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Brexit and selling used gear from the EU to the UK

ff1d1l said:
The requirement to register with the UK, submit accounts to the UK and pay that assessed vat to the UK is a post brexit worldwide requirement and is pretty unprecedented. Some traders, in the US for example, are boycotting registration as they see it as setting an undesirable precedent.
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I agree. HMRC seem to be setting a worldwide precedent for this under cover of Brexit (though I've read elsehwere that the main target is China not goods coming from the EU). Be interesting if it sticks or if HMRC have to climb down on it. They love a bit of red tape.

ff1d1l said:
It requires businesses exporting to the (for now) UK to be registered with the UK for VAT. Many - most - are not bothering, as this process and the associated paperwork is too onerous.
Smaller dealers such as those selling LPs and CDs are required to pay duty in advance by the platform, eg ebay and I believe discogs. Now many listings specifically exclude the UK.
The UK is charging full duty on everything, including of interest here, second hand audio, regardless of value. You could of course try and reclaim this if you have an unfulfilled love of paperwork and being stonewalled.
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I haven't seen evidence that many businesses are refusing UK orders. There was a big splash in The Groan that some Dutch bike shop was stopping selling but that's about all Ive seen.

It's not yet been my experience that duty (as opposed to VAT, which is a different thing) is being charged on full value of everything. I've had several delveries of late of records, headshells etc, no duty applied, though they were under declared value of £135. VAT is being charged by eBay and etsy on checkout. I assume Amazon will do the same when they get their act together and may even be doing it by now - no big deal really for sellers going through large online marketplaces, but web sites selling directly will have some admin to set up for sure. If they can't be bothered then it's an opportunity for UK-based businesses to mop up the custom.
 
Almost 90s% of UK firms don't export, and the majority of those that do export to both EU and non-EU, therefore have systems in place to cope. If, therefore, some firms are run by muppets that haven't got the planning in place to know four years ahead that Brexit might require a little bit of adjustment, then I doubt they have much future anyway.

In any case, I thought the remoaner 'let's get all depressed together' echo chamber thread was already long established and there's no need for another one. The fact is we could trade links all day and never convince each other.

However, I would have thought a wee bit of self-reflection is in order after the EU fiasco that's been building for months and came to a head last week. Whether you are talking about competence or probity, the EU's reputation is in tatters. Any claims to moral superiority are long shot. I do feel a bit sorry for those emotionally attached to it but most of them are still at the denial stage in their grief, it may be a while yet before they realise just how wrong they were.
 
VAT is being charged on delivery ‘on top’ of native country VAT at source for new purchases - this is why you can add min 20% to anything you buy from overseas, EU is effectively the same as purchasing from the USA etc. This goes for Used or new items on imports also, 20% on top of the price you paid for the item minimum when landing here. Forget gift, that never worked.

Also EU member shops are not yet able to deduct the VAT at their end to make for parity when paid this end as our government want them to all sign up for UK VAT at their end (source), the added grief and paperwork for them is simply not worth it, this is why many companies are simply refusing to sell to the UK.

Brexit ...great innit
 
This is utter nonsense from start to finish.

loopster said:
VAT is being charged on delivery ‘on top’ of native country VAT at source for new purchases - this is why you can add min 20% to anything you buy from overseas, EU is effectively the same as purchasing from the USA etc.
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EU firms have always been able to drop VAT for sales outside of the EU. The same applies to, for example, the Swiss equivalent of VAT, or indeed UK VAT for non EU countries when the UK was inside the EU. Where do you get this drivel?

Of course if they choose not to, then that's extra profit margin .. in this brief period till customers wise up and change their shopping habits. They will certainly not be required to remit that extra 'VAT' charge to national authorities.

The only point you make corrrectly is that purchasing from countries within the EU is effectively the same as purchasing from the US (which was surely part of the point of Brexit) - note that in the US too, sales tax is not charged on export purchases. But the net effect is minimal, for the most part - you pay 20% UK VAT on import, not, for example, 21% German mwst at point of sale. In a handful of cases for bigger ticket items, there may also be a couple of percent of duty to pay.

loopster said:
Also EU member shops are not yet able to deduct the VAT at their end to make for parity when paid this end as our government want them to all sign up for UK VAT at their end (source), the added grief and paperwork for them is simply not worth it, this is why many companies are simply refusing to sell to the UK.
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The first part of your statement is plaing wrong, but the fact the UK government is now requiring overseas companies to register for UK VAT applies not just to EU members but to all countries globally, and was planned long before Brexit. I personally think it's an idiotic step, but it has nothing to do with Brexit other than coincidental timing and perhaps opportunistic thinking on the part of HMRC.

On the wider point I find it very really tedious that the anti-Brexit crowd should continue to display their ignorance (and their bigotry) in this way.

You lost. Four years ago. It's time you got over it.

The only thing you are achieving by praying every night for financial meltdown (to prove you were somehow 'right') is holes in the knees of your jimjams.

I started off feeling quite sorry for the losing side in the EU referendum - I know I would feel gutted if the SNP managed to pull off secession and destroy my identity as both Scottish and British - but I'm losing patience now.
 
Oh dear, another brexiteer with his head in the sand

My statement is actually based on practice since Jan 1st - try it for yourself before replying
 
I have. I bought a £450 musical instrument from Germany which arrived last week. After discussion the company dropped the VAT which was charged on the way in. No real down-side. No duty was applied (though in theory about 2% should have been and I was prepared for that).

As for C2C yes it's true that private imports from EU now attract VAT but that just puts them on the same footing as buying from non-EU countries. The secret is to negotiate a sensble declared value - I usually find that throwing HMRC a bone is best, declare at value where you pay, but not the full whack. I have always bought more from the Far East than the EU anyway as better deals on hifi are available in places like Hong Kong or Singapore where stuff was cheaper to begin with (as no VAT in the first place). I've always found that Germany in particular is a very expensive place to buy hifi of any description.
 
Getting a company to drop the VAT for a B2C EU to UK is far from the norm currently, many simply refuse to do so or worse refuse to deal with the UK as they are headless chickens to the situation, and understandably so. This is far from standard practice currently, so you dodged a bullet there, unfortunately many others will not be so lucky.

Your ‘discussion’ with them is hardly something average Jo should have to do.
 
loopster said:
Getting a company to drop the VAT for a B2C EU to UK is far from the norm currently, many simply refuse to do so or worse refuse to deal with the UK as they are headless chickens to the situation, and understandably so. This is far from standard practice currently, so you dodged a bullet there, unfortunately many others will not be so lucky.

Your ‘discussion’ with them is hardly something average Jo should have to do.
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I'm used to dealing with German companies and can deal in German language if I have to.

But I suppose if there are British companies still not ready for Brexit (hard to believe, but it seems there are) then I suppose it should be no surprise that EU companies are confused.

My purchase was over £135 which means there was no requirement to charge UK VAT and account for it, as there would be for cheaper items. I think HMRC are being ridiculous over that requirement but as I keep reminding people, it's nowt to do with Brexit - it's a new global policy. A reversion to the previous policy for non-EU countries would be sensible and no doubt many are lobbying for just that.
 
‘Nowt to do with Brexit....’

Really

I can see this will go round in circles

as long as you’re alright
 
loopster said:
‘Nowt to do with Brexit....’

Really

I can see this will go round in circles

as long as you’re alright
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I know that remoaners' favourite passtime is to collect the all ills of the world and put them at Boris's door but really this is a long-discussed change to GLOBAL arrangements for incoming packages, not just in the UK but also in the EU itself. Indeed it's the EU that largely drove the process. That's the reality. Like I said I think HMRC have implemented them badly in their specifics, especially for end consumers, but I don't believe that was any kind of political decision.

https://www.tradetaxport.com/news/the-impact-of-2021-vat-import-scheme-postal-express

It is to some degree connected to the following, which shook up postal rates globally but was primarily intended to address unfair competition from China.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/25/un-universal-postal-union-mail-deal-trump
https://multichannelmerchant.com/operations/surging-global-postal-rates-arrive-today-ready/

I read a bunch of other sites on this topic but I have more to do with my time than fish them all out.
 
montesquieu said:
It is to some degree connected to the following, which shook up postal rates globally but was primarily intended to address unfair competition from China.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/sep/25/un-universal-postal-union-mail-deal-trump
https://multichannelmerchant.com/operations/surging-global-postal-rates-arrive-today-ready/

I read a bunch of other sites on this topic but I have more to do with my time than fish them all out.
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Utter rubbish. Zero connection. You smell desperate.
I notice upthread you advocating underdeclaring value to fraudulently escape playing tax. "The secret is to negotiate a sensble declared value - I usually find that throwing HMRC a bone is best, declare at value where you pay, but not the full whack". Do you think this is legal or ethical? Tax is only for others? You object to funding the NHS, education, social welfare, the police and so on? Your contribution to society? Or are you terrified some of it may end up helping immigrants? Or do you object to paying your paying for your share of the expensive xenophobic vanity project...
You're pretty free with your pejoratives - presumably you have no objection to my similarly referring to leavers like yourself as brexshits?
 
I always pay VAT at full rate for new purchases.

Second hand stuff - where valuations are always a matter of opinion - are a grey area.

But see you deny reality is unsurprising. You are up late - holes in the knees of your jimjams again?

As for the link it’s well documented over several years, as policy responses developed.

https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Europe-targets-tax-evasion-by-Chinese-online-vendors


https://www.econstor.eu/bitstream/1...rnment to Combat VAT Evasion in Ecommerce.pdf


This is just random there’s tons of it.
 
No grey area. It's value is what you paid for it.

The jim jams thing...are you perving on me?

Sorry, your links still have zero connection to the post brexit mess. Btw theres a parallel thread with more post brexit horror stories you've never heard of. Take a look.
 
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montesquieu said:
The impact of this is minimal. VAT was always chargeable on import from anywhere outside the EU, even from within the EU customs union (eg Turkey, Norway). Additional duty (where it's charged - which is on a small subset of goods) is likely to have only a very small impact in most cases, of the order of 2-3% and then charged only on goods over £135.
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I don't think that's true. For example, I've done more than 1000 import transactions from Jamaica, each for a few hundred pounds, over the course of many years and never once been charged VAT. Whereas I am now told that, post-Brexit, it is payable.
 
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