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Classic British Modern & Free Jazz Recommendations

From what I heard, the Pure Pleasure Glass Bead Games is likely from a digital file derived from a needle drop or at best, a tape (but not necessarily the master) that's not in the best of condition. The master tape was not made available.

I do have a few PP reissues of Strata East and Tribe albums. They are ok but none are that great. Tribe records are near impossible to find while Strata East ones are getting harder and harder. I recently saw a Shamek Farrah original going for 500 euros!

Usually in these circumstances, I'd be happy to just go with a decent CD issue rather than pay extra for a compromised LP reissue.
 
Graham H said:
I have the CD. I think it is a needle drop, or a mix of tape and needle drop. I'm allergic to needle drops, and there are more out there than engineers/labels will admit to (which is why I've been reluctant to start a thread on the recent Strata East reissues). The indicators are the grainy nature of the sound, lack of HF extension and the fact that no matter how well surface noise can be disguised by digital editing it is impossible to hide the dreaded groove wear. I'm also allergic to groove wear, something our beloved London Jazz Collector seems immune to.
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On the Vocalion site, is says that the album was "cut direct from analogue stereo tapes by renowned mastering engineer Noel Summerville" (from 3345 Mastering). What is doesn't state is the provenance of said tapes, but Mike Dutton has always been at pains to work with the best sources available. There's always the possibility that Universal wouldn't release the original master tapes...
 
poco a poco said:
You beat me to it I was going to recommend both of these at some point. I have vinyl originals of both. Plenty of great John Surman stuff and I will add Ray Russell's - Rites and Rituals from 1970 to Dragon Hill.
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Ray Russell 'Live at the ICA' features the same musicians and is a lot more intense - an amazing work of avant garde improvisation - pretty sure it's cheap-ish on vinyl when it comes up, too. I bought this years and years ago and whenever I found any other Ray Russell work, I always assumed there must be another Ray Russell, as it was so far removed from this stuff it was bizarre. But, no, I am reliably informed this is the same guy that went on to write the score for Touch of Frost and did the Jazz/Disco instrumental fusion album 'Ready or Not'. He should have spent some time in Soft Machine.
 
Another seminal free improv recording is Endgame, with Barry Guy, Howard Riley, John Stevens & Trevor Watts. This is real hi-octane stuff, and my view is that the earlier and quite distinct English free music is now being influenced by free music from elsewhere - notably Germany. I have the original JAPO LP, and may bring it to the North West audio show at Cranage tomorrow, to see what it sounds like there ;)
 
Tantris said:
Another seminal free improv recording is Endgame, with Barry Guy, Howard Riley, John Stevens & Trevor Watts. This is real hi-octane stuff, and my view is that the earlier and quite distinct English free music is now being influenced by free music from elsewhere - notably Germany. I have the original JAPO LP, and may bring it to the North West audio show at Cranage tomorrow, to see what it sounds like there ;)
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If you take this and Topography of the Lungs that you also said you would take the show will probably close early as many of the punters stampead for the exit. I suppose you could slip them into Dire Straits sleeves and claim they were a new remix? :D
 
poco a poco said:
If you take this and Topography of the Lungs that you also said you would take the show will probably close early as many of the punters stampead for the exit. I suppose you could slip them into Dire Straits sleeves and claim they were a new remix? :D
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I like the stealthiness of that plan! I don't have any Dire Straits LPs, so may have to raid a charity shop beforehand :D
 
foxwelljsly said:
But, no, I am reliably informed this is the same guy that went on to write the score for Touch of Frost and did the Jazz/Disco instrumental fusion album 'Ready or Not'. He should have spent some time in Soft Machine.
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He did a very nice album with Mo Foster and Simon Phillips, 'Centennial Park'


Some more for you:

And does this count as British jazz?
 
Seanm said:
Anyone find the pressing of Hum Dono a bit iffy? Mine sounds like it's mis-tracking whenever Norma Winstone sings.
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No problem here. I’m fact I’m surprised about the speculation about it being a needle drop - I’m not saying it isn’t, just that it doesn’t sound like it to my cloth ears.
 
I’m obviously in a minority, but to my ears the Dutton/Vocalion CD of Hum Dono sounds quite tired, like it’s an Nth copy from a master or a needle drop. I agree with Seanm, the vocals sound opaque and fuzzy and there is certainly tape saturation at certain points in the CD. However, I found this snippet from Mr T, or Tony Higgins, who was responsible for helping collate the Universal Impressed Repressed series of CDs alongside Gilles Peterson. He maintains he found the master tapes for Hum Dono, assumed lost for many years, and wanted to release it as part of the Universal series, but Setefano D’Silva decided to license it to Dutton Vocalion. I really doubt what we are hearing on the Dutton Vocalion CD is from a first generation master, (would Universal release it from their vaults?), and compared to the quality of the track that appears on Landsdowne Jazz Explosion I was quite disappointed. But as Mr. T says - at least the music is out there. No way would I pay for an original.

