naimplayer
Aspiring to be a halfwit.
So not your assertion then?
Good luck stay safe.
Good luck stay safe.
Anti Woke movement grows
- Thread starter ks.234
- Start date
Frizzy
Liberal anarchist
Worrying thing about the current mood is that kier starmer is pissing in the wind.
No one knows what Labour stands for, and no one cares.
The recent furore over foreign aid cuts shows the official opposition are back bench tories.
Once the snp leave socialism dies, in part labours annihilation in Scotland started with their move to the right in a forlorn attempt to steal the tories clothes.
Labour would kill for a leader that had a ounce of charisma!
No one knows what Labour stands for, and no one cares.
The recent furore over foreign aid cuts shows the official opposition are back bench tories.
Once the snp leave socialism dies, in part labours annihilation in Scotland started with their move to the right in a forlorn attempt to steal the tories clothes.
Labour would kill for a leader that had a ounce of charisma!
Marchbanks
Hat and Beard member
I must admit that if I were a Labour Party grandee it would worry me that a substantial number of people still can’t spell the leader’s name.
Tony L
Administrator
In fairness Keir can’t spell it himself according to iPad OS spell check. Kier is fine though.
PS FWIW my spelling is so poor iPad OS often can’t even figure out what word I mean and I have to google it. Google seems to have far better AI in that regard.
Nick_G
pfm Member
Marchbanks
Hat and Beard member
How tricky would it be to come up with a lovable, self-deprecating campaign to heighten your profile? Say ‘I before E except after K’? That took me thirty seconds on my own, but I’m sure they can do better with their dedicated focus groups. Although they can have that one if they speak to my agents about terms.
Joe Hutch
Mate of the bloke
And sitting around talking shite for three years, ofc. That's what I did, at any rate.
miktec
retired
Also no one even remotely interested in why the fook such a hopeless anachronism was there in the first place - about as out of place in a Student Common Room in the 21stC as a bust of Karl Marx ...
Perhaps the whole thing is just a very tiny whirl in an even tinier teacup (Alice style...)
oldius
Manchester City, dogs, family and food.
And that is the point - the wider public does not want change even though the statues represent a past in which humanity was plundered, under threat of torture, mutilation or death, and the profits used to build great houses, monuments and universities. The past cannot be airbrushed, as it has been for centuries, because young people are becoming more enlightened and knowledgeable in that way. Personally, I think the statues should remain but the truth be told, in all its nuance, with a plaque beside them. I do not want to hide our past, I want to share it so that we and others learn from it.
In my view, the language you choose: craze, elite, privilege, no one but themselves and out of step is some of the language used by the right-wing press to shoot the messengers so the message doesn't get heard; we need to avoid that path as a society.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
It’s white pensioners stomping around with faces like thunder because they can’t go on holiday and their putting two fingers up to them Europeans hasn’t gone as expected. Now the same sort inside the Tory Party and the right wing tabloids are manufacturing outrage for them to drink like warm bitter.
Someone should tell them they and their prejudices have had their day and ask if they would have the decency to just STFU now.
Cheese
Bitter lover
The wider public is alt-right, you know.
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
They really can’t do that. Partly because they think they have to listen to legitimate concerns etc but mostly because the alternative - change the conversation - is something they really don’t want to do: what on earth would they talk about?
So it’s all a bit academic as regards Labour. The rest of us have to decide what we want to do in the face of this storm of made up outrage and I’ve decided to just ignore most of it: I’ll take a stand when these things hit the institutions I’m involved with but I’m not going to waste time trying to talk angry right wingers out of their coronaries. I admire your patience but we’ve got years of this to come: you’ll wear yourself out before they do, this is all they have!
My disagreement is not about the Labour Party, but the significance of the anti woke movement.
Individual expressions of antiwokery, such as the Mail Headlines, might seem unimportant on their own, but that add up to a culture of aggressive intolerance and the propagation of lies.
I agree that Labour has positioned itself onto a place where it’s incapable of action, it seems incapable of taking a stand on anything at a macro level and even when it opposes government on specific things, it can only criticise on a micro level and those criticisms are quickly forgotten, but that is their problem.
