a family members house about 11 months ago. watched them do it and they were excellent imho . had work done before and reputable company with guarantee if go bust

    so get a phone call to say its cracking on one side and warping upstairs bay . must say it looks quite bad . Now when they put it in it had a wooden cill which they took out as integral to window . was this a mistake ?

    So contacted the company but thinking of getting RICS surveyor in , or do i need a structural surveyor . ?

    anyone had this happen ?

    pics here after being fitted

    [​IMG]br8 by , on Flickr

    br 7 by , on Flickr

    [​IMG]br 7 by , on Flickr

    now the actual window has warped at bottom and gap developing and light showing through frame

    [​IMG]br2 by , on Flickr

    [​IMG]br1 by , on Flickr

    [​IMG]br10 by , on Flickr

    [​IMG]br6 by , on Flickr

    any advice gratefully received . dont want to claim on house insurance as in my opinion its something the contractor has done to cause it
  2. slavedata

    slavedata pfm Member

    If he is a reputable contractor get in touch and ask him to resolve the problem. He probably will, if you have an issue after asking him to resolve the problem then consider a surveyor.
    hifinutt and Snufkin like this.
  3. molee

    molee pfm Member

    Something similar happened at my place. Here, the sash windows formed part of the structure of the bay (yes, heavy brickwork between upstairs and downstairs supported by timberwork as well as apex on top-no lintel). I had supported with acrò-props vertically but still managed to get a split like yours. What was also needed, as I noticed when a professional installer was working down the road, was diagonal propping as well. You show the upstairs facade but I'd bet the damage was done when the downstairs bay was replaced as this is where the real weight is borne. If so, schoolboy error on the part of a professional.
  4. Bart

    Bart pfm Member

    I agree though these people are not structural engineers or even builders so it may be worth contacts someone more knowledgeable to get an opinion on the likely cause.
  5. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    The contractor needs to fix it. Bay windows are structural members in a house, sometimes the frame itself is reinforced, sometimes there is a lintel. Either way, this one doesn't work and it's falling down.
    hifinutt and Hip-Priest like this.
  6. Metlor

    Metlor pfm Member

    Hi Phil, despite having no brickwork there's still a fair weight on there with the tile and probably lead above.

    I expect the new frames will be reinforced, they are possibly a little shorter than the originals (makes fitting easier). Can you check for any gaps between the top of the frame and the timberwork above ?

    Also frames like this are difficult to fix at the sides, they don't abut the brickwork well (needs more than foam !) and they lack the "horns" of the older timber frames, the cill and head were often left projecting the frame and built in.
    Looks like the bay could be moving out slightly in addition to dropping.
    Best of luck.
    blossomchris likes this.
  7. tiggers

    tiggers pfm Member

    I have seen this sort of thing before. People (including window contractors) don't realise how much of the structural integrity of a double bay window is the window itself. I suspect (as above) you either have a bit of movement due to the new windows being smaller than the old or (and more worryingly) the new windows are not reinforced to bear enough of the bay's sheer load. If it was me I would get the spec of the windows off the installer (sectional drawings etc.) and contact a structural surveyor to see if there is an issue. I know it's a faff, but you need to ensure any solution is the right one... with the best will in the world the window company may not even be able to give you the right information as they are not structural specialists.
    hifinutt likes this.
  8. Wolfmancatsup

    Wolfmancatsup Empire State Human

    We have a three sided bay - equal sizes (so it’s like half a threepenny bit for we oldies!) - on the ground floor only. The top of the bay is tiled. When we had new glazing fitted a few years ago the installers put external props in, removed the old windows then installed props in the corners. They then removed the external props and built the new window around these second props, so the props remain (unseen) within the window frames.
    I’m wondering if the OP’s windows have no such props and that it’s simply the PVCu/uPVC frames that are supporting the upper bay.

    hifinutt likes this.
  9. gintonic

    gintonic 50 shades of grey pussy cats

    so a bay with 6 edges?
    Wolfmancatsup likes this.
  10. clivem2

    clivem2 pfm Member

    Many bays are built around the original wooden window frame. Replacing the window often involves chopping out the wood which is providing structural integrity but rarely is any reinforcement put in place to restore structural strength.
    hifinutt likes this.
  11. simon g

    simon g Older, wiser but no longer retired

    I would recommend having a structural engineer to inspect & report:


    the window installer may well step in and rectify, but you need to be able to determine exactly what needs to be done. You then need to know that the agreed work has been done.

    If the installer won't rectify then you may well have a dispute on your hands, which could well mean needing an expert witness

    I doubt insurance covers this unless said insurance covers contractor negligence, etc and that may be hard to prove

    If the property has a mortgage then you may be obliged to tell the lender of this development.
    hifinutt likes this.
  12. gintonic

    gintonic 50 shades of grey pussy cats

    I wonder if it'll drop off and bring the whole house with it. I'd be evacuating the occupants.
    PhilofCas likes this.
  13. Wolfmancatsup

    Wolfmancatsup Empire State Human

    Ooh yes, good point! fewer than that!
    gintonic likes this.
  14. kensalriser

    kensalriser pfm Member

    I have all original windows in my 30s house and would never replace them with UPVC. Even without structural problems they are aren't really fit for purpose - you're lucky if you get more than 15 years out of them before they warp or the sealed units go. Secondary glazing is a better option for older houses or if you really need to replace, use custom made hardwood frames.
  15. gintonic

    gintonic 50 shades of grey pussy cats


    front of house, upvc 25 years, no sealed units gone, no warping although looking a bit tatty.

    rear of house upvc 15 years old, looking and behaving as new.....

    maybe I got lucky? in my 1930s house. I didn't get lucky with the rotten wooden frames that came with the house when I bought it 30 years ago
    Bob McC and Darren like this.
  16. hifinutt

    hifinutt hifinutt

    thanks guys
    really appreciate all your input , keeps me sane
  17. hifinutt

    hifinutt hifinutt

    great , have contacted a structural engineer for advice . its not always easy to know which professional you need
  18. hifinutt

    hifinutt hifinutt

    thanks metlor
    there are no gaps above and below that i can see , its just on the right side
  19. molee

    molee pfm Member

    If it’s us lot that are keeping you sane then you must be pretty close to the edge- maybe a little help from another sort of professional? Good luck with the window BTW.
  20. hifinutt

    hifinutt hifinutt

    yes Molee , i am close to the edge !! but lots of friends and you guys to talk to keeps me on track !! as i mentioned its not always easy to know if you need a surveyor or a structural engineer but i think we have established that one

Share This Page


  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice