The adjustable dispersion point does seem useless to me. I was not going to do that for my speakers. The amazing thing here is the incredibly uniform and controlled dispersion in 'narrow mode'. You will not see that kind of controlled directivity right across the range from any other speaker. It's not just a case of turning off the side speakers to have narrow dispersion, the side drivers are steering the sound that spills around from the front drivers though controlled phase and delay. Sure you can get a large horn, but that has equally large spacing between each section and also other issues from long horns.
B&O rewrites the loudspeaker rule book
- Thread starter Jonboi
- Start date
merlin
Avatar changed - Town names deemed offensive.
Adjustable dispersion allows you to take advantage of good rooms and to ameliorate the issues inherent in bad ones. That's just for starters.
The price is for the research that has gone into developing the software to achieve genuinely useful results I suspect. People's time has to cost money. I know that's a foreign idea in today's world of free access to many people's work but without people making a living out of R&D there will be no progress.
And I suspect the 70 is progress in some important areas. Ever since the early days, dispersion has clearly been one of the biggest issues with domestic audio reproduction. The room interferes increasingly and the crossover points dictated by typical components make polar responses on multi driver arrays a compromise at best.
Anything that allows you to reduce the level of compromise is a good thing IMHO and if someone has spent years in a laboratory working out a system that does just that then I think we should be prepared to pay for it. Afterall, there's a lot of old codgers on here who would happily pay double the normal amount simply because their favourite brand put the components in two shiny boxes rather than one
WRT Tenson, of course you won't be going for it. With all respect you don't have the equipment required to even start a project like that. You work within your own confines and we respect that. But that doesn't have to stop those with proper facilities making attempts at genuine steps forward in accurate sound reproduction.
The price is for the research that has gone into developing the software to achieve genuinely useful results I suspect. People's time has to cost money. I know that's a foreign idea in today's world of free access to many people's work but without people making a living out of R&D there will be no progress.
And I suspect the 70 is progress in some important areas. Ever since the early days, dispersion has clearly been one of the biggest issues with domestic audio reproduction. The room interferes increasingly and the crossover points dictated by typical components make polar responses on multi driver arrays a compromise at best.
Anything that allows you to reduce the level of compromise is a good thing IMHO and if someone has spent years in a laboratory working out a system that does just that then I think we should be prepared to pay for it. Afterall, there's a lot of old codgers on here who would happily pay double the normal amount simply because their favourite brand put the components in two shiny boxes rather than one
WRT Tenson, of course you won't be going for it. With all respect you don't have the equipment required to even start a project like that. You work within your own confines and we respect that. But that doesn't have to stop those with proper facilities making attempts at genuine steps forward in accurate sound reproduction.
Rodney gold
Im just me...
The technology appeals to me big time.. even with a whole lot of assembled components it would be well nigh impossible to build a like type system..
I would consider replacing my Giya G1's with a set of these.. for SQ alone..
I truly dislike the looks of the 90.. has not grown on me ...
Giyas also "contoversial" in looks , some love em , some hate em , but in the flesh its another story compared to pics.. perhaps the same with the 90's
I think this is a very innovative product , I have been playing with digital room correction and DSP since the Sigtech days in the mid 90's .This is a quantum leap way beyond that...
Regardless of all the above guff.. it still remains to be heard .. I doubt our local agents in South Africa will have a pair , but you never know..
I would consider replacing my Giya G1's with a set of these.. for SQ alone..
I truly dislike the looks of the 90.. has not grown on me ...
Giyas also "contoversial" in looks , some love em , some hate em , but in the flesh its another story compared to pics.. perhaps the same with the 90's
I think this is a very innovative product , I have been playing with digital room correction and DSP since the Sigtech days in the mid 90's .This is a quantum leap way beyond that...
Regardless of all the above guff.. it still remains to be heard .. I doubt our local agents in South Africa will have a pair , but you never know..
Singslinger
pfm Member
Has anyone seen the prices that Swiss companies like FM Acoustics, Soulutions and darTzeel charge for their gear?
Not to mention that Naim's Statement amp RRP is US$240,000.
Not to mention that Naim's Statement amp RRP is US$240,000.
