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A review of some amps on home demo: Naim v Luxman v Devialet v Vitus

Peter Stockwell said:
Fwiw, and of course I'd not say anything different, a 282 is vastly overpriced from an SQ point of view. If you add prestige, overall product quality and long term support and its ability to retain value, then maybe its price can be justified. I abandoned naim some time ago.

I owned one once and liked it, but to get the best out of it required a supercap! For most people that's a lot of green. You can get much better sound for less.
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I'd broadly agree. The 282 can appear overpriced when one compares it with other non-Naim amps especially some cheap as chips Sony amps. I won't go into detail on that one as it's too complex. Nevertheless, if within Naim as mentioned earlier the 282 does appear to be great value when comparison was made to the 552.

Again, from my experience I am in agreement that the 282 needs a Supercap, or at least to have both outputs of the 282 connected. Although I had the urge for the Supercap, I did not consider it in the end. It's mainly down to two factors. First is the 282/SupercapDR may not appear to be great value anymore after the cost of the Supercap is factored in. Secondly, the Supercap DR will just encourage the user to upgrade the 282 to the 252 in no time. One of the reasons I bought my 282/250DR brand new is to stay away from the upgrade path - the 282 will be my final destination with Naim. If I wanted a different sound, it will be a different amp.

ps. I currently have the 282 connected with a Hicap DR and Dual Teddycap.
 
Brilliant write up DW thank you! Hearing the differences between Vitus, Luxman and Devialet in the same system is really interesting.

I've always wondered about how good the top Luxman stuff was and hearing it compared to the Vitus is perfect, I tried a Vitus against my Boulder/MF Titan combo. The Vitus didn't even come close to mine, sounding (relatively) flat, opaque and woolly with no drive or 'boogy', so the Luxman would be a big no, no.....
 
Dan43 said:
When you say horrible can you elaborate? I'm keen to get my room right, its an ongoing issue (bass traps etc, measurement software and so on) but SAM on full gives me much better bass replay, so keen to know what you think so I can review what I am doing a little more.
My Devialet has just come back from the CI upgrade and the difference between USB cable and Ethernet is also something I am hearing. Thanks,
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High % of sam normally results in overblown bass at low to moderate listening levels and a lot of bass limiting at high levels..you can hear the limiting easily if you play bass tones , it either goes softer or in some cases has a clucking type sound..always goes away at low sam %

However there is a distinct difference in sound with SAM on or off , on mostly results in a wider airier soundstage which a lot of my friends like..it tends to vary from system to system. Its easy to turn sam on or off as well as varying % with the remote so its quite easy to get best results

SAM wont really help your rooms bass acoustic and in some cases can make things worse..

Devialet could have easily included a 3 or 5 band parametric which would be a far better tuning tool than sam

I havent heard the new ci board , but my one pal that has a 440 setup with the board swears that ethernet is much better than usb in his setup

Im looking at trying 2 power amps to replace my devialets as I use a Trinnov room correction device that is already a dac /pre (I currently use it purely in the digital domain)
The reason is that the devialet adds a lot of latency to the playback signal and the Trinnov misreports the speaker distance to me as 6 meters , whereas in reality , its 4.5m..The local trinnov agents recon its not a problem..but I would like to hear it myself...

I need some serious power as my speakers can handle 1.6kw rms. I have tried a homebuilt 650W abeltec alc1000 module based class D amp , but its not great quality..
 
duckworp said:
I bought a couple of hifi magazines - what a waste of time that was. Hifi mags back in the 80s and 90s were interesting things with good writing and critical reviews. Now they are simply a sales brochure for the hardware with 5* review after 5* review. Each and every review was a testament to how brilliant and faultless each product was. And no surprise to find the same companies taking out pages of expensive ads in the magazine. But hey, that’s a debate for another day.
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Really? Perhaps you bought the wrong mags.

Have a look at the Leemas new Pulse review in the latest just published HifiNews&RR, just to mention one.

