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Audio Note CD Transport/DAC

Don't forget the Moon 260dt. Personally I prefer a 10 year warranty (3 on the moving parts) than 1 year on some others.
 
Don't forget the Moon 260dt. Personally I prefer a 10 year warranty (3 on the moving parts) than 1 year on some others.
Definitely worth bearing in mind. In my case, I hedged my bets by buying a second mechanism which is easy to change. Warranties are good peace of mind, but not the only route.
 
Audio note are supposed to be releasing a new belt drive transport one day. I have a CEC transport into dac 5, Jimro and avantgarde horns. It is the most dynamic, energised and musically engaging system I’ve ever owned. I also have a maxed lp12 stiletto/ klimax radical etc. at this point it comes down to individual software.

I have a DCS setup in another room With active speakers. Technically better and thoroughly enjoyable in a different way but with the right system the audio note dac is magic and the CEC transport is a really compelling alternative to the AN transports, I have no regrets. The cdt3 transport is a bit of a sweet spot by all accounts.
 
It also easily answers the question of whether cd transports matter (in SQ sense). Absolutely. That being compared (admittedly to aural memory) to the Cambridge CXC. That was very good indeed (into Denafrips Venus II) but the CD2Tmk3 is quite a bit better.

I already know cdt's make a difference ;) just out of curiosity have you bought a spare laser?
 
Audio note are supposed to be releasing a new belt drive transport one day. I have a CEC transport into dac 5, Jimro and avantgarde horns. It is the most dynamic, energised and musically engaging system I’ve ever owned. I also have a maxed lp12 stiletto/ klimax radical etc. at this point it comes down to individual software.

I have a DCS setup in another room With active speakers. Technically better and thoroughly enjoyable in a different way but with the right system the audio note dac is magic and the CEC transport is a really compelling alternative to the AN transports, I have no regrets. The cdt3 transport is a bit of a sweet spot by all accounts.
I used to own an CEC belt drive with Audio Note BOTL DAC and a Theta DAC... Remember it fondly.
 
Peter was the UK Importer and close friend to Peter Snell - he bought the speaker rights to the original Snell models when Voecks.......


You don't say, hence my post. Don't forget to mention the bits where the UK courts let him steal the designs and naming rights of AN japan through a no show.
 
You don't say, hence my post. Don't forget to mention the bits where the UK courts let him steal the designs and naming rights of AN japan through a no show.

Well this issue with Kondo and PQ has come up several times over the years. But the fact is that without PQ YOU and I would never have likely heard about Audio Note because the only products that Kondo San actually made were amplifiers that cost $89,000+ back in the 1980s - Their company formed in the mid-70s and until PQ was a partner no one in the western world - no one - had ever heard of the company for the 14 years prior to PQ's involvement.

A company working in a 3-4 man shop in Japan. PQ was the investor who put up all the money and took all the risk - he should get something - and it's not like he was a neophyte he already formed and owned his own tube manufacturing company in Audio Innovations - himself losing control of his company to investors. The people who put up the money own the company. Audio Note UK is the only reason people know about Audio Note.

Peter told his side and why he felt he had to sue Kondo - he says he put up the vast majority of the money and had the majority of the employees' livelihoods on the line to protect as well as his own.

One important note - there was already an Audio Note UK in 1990 which imported Audio Note Japan - The company parted ways in 1997. "Since 1990 there were two Audio Note companies, one of which developed and produced its own products under the name Audio Note in the UK and which also specified and distributed Audio Note Japans products and the original company in Japan." The Audio Note UK gear was the side that was producing and selling most of the products - none of which was designed by Kondo-San. This is the stuff that most people could actually afford and not the $89,000-$250,000 products.

It frankly baffles me that anyone with an IQ higher than 60 could come away drawing a conclusion that Kondo is in the right.

https://db.audioasylum.com/mhtml/m.html?forum=general&n=36887&highlight=magpies+Peter+Qvortrup&r=&search_url=/cgi/search.mpl?searchtext=&b=AND&topics_only=N&author=Music&forum=ALL
 
Like it baffles me that anyone with a moral compass could see it as any more that stepping on the shoulders of giants.
 
It frankly baffles me that anyone with an IQ higher than 60 could come away drawing a conclusion that Kondo is in the right.

The unwanted answers to your rhetorical statement are - not everyone knows of the account you link, those that do are chiefly acquainted with ANUK's take on the subject, and, well... some of us have had dealings with one of the parties to the 'debate' and have formed their own opinions of their integrity and business practices which may predispose us to a certain lack of sympathy, shall we say...?

Some of the equipment is damn good though, for sure.
 
The unwanted answers to your rhetorical statement are - not everyone knows of the account you link, those that do are chiefly acquainted with ANUK's take on the subject, and, well... some of us have had dealings with one of the parties to the 'debate' and have formed their own opinions of their integrity and business practices which may predispose us to a certain lack of sympathy, shall we say...?