On a larger level the Tories are winning hands down and the vehicle they are now using to drive their advantage forward, to create a society divided on social and racial justice, is antiwokery. Soon they will have their own TV station headed by Andrew Neil with an explicit antiwoke agenda. This is an agenda to attack those who are pro social and racial justice. This is an agenda to preserve a myth of our national greatness. This is an agenda to prevent any discussion about our history that does not fit the myth.
This agenda is an attempt to drive any discussion of social or racial justice into a cul de sac surrounded on all sides by Tory ideologues and a compliant media
We have seen evidence that groups of Tory MPs are attempting to create a movement that rewrites history, not least from @oldius about a worker for the National Trust being harangued by complains for providing historical context.
Rewriting history is not insignificant, it’s the tool of tyrants
oldius
Manchester City, dogs, family and food.
My disagreement is not about the Labour Party, but the significance of the anti woke movement.
Individual expressions of antiwokery, such as the Mail Headlines, might seem unimportant on their own, but that add up to a culture of aggressive intolerance and the propagation of lies.
I agree that Labour has positioned itself onto a place where it’s incapable of action, it seems incapable of taking a stand on anything at a macro level and even when it opposes government on specific things, it can only criticise on a micro level and those criticisms are quickly forgotten, but that is their problem.
On a larger level the Tories are winning hands down and the vehicle they are now using to drive their advantage forward, to create a society divided on social and racial justice, is antiwokery. Soon they will have their own TV station headed by Andrew Neil with an explicit antiwoke agenda. This is an agenda to attack those who are pro social and racial justice. This is an agenda to preserve a myth of our national greatness. This is an agenda to prevent any discussion about our history that does not fit the myth.
This agenda is an attempt to drive any discussion of social or racial justice into a cul de sac surrounded by Tory ideologues.
We have seen evidence that groups of Tory MPs are attempting to create a movement that rewrites history, not least from @oldius about a worker for the National Trust being harangued by complains for providing historical context.
Rewriting history is not insignificant, it’s the tool of tyrants
You are spot on. This is exactly what was the goal of the think tank and you're right, it is widening the divisions in society so that the general public ignore the performance of the government and instead, castigates the Labour party for its imagined stance on immigration, racism and the support of terrorists.
Brian
Eating fat, staying slim
It’s certainly working with members of this forum and has been for a number of years.
Joe Hutch
Mate of the bloke
Which sounds alarmingly like pfm members in a contentious thread about cables, or MQA.
Joe Hutch
Mate of the bloke
'The kids are alt-right', as Pete Townshend sang all those years ago.
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
The problem for Labour is that they seem to be chasing electoral success by being just like the Tories. The Tories have taken note that antiwokery is popular and are using that to drive an agenda based on excluding black history from the national myth.
By adopting the Tory direction of travel, Labour is committed to following it and is no incapable of challenging it.
Let’s be clear, woke is being “alert to Injustice in society, especially racism”. Some on here have denyed that definition of Woke, but failed to come up with an alternative so it seems viable.
To be anti woke therefore is to be pro injustice and racism.
Tory Anti Wokery is an opportunity for Labour to oppose the Tories, to challenge their core ideology as being contrary to social and racial justice. In so doing Labour would be standing *for* social and racial justice, which were once core Labour values anyway.
If Labour cannot stand proud and firm on social and racial justice, it really has lost its way.
Seeker_UK
Feelin' nearly faded as my jeans
Personally speaking, change makes me very anxious and I'm sure I'm not alone in that.
oldius
Manchester City, dogs, family and food.
You're definitely not alone. It is unfortunate that the media would rather rail against the change, stoking fear and resentment, than supporting the nation through the change. This won't change though, they're interested in click-bait only as that's what drives their ad revenue.
Joe Hutch
Mate of the bloke
I'm baffled as to why taking down (or for that matter putting up) a picture of the Queen should stir up such emotion, but then the whole concept of monarchy is a closed book to me. It seemed impossibly dated even around the time of the Silver Jubilee, and that was almost half a century ago.
However, my standard policy is to take the opposite view of whatever the Mail/Express are arguing for, and in this particular case, even more than usual, they are creating a huge amount of fuss over nothing very much.
However, my standard policy is to take the opposite view of whatever the Mail/Express are arguing for, and in this particular case, even more than usual, they are creating a huge amount of fuss over nothing very much.