Sure, reviewers clearly have their favorites (don't we all) but balanced reviews are to be found.
 
Duckworp, a belated thanks for that well-written and informative comparative piece. I've been digitally excluded from pfm for a day, but Tony has thankfully fixed that now. My friend and I auditioned 52/135s at a London dealer a couple of decades ago and came to the conclusion that the enormous shell-like B & Ws did not complement the Naim (or vice versa). The dealer did agree that they weren't the best partners.

I do wonder, therefore, that your findings were partially based upon the synergy between the amp's and your B & W (another model, no doubt). I have long been interested in the Vitus range as a possible return to solid state from my E.A.R. amplification. Unfortunately I have no idea of their synergy with ESLs.

I had, until recently, 552 controlling my valved monoblocs and previous 135s after 25 years with Naim, so the 'Naim versus' aspect was of special interest.
 
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I bought a Luxman L-590AXII last year after searching for the ideal amp for my PMC Twenty 26. It’s an integrated that shares components with the M700u. I'd never even considered it until the dealer suggested giving it a go because I've always had the impression Pre/Power combo's were better (I had a lovely MFA at the time) and it's a bit old fashioned looking and rated at 30W. It's described by Luxman as a class A sound but Hi-Fi News measured it at 95W so I think it's technically AB and will drive most speakers.

Anyway, it saw off Chord Electronics, Cyrus, Bryston and Musical Fidelity. I can imagine it sounds soft with the wrong speakers but with PMC it takes the edge off the treble and has all the detail its competitors. I was put off even trying the NAP 250DR as Naim seems like an almighty faff to me unless you use other Naim components.
 
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Mike Reed said:
Duckworp, a belated thanks for that well-written and informative comparative piece. I've been digitally excluded from pfm for a day, but Tony has thankfully fixed that now. My friend and I auditioned 52/135s at a London dealer a couple of decades ago and came to the conclusion that the enormous shell-like B & Ws did not complement the Naim (or vice versa). The dealer did agree that they weren't the best partners.

I do wonder, therefore, that your findings were partially based upon the synergy between the amp's and your B & W (another model, no doubt). I have long been interested in the Vitus range as a possibly return to solid state from my E.A.R. amplification. Unfortunately I have no idea of their synergy with ESLs.

I had, until recently, 552 controlling my valved monoblocs and previous 135s after 25 years with Naim, so the 'Naim versus' aspect was of special interest.
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I’ve certainly not ever come across recommendations for Naim amps mated to B&W speakers. Only heard that combination once; it was sharp and nasty.
 
DUCKWORP, I would be interested, after your exhaustive comparisons, in what you decided to do in your quest for a change of system. Regarding your suggestion of cable and other comparisons, the former would be more relevant to your system, as I've found that cables generally are quite dependent on synergy between pieces of kit; especially so with speaker leads, i.m.o.

B.t.w., how did you acquire the review kit, apart from your Naim, that is, and did you review different amp's at different times, using notes but referencing the other three against the Naim on separate occasions?

Has anyone here any experience of driving ESLs with Vitus amplification? Whereas most decent amp's (including Naim) will suffice, there is a synergy between many speakers and sonically compatible amplification which is normally only found by trial and error or others' experiences.

For my part, the E.A.R. mono's I use were designed around Quad ESLs, so it was London to a brick on that the pairing would be ideal. Likewise, the older (first) ProAc Reference range was developed with A.R.C. amplification. Sounded great with my Naim but better with my valved mono's.
 
The Vitus looks like a very interesting piece of kit that’s for sure and I’d certainly be tempted if I was in that market at the moment.

Despite long term attachment to Naim kit (was all Naim like many on here) I was extremely unimpressed with the performance of Naims Statement based setup at the factory last year when played through high end Focals.

