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Cables (eek)

Mogreg

Mogreg

pfm Member
I’m a bit of a newbie in Hifi forum world, but I’ve observed that the mention of speaker cables, mains cables, etc, with regards to sonic improvements, seem to cause all hell to break loose, but people don’t have the same sort of issue with headphone cables. Is there a specific reason for this? I’ve never changed cables on any of my headphones, genuinely asking if I should consider it.
 
Well ... always a tricky subject - I've some pricey interconnects in my system but for headphones I've not really spent a great deal. I bought a replacement Kimber cable for my HD 650s and gave it a couple of weeks, I've now gone back to the standard cable and sold the Kimber on, I didn't hear a great deal of difference, perhaps a more 'open' treble but not enough of an improvement to justify the cost. YMMV as they say.
 
I have used stock, Moon Audio Black Dragon and Cardas Clearlight cables with a pair of Hifiman HE560 and think they did make a meaningful difference. Probably depends on the level of your 'phones and the quality of the stock cable. Got different phones now so gave the cables away as didn't fit the new ones.
 
Do manufacturers ‘cheap out’ on cables? The cables bundled with my Utopias seem like the’re well build & good quality. I guess headphones is a weird one as cables are included, whereas with amps or speakers they don’t come into the equation
 
Hello
Hifi is loads of marketing unfortunately
I'm not a cable believer , what you need is well terminated cable
Spending thousands is not the way to go IMHO
Cheers
 
I don't know what it's worth but I have a pair of Audioquest Nighthawk headphones that came with a standard copper cable & a silver (not sure if it's just silver plated or pure silver) cable.
They honk on about the benefits of the silver cable but none to sure I can hear any difference, if there is hardly big in any way.

Conversely some years ago (before Covid) I went to CanJam & was listening to some headphones (can't remember now the make o_O) but they had two identical pairs, one with a non standard third party cable & the other with the standard cable supplied. Unknowingly, not aware of this situation I picked up the pair with the third party cable attached thinking they sounded quite good & then picked up the other pair which to my ears sounded much below par. Enquiring about this I then was told that they are the same headphone but with a different lead! I was quite shocked.

Take from that what you will.
 
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per-Sony-fied said:
Conversely some years ago (before Covid) I went to CanJam & was listening to some headphones (can't remember now the make o_O) but they had two identical pairs, one with a non standard third party cable & the other with the standard cable supplied. Unknowingly, not aware of this situation I picked up the pair with the third party cable attached thinking they sounded quite good & then picked up the other pair which to my ears sounded much below par. Enquiring about this I then was told that they are the same headphone but with a different lead! I was quite shocked.

Take from that what you will.
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This is one occasion on which I agree - cables for headphones can make a difference, but for pretty simple reasons: long very skinny (for flex) wires can add significant resistance. And that can audibly alter the damping of the drivers, esp. for comparatively low-impedance cans, as are now common.

What sort of numbers ..?
... I've a pair of Senn 599SE I picked-up; they make pretty good general purpose daily use cans, if with a modern, fat slightly-to-excess sound. They are about 100ohms - but of that the standard cable contributes over 10! Replacing that with a very cheap aftermarket one, of sub- 1-ohm 'round=trip' - the low end excess warmth and mud is markedly better damped/dealt with when driven from my headphone having a very low output impedance. So to me, the £7 cable definitely helped, and I can live with these now for all sorts of purposes (since the mid/top end is low-distortion, and a fine extended balance - it's the low end that lets them down)

SImple stuff. But on say 16ohm IEMs - not uncommon - such a change is likely to be made obvious.

(the above is the long way round to saying - actually, the amps source impedance can matter quite a lot/ be an easy way to alter any headsets balance. Its much more likely than, say, speaker cable vs speakers though)
 
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martin clark said:
Replacing that with a very cheap aftermarket one, of sub- 1-ohm 'round=trip' - the low end excess warmth and mud is markedly better damped/dealt with when driven from my headphone having a very low output impedance.
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The problem is the impedance is rarely given when buying ready-made headphone cables. The 3 meter cable I have is about 1.5 ohm round trip, into 37 ohm headphones, which is probably just tolerable but not ideal. Martin, did you buy your sub-ohm cable ready-terminated?
 
Hi All,

Mogreg said:
I’m a bit of a newbie in Hifi forum world, but I’ve observed that the mention of speaker cables, mains cables, etc, with regards to sonic improvements, seem to cause all hell to break loose, but people don’t have the same sort of issue with headphone cables. Is there a specific reason for this? I’ve never changed cables on any of my headphones, genuinely asking if I should consider it.
Click to expand...

For me after market cables a more of a convenience thing more than anything else. All of my “critical listening” headphones have impedances above one hundred ohms, this means cable interactions are never an issue. On the other hand, most cables for these types of phones are usually three meters long which is a right royal P.I.A. to manage when you are sitting at a desk. Also, some thicker cables can transfer mechanical noise back into the earcups, this can be annoying because as the cable rubs across your clothes or desk top surface is creates a noises and vibrations that you can clearly hear. Beyond this I think headphone cables (like speaker cables) are becoming audiophile jewelry giving the user bragging rights rather than actually making an audible difference.

I have heard that the manufacturer of some earlier high impedance phones used to deliberately make the cables resistive. I think this was all based around conformity to EU standard 1996 IEC 61938 which is more aimed at recording studios. IEC 61938 recommends that headphones be driven from a source impedance of 120 Ohms These days IEC 61938 is very rarely referred to outside of professional studios where multiple sets of phones are likely to be driven from a single amplifier.

Planar magnetics which usually have impedances around 20 Ohms (sometime even less), these tend to operate entirely outside of IEC 61938 recommended guide lines. I could understand where cables may have an audible effect when driving very low impedance phones over long distances.

Personally, I’m pretty cable agnostic, as long as the cable is delivering a signal with a negligible voltage drop and the cable is mechanically comfortable to use then I’m happy.

martin clark said:
yes, it was this - just happened to turn out ok:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B09DYJ4YVJ/?tag=pinkfishmedia-21
Click to expand...

This one look interesting, I'm actually after a 3 meter cable with these types of terminations for my Sennie Momentum Three's, must do some more research...Thanks for the Link.

LPSpinner
 
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This site contains affiliate links for which pink fish media may be compensated.
Martin's sub-ohm cables were 1.2 meters long. Once you go to 3 meters, the resistance will be about 3 times that. I have planar magnetic headphones, so I want low resistance (that may not matter otherwise), but it seems you cannot know what you're buying until you measure it yourself.
 
Mogreg said:
The cables bundled with my Utopias seem like the’re well build & good quality.
Click to expand...

Have been cursing my Elear 3 metre cables for ages because they are too chunky and seem to get caught on sofa arms etc. The rubber coverings of the 3.5 (2.5?) mm) plugs started splitting and wires are showing on one; still work though.

The very thin cable for my HD650, again 3 metres, was made by a company (vis eBay) in Maldon, Essex for around £30. After the stock cable, which died, I find them a little flimsy, but am not aware of and sonic changes. However, pads need changing on these so hard to tell.

Have just bought (but not yet received) Utopias, where there is a fault with one of the ear-piece plugs; it still works, I gather, but the seller has included a Forza (Polish) cable as a compensatory measure. I remember reading a review of this company's expensive cables some time ago and remember that they were rated highly. The seller considers them as sonically roughly equal to the Utopia stock one. We shall see.
 
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