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Computer audio - what am I missing??

gorwig

pfm Member
I recently decided to augment my Naim Cd5i with a mac running iTunes - purely for convenience really.
I ripped my 470 cds to apple lossless and am playing them from my imac via usb to the neat little Arcam rDAC and then out into a NaitXS and ATCs.
Should it sound any good? It's certainly not a patch on the cd player - am I missing something??? When I switch from mac to cd it's as if I've just removed a tog 10 duvet off my speakers!!
 
Do you play the digital output of you Naim cd player into your DAC? If not there's you answer, your dac is not as good as cd player.
 
No I don't, but forgot to say that I borrowed a £3500 Chord DAC form Audio-T and there was no great improvement.
 
Might be some silly setting on your computer. Check you don't have any EQ setting switched on.

Does it really sound like the tonality is wrong, there is treble missing, or are you just exaggerating massively?
 
You know summa isn't right.

Now when I started I only ripped a couple of CDs in different formats until I was happy before tackling my whole collection. I finalised on FLAC as this can easily be converted to WAV or woteva it also means that I am not tied into iTunes and so was able to experiment with different software for ripping and playing back. Maybe you have ripped with unsuitable iTunes configuration if so thats a lot of time wasted but it just may well be that your replay config is not at its optimum.

It should be quite easy to exceed the quality of your CD player certainly with a £3500 price tag - try a Weiss from Purite.

Cheers,

DV
 
Tenson - Yes the CD5 has a much more sparkling treble and stronger stereo image.
DV. - I ripped using apple lossles - but not with error correction checked.
 
Try playing the CD through the DAC like Sq says, if it sounds the same as playing via iTunes you've found the problem.

Not sure what the solution would be. It mirror's my experience of a Jupiter/Io vs Mac/Converter/Io (although my system hasn't really been on long enough since I got back to really compare like for like).
 
You need to figure out a way to get the bits from your computer to the dac without them going through the computer's sound card. I use ASIO on windows, not sure what it is called for Apple - check www.computeraudiophile.com, there they'll tell you.
 
There can be a number of reasons for this, including:

iTunes is not considered the best sounding of the media players available
Is the volume on the IMAC set to 100% output
connections - USB is not necessarily best (and is typically worst) try SPDIF or optical, or if you must use USB find a cable that does not have the power connections hard-wired
Are levels between the rDAC and the 5i matched - if not then the louder will typically sound better
are you using the same interconnect quality between CD and rDAC
what did you use to rip the CD's
have you turned off system sounds on the iMAC
have you checked the latency of the iMAC

..and that is just the first few that came immediately to mind

I tested an old PC and a cheapo DAC and found the sound worryingly close to my CDX-XPS, so I sold that and used the money to buy a good ADC, parts for a "silent" PC which I built myself and a basic DAC (which will be my next upgrade) - if your iMAC cannot compete pretty closely to your CD player than I suspect that the PC audio is not set up optimally

Computer audio is not like plugging in a CD player - it needs effort to set things up to ensure everything is optimal for your needs

I'd advise researching how best to set up a iMAC for audiophile listening, and then treat the iMAC like a hi-fi component in terms of positioning, cabling etc and then listen again and see how that sounds

good luck
 
tdr1975 - I'm using USB out of the mac, surely it doesn't go throughg the audio card - it's just bits right??
 
I've routed hi-rez files from the PC via the network (wired connection) to an SB Touch and into the hifi. As good as it is, it sounds dead and lifeless compared to my CDS. My CDP isn't going anywhere anytime soon;-)
 
I would be pretty surprised is a sub £200 media player would beat a CDS - it does not sound like a realistic basic on which to support CD over PC (please note I loved the CDS and felt it was the best player Naim ever made)
 
I've heard at least one CD 555 owner swearing the Touch beat his CDP. Go figure...

I have no doubt some form of computer audio will beat all CDPs one day if not already. I enjoy keeping both music and computers separate so I'm not willing to faff about with tweaking the PC....one day perhaps.
 
Dave is right when he refers to it being a faff and needing tweaking

I do find it rewards you if you make the effort, but completely understand that many people don't want all that - and to be fair computer audio is touted as being a simpler and more user-friendly alternative to physical discs, which it is until you try and get the utmost sound quality

Personally I love the tweakery aspect of it all, but ultimately I still go back to Vinyl for the best sound
 
Agree with Simon, putting your CD through the DAC would be the 1st port of call. Just like CD players not all DAC's are great, no matter what tweaks you've made already. Optical would be another thing to try out if you have a cable lying about. Especially good as you should be able to use the same cable for both Mac/CD for a direct comparison through the DAC.

There's quite a few things you can do on the software side of life with the Mac to improve things. PM me if you want some help/advice with tweaking the Mac.
 
You'll need to sort out iTunes setting, which is very simple. Just turn everything off that involves audio enhancements. Then make sure you have the volume maxed out in both iTunes and your system volume. Also check your midi player is set to output correctly. You should have it set to a minimum of 16/44.1. I keep mine set at 24/96.

My system involves: iTunes > Lavry DA11 > ADAM Tensor Deltas, it sounds way better than any of my previous CDP's, some which cost in the regions of £3-4K.
 
I'm no expert but I've just been messing around with an amp with a built in DAC and coaxial was by far the best input, USB the least good. I've found that with other DAC's I've tried that USB is poor. Presumably Keith from Purite will chip in and tell you about async USB, which I'm keen to try.
 
He's using a mac, so everyone with a windows Pc please stop confusing him by mentioning problems with things that simply do not exist on a Mac.

He's using the Arcam rDac- it is an Async USb dac.

Try playing your cd player through the dac first, then you can see if you just don't like the dac, or prefer the Naim. My expectation is that you have become quite wedded to the sound of the cd player. As there's not a lot that can make the sort of sound differences you are claiming. Bit rate, sample rate, media player, all that bumf will make as near as dammit no difference to the set-up you describe. As long as volume is at 100% in itunes and all EQ tuned off it should be perfect.

Try optical from the mac into the rDAc. The rADc does not have any form of isolation internally to separate the 5v power line in the USb cable from the signal, ie they both feed into the same chip inside the dac without being filtered or galvanically isolated. The rDAc might have DCS technology inside it, but the bits designed by Arcam are crap, so it's one of the few Async USb dacs that will highlight differences in different types of USb cable, ie those with power filters etc.

Advice- try another brand of dac..
 
I would recommend a quick go an ayrewave. Let it put all music in ram before playback and see how you get on.

iTunes is a bit of a lump.
 
SQ has the best advice. Try the DAC with the CD player if you don't like it try another DAC if you are that bothered. If you are not really ready for the leap to Dac yet just leave it and carry on with the CD player, whats the rush.
 


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