From hearing many Naim systems over the years, some sound magical and some dire - often screechy. I do think setup/room interaction is perhaps more critical than with some systems. I sold my (brand new) SBL’s which were installed by a good dealer after six months as I just could not live with them in my room.
 
duckworp said:
If only I’d known this 20 years ago I maybe would never have gone blindly for Naim. Though maybe it’s that other manufacturers have caught up with Naim, or maybe I just fell for the marketing of Naim and those lovely olive boxes back in 1998 when I finally moved my NAD 3020e on and into the basic Naim system. After that I just blindly followed the Naim upgrade path.

I’ve been doing a fair bit of demoing of cables, speakers and sources recently. If that is of interest to people here on this forum then let me know and I’ll get around to writing them up one day.
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I run a Luxkit Z504 with a passive transformer pre - and this design, which is from the early 80's gives the lie to Luxman having to catch up with Naim.

People thinking this hyperbole are welcome to come and hear the combination at this years Kegworth!
 
JezmondTutu said:
From hearing many Naim systems over the years, some sound magical and some dire - often screechy. I do think setup/room interaction is perhaps more critical than with some systems. I sold my (brand new) SBL’s which were installed by a good dealer after six months as I just could not live with them in my room.
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SBLs are rather cool sonically; neutral to a point. I had a pair for a short while before taking on ProAc R3s. Gosh, but what a difference in musicality ! As SBLs need to back up to walls and are fairly diminutive (i.m.o.), I'm surprised that your room had much effect, but I wonder what you had prior to and directly after the SBLs, which, presumably, were fine.

One thing which benefits Naim systems (and probably many other s/s ones with toroidal trannies) is dedicated radial circuits.
 
Mike Reed said:
SBLs are rather cool sonically; neutral to a point. I had a pair for a short while before taking on ProAc R3s. Gosh, but what a difference in musicality ! As SBLs need to back up to walls and are fairly diminutive (i.m.o.), I'm surprised that your room had much effect, but I wonder what you had prior to and directly after the SBLs, which, presumably, were fine.

One thing which benefits Naim systems (and probably many other s/s ones with toroidal trannies) is dedicated radial circuits.
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I had Ruark Talisman 2’s Mike. I’d also moved house when I swapped over as the SBL’s were bought for the new room.
 
Rodney gold said:
High % of sam normally results in overblown bass at low to moderate listening levels and a lot of bass limiting at high levels..you can hear the limiting easily if you play bass tones , it either goes softer or in some cases has a clucking type sound..always goes away at low sam %

However there is a distinct difference in sound with SAM on or off , on mostly results in a wider airier soundstage which a lot of my friends like..it tends to vary from system to system. Its easy to turn sam on or off as well as varying % with the remote so its quite easy to get best results

SAM wont really help your rooms bass acoustic and in some cases can make things worse..

Devialet could have easily included a 3 or 5 band parametric which would be a far better tuning tool than sam

I havent heard the new ci board , but my one pal that has a 440 setup with the board swears that ethernet is much better than usb in his setup

Im looking at trying 2 power amps to replace my devialets as I use a Trinnov room correction device that is already a dac /pre (I currently use it purely in the digital domain)
The reason is that the devialet adds a lot of latency to the playback signal and the Trinnov misreports the speaker distance to me as 6 meters , whereas in reality , its 4.5m..The local trinnov agents recon its not a problem..but I would like to hear it myself...

I need some serious power as my speakers can handle 1.6kw rms. I have tried a homebuilt 650W abeltec alc1000 module based class D amp , but its not great quality..
Click to expand...

I fear you may be right, I was happy before the CI board upgrade using USB but the new upgrade has shifted my set up so still tweaking to get the best, may take a few trial and errors.

SAM has been behaving for me, I really can't express (it is one of those things) how acoustically poor my room is (I can't change it, trust me) so having to live with that.

I'm going to have a good listen with my new speaker cable while that runs in try a few things see how I go, and maybe run some room measuring software/mic and play some more.
 
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