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Completely flat platter/mat.

@InSides That is one of the advantages of designing a turtable from scratch rather that having to modify somebody else's design. As I said earlier, I use a glass mat on two of my decks, but I do worry about debris on the platter; a thin felt mat offeres some protection, whilst keeping some of the advantages of the glass; I willl do some more experiments for sure!
 
Thank you InSides. On my other turntables with fixed spindles I have no trouble using a Michell clamp though I often don't bother. You're right what you say about building your own turntable from scratch but few of us have that ability or the equipment.

Wylton, I know what you're saying about debris and I used to put my records straight onto the acrylic platter until TonyL put me off several years ago. I've always used some kind of mat since then.
 
I'm going to offer an alternative hypothesis, that the contact area between the platter/mat and the record varies as it is played. The downforce from the stylus tip pushes on the area of the record beneath it, causing a localised area of greater contact. A springy mat, such as felt, may have more give, allowing the record at this point to dip, possibly giving rise to undesirable movement in the vinyl. This can be seen on a TT like the planet, where the record can visibly flex under stylus pressure. OTOH, a record clamped onto a less yielding surface may move less, providing it is not warped or bowed in such a way as it then had the potential to move.
Systemdek made a dished platter, which may or may not be better. None of this is backed up by any evidence or measurement, merely thinking out loud about observed material behaviour.
 
I use the standard rubber mat on a Technics 1200 but topped with a Rega P10 thin felt mat.
The rubber mat is needed for damping and mass to ensure the servo operates as intended but sounds a bit dead to me ears, and the addition of the felt mat counters that trait.

Interestingly, Roy Gandy has often said that felt is best and provides the best support due to thousands of fibers supporting the vinyl, unlike hard mats which leave more of the surface unsupported, because records and hard mats are never perfectly flat.
 
I'm going to offer an alternative hypothesis, that the contact area between the platter/mat and the record varies as it is played.

I’d argue it just doesn’t. If in any doubt cue the stylus on to a stationary warped record at the high-point of the warp, it won’t move. At least it won’t move at any remotely normal stylus pressure, maybe at the >4g of some SPUs or whatever, but it's going nowhere at 1.6g or anything usual.
 
I'm going to offer an alternative hypothesis, that the contact area between the platter/mat and the record varies as it is played. The downforce from the stylus tip pushes on the area of the record beneath it, causing a localised area of greater contact.

Less than 2g generally? Deflection on a standard LP? Or do you have many records pressed on Tesco's plastic carrier bags?
 
Less than 2g generally? Deflection on a standard LP? Or do you have many records pressed on Tesco's plastic carrier bags?

Vinny you do have a way with words sometimes. Everyone’s thoughts and opinions are welcome.

Anyway how are you getting on with the sorbothane pads on your Sondek?
 
.............. how are you getting on with the sorbothane pads on your Sondek?

Better than a felt mat I reckon, but I shall be listening for a few days yet before changing back to felt, and I must also recheck the arm set-up before I do.

More detailed, less background noise. Maybe. I will reserve actual judgement until after I change back.
 
I think the Sondek platter profits from a bit of damping. Try sticking the sorbothane on top of the felt mat. I used a thin neoprene mat on mine. My mate Dougie uses brown paper with felt pads on his and it sounds really good.
 
Sorbothane on felt - probably a pain as sorbothane JUST sticks to PVC, and probably better than it does to felt.
 
Yes of course but they only need to sit on the felt whilst you try a record or two. If you like the result you can work out something more permanent.
 
Jeez, you are a hard task master Chops.

Just for you, I've just changed back to the Goldring anti-stat mat - so far - not impressed. Watch this space for updates.
 
Sorbothane blobs win hands-down.

Not checked arm alignment though - must be VERY close, but I have just substituted back and forth sorbothane and felt mat.
 
I’d argue it just doesn’t. If in any doubt cue the stylus on to a stationary warped record at the high-point of the warp, it won’t move. At least it won’t move at any remotely normal stylus pressure, maybe at the >4g of some SPUs or whatever, but it's going nowhere at 1.6g or anything usual.
Yep, sure you are right, it was just a bit of lateral thinking. I was thinking in particular about some of those cheaper thin reissues that some of us may have bought in a rash moment, they are fairly wibbly wobbly soft vinyl, bit of hysteresis there possibly?
I found this, it does not really help my idea, but interesting nonetheless.
 
Less than 2g generally? Deflection on a standard LP? Or do you have many records pressed on Tesco's plastic carrier bags?
Indeed, I nearly bought one of those flexi disks that used to be given away in newspapers this weekend, but saw sense. :D
 
Indeed, I nearly bought one of those flexi disks that used to be given away in newspapers this weekend, but saw sense. :D

To be honest it isn't the mass that you suggest may cause deflection, more the duration that it would have to occur in - instantaneously essentially. That is never going to happen.
 
Jeez, you are a hard task master Chops.

Just for you, I've just changed back to the Goldring anti-stat mat - so far - not impressed. Watch this space for updates.


It's all good fun Vinny. When I can get out of bed without falling over I'm going to have a full day messing around with this.
 
Seeing the Mitchell clamps with Rega branding posts reminded me that I have one with NAD branding on it! I wonder how many companies they branded them for?
 
Seeing the Mitchell clamps with Rega branding posts reminded me that I have one with NAD branding on it! I wonder how many companies they branded them for?


They did that to differentiate between the two because the original Michell clamp wouldn't accommodate the Rega spindle. The NAD was copied off the Rega but obviously they couldn't put Rega's name on their clamp.
 
I had a tenuto on the Technics, lovely made thing but I'm not sure I could hear much of an improvement over the stock rubber mat which lives back on it now.

I did loads of back to back testing with as quick of swaps as I could manage without risking scratching or wrecking anything, and it was 50/50 whether I thought there was any change.
 


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