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Best modern cartridge for SME 3009 S2 improved

rhgbristol

rhgbristol

pfm Member
I have a SME series ii 3009 Improved S2 arm, with detachable headshell.

It was made in January 1976, and fitted on a Linn Sondek LP12.

Whilst I know this arm was specifically designed for the high compliance cartridges of the day, specifically the Shure V15 III, which is in it at present, I’d like to contemplate fitting a modern day MM cartridge that can do the arm and deck justice.

Do any members here have comments or experiences of this situation?

Thanks in anticipation

Richard
 
It's not the answer that the thread title was looking for, but if you really want to "do the arm and deck justice" I'd put a modern upmarket stylus in the Shure rather than look for a modern replacement.
 
The Shure 97xe is apparently the "new" V15. it's a good cart and works well in a 3009. However as said above if you have a V15 already I'd get an upmarket stylus for that, job done.
 
Any highish compliance MM is fine, I’ve had great results with an Ortofon 540/II, the predecessor to the 2M Black (I actually rather prefer it to the Black). The Shure M97XE would be good too, as would most of the better AT MMs, and whilst a little lower compliance Nagaokas would be great too (likely my choice). I’d pick whichever matches your phono stage the best, the Ortofons and ATs want very low capacitance, the Nagaokas seem less sensitive and happy with more. Grados would be an option too.

To Be honest pretty much any MM will match a S2 Improved and IMO the arm is good enough to take a really nice one.
 
Tony L said:
Any highish compliance MM is fine, I’ve had great results with an Ortofon 540/II, the predecessor to the 2M Black (I actually rather prefer it to the Black). The Shure M97XE would be good too, as would most of the better AT MMs, and whilst a little lower compliance Nagaokas would be great too (likely my choice).
Click to expand...

Just an observation that the Nagaoka MP-11 def. does not fit a SME headshell. It's OK in an ADC etc.
 
mark121211 said:
Just an observation that the Nagaoka MP-11 def. does not fit a SME headshell. It's OK in an ADC etc.
Click to expand...

27082289788_bde967c51d_b.jpg


The MP500 certainly fits as I have one!

PS The plastic body on the cheaper models may be a little larger I guess.
 
I can't post a photo since giving up photobucket but the MP-11 with the wide plastic base def does not. The MP-500 body is in line with the stylus assy whereas the older MP-11 overhangs it and fouls the front of the SME headshell.

Lovely photo btw!
 
My deck is very similar to yours, a 1974 LP12 with 3009 S2 improved with fixed headshell. On the recommendation of Peter at Cymbiosis, he fitted an AT VM540ML. Peter advised this over the Ortofons and I have to say it sounds absolutely superb.
 
Thank you for the replies so far.

The Shure v15 III that I have already has the Jico SAS replacement stylus which I bought new just over a year ago - and admitted sounds pretty good already in the SME/Sondek combination.

I also have a newish Shure M97xe from another deck, which although sounds good, to my ears does not sound quite as 'lively' and bright as the v15.

Am interested in the comments about the ortofons - especially the 2M Black as have seen quite contrasting comments - it seems a Marmite type cartridge - despite being cited as some as 'the best you can get from MM'!

Thank you
 
I'd stick with what you have. Having said that, I used a Denon103D MC cartridge in my 3009 S2 (un-improved) and it worked remarkably well, despite what theory says.
 
sktn77a said:
I'd stick with what you have. Having said that, I used a Denon103D MC cartridge in my 3009 S2 (un-improved) and it worked remarkably well, despite what theory says.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I’ve used 103s a lot over the past 20 years or so and I honestly think it is happier in the old 3009 or 3012 than it is in a more modern “rigid” arm like a Ittok, Zeta, Rega etc (all of which I’ve tried). I used a 4.4g SME mass plate in the headshell which helped a bit too. I never got to any of the fancy body-kits etc for the 103, that would have been interesting. If I ever go back to MC carts I’d be very tempted by something like the Zu Audio 103.
 
In defense of "theory", the 103D was a much higher compliance cartridge than the rest of the 103 line. However, an ADC 26 it was not!
 
On sale there are counterweights for different cartridges.
For some, a downforce of 2.5 g is recommended.
in this tonearm downforce 1.5 gr.
where to get 2.5 g?
 
vya1964 said:
On sale there are counterweights for different cartridges.
For some, a downforce of 2.5 g is recommended.
in this tonearm downforce 1.5 gr.
where to get 2.5 g?
Click to expand...

Just use stylus scales and adjust tracking weight with the rear weight when you run out of rider-weight range. Very easy to do on the Improved as the rear weight is threaded so moves with great accuracy. Loads of digital scales available for peanuts these days (link).
 
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davidsrsb said:
The SME supplied cable has ceramic disc capacitors built into the phono plugs at one end.
Click to expand...

Not all of them by any stretch! I think that was an option. I have four 3009s, two pre-Improved, two Improved, and none have this.
 
Mine is an improved detachable headshell and nobody ever said anything about an option.
I read about it, measured with a capacitance meter and then unscrewed the phono connector sleeves to have a look. There was no labelling.
 
I would consider the M97xe a downgrade compared to a V15 with a decent stylus. A Goldring 1042 isn't really "modern" as it came out nearly 30 years ago but is still a good MM cartridge, another option is the AT 440MLb (or one of the brand new ones). A left field option would be a Stanton 881 or ADC XLM with a new Jico stylus, both were V15 rivals with a different presentation. Overall I would say the V15 is about as good as MM's get even now, other cartridges may be slightly better but it is still up with the high-end MM's
 
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