Some of the equipment is damn good though, for sure.

Not unlike a friend's marriage that ends in divorce - you listen to both sides and perhaps you side with one over the other. Since Kondo-San made a post on AudioAsylum - PQ then replied and there was no rebuttal. So most people are left with just those statements. Since Kondo-San passed we will get no further information.

What we have only are the products. I suppose my point here is that the only products most folks can actually afford are those from AN UK - so it's kind of a moot point. Their best-selling amplifier was/is the Meishu (designed and made by AN UK). It's not cheap but it's doable for a lot more audiophiles than the Kondo or upper AN UK stuff.

Having auditioned the flagship amplifiers from Gryphon, D'Agostino, Constellation, Boulder, Bryston, Sim Audio, Nagra, Soullution, Edge, ARC, BAT, Naim, Classe, YBA, Sugden, Bricasti, Parasound, VTL, Ypsilon, CH Precision, LAMM, darTZeel, Goldmund, etc - the Meishu Tonmeister sure comes off as a bargoon from a sound perspective in comparison to these SS amplifiers. And it helps that in 10 years you'll be able to sell the Meishu Tonmeister for what you paid. I can sell my 2003 OTO for $500 more than I paid for it back then! I sold my AN J/Spe speakers for $2917 (I paid $2,500) back in 2003. I sold my TT2 turntable for $300 more than I paid. So when folks say it's expensive I think "really?"

One of the reasons I got out of the business world was that that world has an "ethics unto itself" where it is mostly built on an eat or be eaten approach.
I just don't believe someone who runs a business or signs a contract is naive enough not to know that the investor gets control. It's the same for movies - the people who put up the money usually get the say over how the film gets made (from casting the cast to choosing the director to change the ending) - not the writer and not the director. Peter is a nice guy but he's also the kind of guy you don't want to cross.

I watched a documentary from the series "The Movies that Made Us" and one episode was on Pretty Woman - a smash hit rom-com that made the studio rich. The original script was called 3000 and was a far darker film - This original movie probably would have made peanuts at the box office if they made it - granted it may have been a better film for film buffs and film critics but it would not have made money and barely anyone would see it. The point is Disney put up the money and Disney changed the script and Disney owned the film.

Whenever dealing with any sort of investor you better hire a lawyer to go through the contracts with a fine-tooth comb and not let the contract run out with nothing signed. Two Canadian singers got screwed over by their record label - Amanda Marshal and Alannah Myles who put out a smash hit albums basically got screwed over and largely ended their careers in music (minor comebacks for both of them in later years). Granted these are musicians not business people so they perhaps are easier to trick. So it goes - we'll never know the whole truth.
 
I love the way you frame PQ as the saviour of tube amp design bravely fighting against the tyranny of expensive elitist tubes amps from the land of the rising sun. Shame he had to take the old guys designs, product names and brand to do it.
 
Well this issue with Kondo and PQ has come up several times over the years. But the fact is that without PQ YOU and I would never have likely heard about Audio Note because the only products that Kondo San actually made were amplifiers that cost $89,000+ back in the 1980s - Their company formed in the mid-70s and until PQ was a partner no one in the western world - no one - had ever heard of the company for the 14 years prior to PQ's involvement.

A company working in a 3-4 man shop in Japan. PQ was the investor who put up all the money and took all the risk - he should get something - and it's not like he was a neophyte he already formed and owned his own tube manufacturing company in Audio Innovations - himself losing control of his company to investors. The people who put up the money own the company. Audio Note UK is the only reason people know about Audio Note.

Peter told his side and why he felt he had to sue Kondo - he says he put up the vast majority of the money and had the majority of the employees' livelihoods on the line to protect as well as his own.

One important note - there was already an Audio Note UK in 1990 which imported Audio Note Japan - The company parted ways in 1997. "Since 1990 there were two Audio Note companies, one of which developed and produced its own products under the name Audio Note in the UK and which also specified and distributed Audio Note Japans products and the original company in Japan." The Audio Note UK gear was the side that was producing and selling most of the products - none of which was designed by Kondo-San. This is the stuff that most people could actually afford and not the $89,000-$250,000 products.

I don't think your mention of pricing is actually strictly correct from the 1980s/90s. I dealt with two Japanese clients in the 1990s and both said "how come Audionote (Kondo designed) amplifiers are so expensive outside of Japan?". While they were still expensive, I recall seeing Ongaku's being sold for around £10k in Japan.
 
Not unlike a friend's marriage that ends in divorce - you listen to both sides and perhaps you side with one over the other - we'll never know the whole truth.