Beobloke
pfm Member
There is also the point that you're not getting "a pair of loudspeakers" for £54,000. You're getting a pair of loudspeakers, an 8000W per channel power amplifier and a remote controlled preamplifier with six inputs and DSP for £54,000.
Analog Domain (as one example) will sell you a pair of power amplifiers that can generate 8000W per channel - I know as I've drooled over them many times at the Munich High End Show. IIRC, they're somewhere around 170,000 Euro per pair - in this context the Beolab 90s don't seem quite so dear...
Analog Domain (as one example) will sell you a pair of power amplifiers that can generate 8000W per channel - I know as I've drooled over them many times at the Munich High End Show. IIRC, they're somewhere around 170,000 Euro per pair - in this context the Beolab 90s don't seem quite so dear...
Werner
pfm Member
You are getting a system. The source is immaterial, and lives in the home's IT infrastructure anyway. (Which is the future of hifi: speaker-things, and nothing else.)
Now how much have each of us spent on our present system? Past systems?
Jonboi
Because Music Matters
In my experience, B&O owners fall into a number of different camps - and speaking very generally, - an atypical B&O owner/prospective purchaser does not appear to possess an obsessive audiophile mindset, nor does the company market to audiophile hobbyists as such.
There are the collectors of the old and rare, such as one might collect rare design antiques.
Then there are those with a love of music and film, who have the resources to purchase something that rewards that love in a very authentic manner, looks stunning, fits aesthetically into a beautiful home and is a fully integrated, one stop shop AV solution - no mixing and matching required.
Younger, very tech savvy professionals seem attracted to the technical and design solutions offered by the BeoPlay line which in turn is doing very well for B&O.
And then there is a smaller niche of owners who are what one might call 'ex' audiophiles - those who've invested a lot of time and money building up separates systems often far exceeding the value of anything B&O has to offer, and either failing to ultimately find satisfaction, or just tiring of the whole mix and match 'upgrade' ladder and tendency for the hobby to become quite obsessive, and got off the audiophile roundabout, and settled down very happily with B&O, for a fiddle free integrated HiFi/AV system, but one of very high aesthetic, technical and audio quality.
It would be easy to stand from the sidelines and see B&O as being a 'cult' as has been alluded to, but in my experience B&O are not and never have been in the business of marketing to audiophile hobbyists per se, despite their technical abilities as a company, - but rather the music and film connoisseur looking for a complete audio/AV solution built to the highest technical and aesthetic standards.
I am in little doubt that whilst the BeoLab 90 is a 'concorde moment' - in terms of a Halo product that showcases what the company can really do in terms of technical and acoustic breakthroughs, that the real benefits will come as this technology filters down into lessor models to come.
However, whilst they may not sell many to mix and match audiophiles, I have little doubt that the Beolab 90 will sell very well to the music and film connoisseur with the resources to do so, and the knowledge and understanding of the technology to appreciate the value (relatively speaking v's contemporary high end audio) on offer.
Cheers
John...
There are the collectors of the old and rare, such as one might collect rare design antiques.
Then there are those with a love of music and film, who have the resources to purchase something that rewards that love in a very authentic manner, looks stunning, fits aesthetically into a beautiful home and is a fully integrated, one stop shop AV solution - no mixing and matching required.
Younger, very tech savvy professionals seem attracted to the technical and design solutions offered by the BeoPlay line which in turn is doing very well for B&O.
And then there is a smaller niche of owners who are what one might call 'ex' audiophiles - those who've invested a lot of time and money building up separates systems often far exceeding the value of anything B&O has to offer, and either failing to ultimately find satisfaction, or just tiring of the whole mix and match 'upgrade' ladder and tendency for the hobby to become quite obsessive, and got off the audiophile roundabout, and settled down very happily with B&O, for a fiddle free integrated HiFi/AV system, but one of very high aesthetic, technical and audio quality.
It would be easy to stand from the sidelines and see B&O as being a 'cult' as has been alluded to, but in my experience B&O are not and never have been in the business of marketing to audiophile hobbyists per se, despite their technical abilities as a company, - but rather the music and film connoisseur looking for a complete audio/AV solution built to the highest technical and aesthetic standards.