You can find Tony Higgins’ comments as Mr. T by scrolling down. He also makes general comments regarding Universal’s Impressed Repressed series on the Impressed feature (posting as Tony):

https://londonjazzcollector.wordpre...endell-ian-carr-phase-iii-1967-emi-lansdowne/

https://londonjazzcollector.wordpre...ressed-british-jazz-1962-72-2002-compilation/
 
Graham H said:
I’m obviously in a minority, but to my ears the Dutton/Vocalion CD of Hum Dono sounds quite tired, like it’s an Nth copy from a master or a needle drop. I agree with Seanm, the vocals sound opaque and fuzzy and there is certainly tape saturation at certain points in the CD. However, I found this snippet from Mr T, or Tony Higgins, who was responsible for helping collate the Universal Impressed Repressed series of CDs alongside Gilles Peterson. He maintains he found the master tapes for Hum Dono, assumed lost for many years, and wanted to release it as part of the Universal series, but Setefano D’Silva decided to license it to Dutton Vocalion. I really doubt what we are hearing on the Dutton Vocalion CD is from a first generation master, (would Universal release it from their vaults?), and compared to the quality of the track that appears on Landsdowne Jazz Explosion I was quite disappointed. But as Mr. T says - at least the music is out there. No way would I pay for an original.

You can find Tony Higgins’ comments as Mr. T by scrolling down. He also makes general comments regarding Universal’s Impressed Repressed series on the Impressed feature (posting as Tony):

https://londonjazzcollector.wordpre...endell-ian-carr-phase-iii-1967-emi-lansdowne/

https://londonjazzcollector.wordpre...ressed-british-jazz-1962-72-2002-compilation/
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Just a quick, probably irrelevant point, I was listening to the LP. I’ve no idea if it was from a different master to the CD.
 
Stunsworth said:
Just a quick, probably irrelevant point, I was listening to the LP. I’ve no idea if it was from a different master to the CD.
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It’s unlikely that two different masters were used but the different processes for producing the CD glass master and the LP lacquer could account for any discernible differences in the sound. I was playing the CD using a Marantz SA14SS1SE CD/SACD player - Benchmark HPA-4 headphone amp - Sennheiser HD800S headphones and I really couldn’t fault the sound. But then again at my age it’s quite possible that i’m only hearing the mid-range and no hi’s or lo’s :(
 
Vaguely related - I thought some people might be interested in this site dedicated to recording engineer Michael Gerzon who engineered a number of free improvisation releases on Incus and other labels. He died aged just 50 and Evan Parker's album Lines Burned In Light is dedicated to him.

https://www.michaelgerzonphotos.org.uk/
 
There is also a nice interview with Keith and Julie Tippett(s) in the very latest Wire magazine. The good news is that it would appear Keith is up and working again after serious illness.

So time to recommend another classic from the era, Keith Tippett - Dedicated To You.....( with Vertigo swirl and all). In my mid teens I thought this was where modern jazz began and ended. A joy from beginning to end. And so much high spirited energy, played like their lives depended on it.
 
Graham H said:
There is also a nice interview with Keith and Julie Tippett(s) in the very latest Wire magazine. The good news is that it would appear Keith is up and working again after serious illness.

So time to recommend another classic from the era, Keith Tippett - Dedicated To You.....( with Vertigo swirl and all). In my mid teens I thought this was where modern jazz began and ended. A joy from beginning to end. And so much high spirited energy, played like their lives depended on it.
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Glad to hear that he has recovered and is working again. I'll have to pick up a copy of the Wire.

I have an original 1971 copy and love - 'Dedicated to you, but you weren't listening', but I think the earlier Keith Tippett Group - 'You are here...I am there' from 1970 is even better. Dedicated has a great cover though. Both are essential. :)

And the Centipede, Keith and Julie Tippett composed, ' Septober Energy' from 1971 is good as well, but nothing can reproduce the power and energy this big band generated live. I saw the Centipede pre album debut 1970 concert at the Lyceum, when the band was enormous and the 1971 concert at the Rainbow.
 
poco a poco said:
This seems to be Mathew Taylor (Audio Grail),
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Haha, that thread brings back some memories, I think it began 12 years ago! Apologies for the dead links, I guess lost track of it. I did sell off a few pieces I'd upgraded on a while ago but of the records shown probably only about 10% or so. I'm still very interested in Jazz particularly private pressings, some of the esquire & Tempo output and still looking for the odd Lansdowne - Of all of them I've never had a copy of 'High spirits'...One day!
 
audio grail said:
Haha, that thread brings back some memories, I think it began 12 years ago! Apologies for the dead links, I guess lost track of it. I did sell off a few pieces I'd upgraded on a while ago but of the records shown probably only about 10% or so. I'm still very interested in Jazz particularly private pressings, some of the esquire & Tempo output and still looking for the odd Lansdowne - Of all of them I've never had a copy of 'High spirits'...One day!
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Have you listened to the Lansdowne Don Rendall, Ian Carr Quintet reissues? See that thread. If so would you like to comment on how they compare to the originals? Although I fear I know the answer.
 
poco a poco said:
Have you listened to the Lansdowne Don Rendall, Ian Carr Quintet reissues? See that thread. If so would you like to comment on how they compare to the originals? Although I fear I know the answer.
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I do know Gerald had the tapes, I'm not 100% about Shades of Blue as I've never seen an original pressing STEREO copy (I had believed they were all MONO) It would be odd of they tinkered with it for STEREO so perhaps there were some STEREO pressings? . I kind of wish the electric recording co had done them simply from an all analogue point of view. I've not heard the Jazz man issues but several people say they have done a nice job and considering how long they had the tapes I'd say this was a positive thing.

On the matter of UK Jazz issues (In the Rendell Carr style) this is a nice one (Available most places)

Available for the first time after it was recorded 50 years ago. (In effect this is not a re issue) the recording is as would be expected but musically is has some highlights.
 
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