A wise man once told me when it comes to divorce that there is three sides to every story, his side, her side and the reality of what happened, at least your last sentence is accurate though.
Obviously you're an ANUK fan and there's nothing wrong with that, each to their own as they say but perhaps PQ and ANUK would have been viewed more favourably had he have thought up his own name for his company.
Perhaps if he hadn't of just bought others designs, Snell, Systemdek and Voyd he would have garnered more respect within the audiophile community.
I'd have to disagree with comments on the Voyd Ref, I owned one twenty years ago in around the same time as you auditioned one, it was clearly surpassed by a NA Hyperspace in the context of my system and IMHO, but like most things in audio these were my subjective findings.
I've heard a few of the Audionote designs, Oto se, Meishu, Ongaku and the Zero system, all in around 15-20 years ago, while they all sounded okay I didn't buy any of them or buy into what was being sold, my observations were based on listening alone, I had no knowledge of the debacle between Kondo San and PQ.
 
My only experience with Audionote is at shows, a room I walk into and walk straight back out again, what's all the fuss about.
 
A wise man once told me when it comes to divorce that there is three sides to every story, his side, her side and the reality of what happened, at least your last sentence is accurate though.
Obviously you're an ANUK fan and there's nothing wrong with that, each to their own as they say but perhaps PQ and ANUK would have been viewed more favourably had he have thought up his own name for his company.
Perhaps if he hadn't of just bought others designs, Snell, Systemdek and Voyd he would have garnered more respect within the audiophile community.
I'd have to disagree with comments on the Voyd Ref, I owned one twenty years ago in around the same time as you auditioned one, it was clearly surpassed by a NA Hyperspace in the context of my system and IMHO, but like most things in audio these were my subjective findings.
I've heard a few of the Audionote designs, Oto se, Meishu, Ongaku and the Zero system, all in around 15-20 years ago, while they all sounded okay I didn't buy any of them or buy into what was being sold, my observations were based on listening alone, I had no knowledge of the debacle between Kondo San and PQ.

Well, I try to look at both sides of most any issue - but with this topic, it's hard because I have met Peter several times and Kondo-San passed away - so all I have to go on is a couple of posts on a forum. The truth may be somewhere in the middle. And of course one has to keep their one bias in check and realize that I am not "in the know."

As for the other stuff like buying the rights to systemdeck of Snell speakers - unlike many companies AN has always stated up from that that is exactly what they're doing. I remember reviewing a pair of Shengya Monoblocks from China and I saw the same ones at an Audio Show under the name Vincent. I asked them about it and they denied it was made in China - then when I got home I found out that indeed they are all made by Shengya. They claimed they invented the Hybrid CD player in Germany but no - Shengya was building the CD player 4 years before Vincent was ever a company. Then the Theta Data Universal was raved about by Robert Harley then of Stereophile - turns out they took a Philips Laserdisc player, case and all, and simply stuck the entire player into their own case and charged 10 times the money - their sole contribution was adding a SPDIF output. I don't have a problem with not reinventing the wheel just for the sake of it.

As for Sound Quality - well I hated the sound of Audio Note when I first heard it and I have been to shows and demos where it wasn't very good - so it goes. In an extreme case I ranked both MBL and YG Acoustics as two of the worst rooms at an Audio Show and the very next show - I ranked them at the top (tie for best) . Corner speakers and omni-directionals and dipoles will tend to be more of a slave to the room acoustics qualities - the music played, which order the speakers were auditioned on a particular day - after 12 other rooms close to lunch and you're hungry is worse than hearing them second after breakfast. AN typically presents with music they like - not with audiophile recordings from the Diana Krall catalogue - Zu Audio often presents off-the-beaten-path music (like noise metal).

At the California Audio Show in 2017, I talked to a fellow reviewer who didn't like the AN room - that I quite liked - so I thought "that's odd" - I took him back there and played my music and he was blown away - choosing it top 3. A simple shift from the show runner's low volume classical affair (no doubt so he could talk to people) - I drive them out of the room. This isn't to say only loud rock is the answer but there are too many people and yacking and distractions. On room was especially annoying as after every single track the sales guy would stand up and tell everyone every single item in the system and a short sales pitch - really? Just put an item/price list on the door and play the damn songs. But again this annoyed me but may not annoy someone else - and if you are annoyed in any way that influences your opinion on the gear.

And since Audio Note is a kind of "cult" like Linnies in the 1980s then there is already a kind of bias rolling around in the old "id" pro or con before one even listens. There are so many biases we bring into the rooms. One guy I met refuses to even listen to boxed speakers - he's a Magenpan fan and no one is convincing him that any box from anyone at any price is better. So when he listens to a box it is automatically bad.

Sometimes it's that first impression of something that connects - for me as a SS owner growing up with SS gear - it was a pseudo blind audition with the Meishu that I thought was a SS amp that turned me around - if I had known it was a 300B 8 watt SET before I listened - I am quite sure I would have written it off as a silly tube amp because I was a SS measurements are all-important guy. My expectation bias was taken out of the equation.

In the end there is a reason why there are so many companies - I have yet to come across anything that satisfies everyone - regardless of price.
 


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