I am in little doubt that whilst the BeoLab 90 is a 'concorde moment' - in terms of a Halo product that showcases what the company can really do in terms of technical and acoustic breakthroughs, that the real benefits will come as this technology filters down into lessor models to come.
However, whilst they may not sell many to mix and match audiophiles, I have little doubt that the Beolab 90 will sell very well to the music and film connoisseur with the resources to do so, and the knowledge and understanding of the technology to appreciate the value (relatively speaking v's contemporary high end audio) on offer.
Cheers
John...
Rodney gold
Im just me...
16hz to 45khz
at levels Above the threshold of hearing pain...
at levels Above the threshold of hearing pain...
Rodney gold
Im just me...
John.. dunno , I would never have considered buying a B&O speaker or product and Im pretty much a hard core dyed in the wool audiophile.. but this is something different....
adamdea
You are not a sound quality evaluation device
I agree
and with this
I also agree.
Bottom line- if I had $54k to spend on hifi I would be thinking very seriously about this. I am really hoping that in 12 months time something like this this may get to say £10k when I really might think very hard. If the cost is down to amortising the R&D then that implies that the cost will come down a long way some time.
Jonboi
Because Music Matters
I trust my comments didn't come across as elitist in any way, and I would apologise in advance if they were construed as such; I was simply trying to address what I've observed over the years, and as an now B&O owner, the general B&O owner mindset/demographic.
Whilst being dismissed as an lifestyle product (and in my dyed in the wool audiophile days I did the same) a closer investigation reveals B&O as a company to be almost without peer - apart perhaps from the likes of Harmon International, - when it comes to R&D and general audio engineering and acoustic expertise - I have no regrets moving to B&O as an ownership/audio performance perspective whatsoever.
And as you say - this new speaker is something very different indeed..quite the design/acoustic breakthrough in many regards in my view...
Cheers
John...
YNWOAN
100% Analogue
I've just been reading his blog - very interesting it is too - highly recommended (thanks for the link).
Werner
pfm Member
I wouldn't hold my breath. 18 drivers. 18 amplifiers. 18 DACs. All there for a reason. Cutting out some of them will harm the product.
I think the main benefits from the '90 are in demonstrating that 1) yes, this approach is now feasible and no longer the domain of wishful thinking and 2) verifying if this approach really is what is needed for the average room. This may trigger other manufacturers into looking at this route, and who knows what they may dream up. What will the next (bigger?) Kii speaker be like, for example.
It looks like we are finally getting away from the monkey coffins.
Well .. I've just heard the current one and it was extremely disappointing, so I wouldn't hold out any hopes just yet .. they have a lot of work to do, starting with the midrange.
darrenyeats
pfm Member
This is going to be unpopular! I read installment #1 of the blog about ABL. They lost me there.
Adjusting the signal as loudness increases to manage distortion is not for me. This is not high fidelity. And yes, I know Devialet do that too - also not for me.
I'm in my 40s BTW! Not an old fuddy-duddy. Not physically anyway.
Just turn the bloody volume down a bit. Or buy a bigger speaker that can handle it.
PS: Before anyone suggests it, I quote: "It is important to note that it is not the case that this replaces ... equalising for Equal Loudness Contours (sometimes called 'Fletcher-Munson Curves')." That's a separate bun fight.
Darren (intentionally mischievous and devil's advocate!)
Adjusting the signal as loudness increases to manage distortion is not for me. This is not high fidelity. And yes, I know Devialet do that too - also not for me.
I'm in my 40s BTW! Not an old fuddy-duddy. Not physically anyway.
Just turn the bloody volume down a bit. Or buy a bigger speaker that can handle it.
PS: Before anyone suggests it, I quote: "It is important to note that it is not the case that this replaces ... equalising for Equal Loudness Contours (sometimes called 'Fletcher-Munson Curves')." That's a separate bun fight.
Darren (intentionally mischievous and devil's advocate!)
Purité Audio
Trade: Purite Audio
I read your comment, In my experience I have never heard a product that measures so well, sound as poorly as you describe, but I didn't hear them in that room.
Keith