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Anyone ever run a Mercedes 190E? Any good?

Yes the repairs on the replacement vw golf diesel have been pretty bad .at least a third of the cost of the car in 3 years of ownership .contrast that with my car that has cost less than 100 in repairs in 5 years . It is of course british made and far better imho !!!
 
I had a 190E loaner for a couple of weeks when my 96 W124 E320 was being serviced. Honestly, I’d pick the W124 every time over it, I found the 190E a much more basic car and felt less of a “classic benz” than my own did.

Also, I’ve had a few other classics including another Merc (89 420SL) and a Saab convertible.

They are not, I repeat not, cheap to own - they do hold their value, but ongoing servicing and maintenance is costly and you need to know a good independent who is very familiar with them, otherwise everything is an investigation. You also need to buy the best you can find, I’d be very very wary of anything “cheap”.

The SL cost me £3000+/year in bills (I was living in the UK then) and the E320 €2000/year here in Ireland. You can justify it as it’s comparable to a PCP or lease on a newer car, but it is not cheap motoring by any measure. In both cases, they were my everyday drivers, not a “Sunday” car or suchlike.

Also, you may need to consider safety, modern cars are so much better in that respect. My E320 had 2 airbags and ABS but that was about it.

Good luck with your choice.

Annual running costs of the older cars that I run as daily drivers interests me. Here's what my records show, each car was owned for around 10 years and covered about 70k miles, so a good apples for apples comparison. Costs are for repairs and maintenance only:

Volvo 360GLT (1982 model) £370/yr
BMW 530iSE (1988 model/E34) £900/yr
Mercedes SL320 (1997 model) £2,200/yr

The Volvo won on cost because its parts were a little cheaper, but manly because it was simple, there was less to go wrong.

The BMW was best value because the extra cost was easily justified in terms of ride, handling, build quality comfort and refinement. I took this up to 225k miles and only sold it because I fancied a change...... :(

The Mercedes disappointed. It was significantly less reliable and had recurrent items that needed replacing every few years that on other cars usually never needed replacing. It was a relief to sell it.

I'm currently 2 years into a Volvo S80 (2005 model). Its currently running at £3k/yr. Whilst that is high that is normal when I acquire a car. There are lots of jobs I do to bring it up to my standard. Plus I "wasted" a grand on mis-diagnosed repairs last year which skewed the true running cost. Over time I expect this car will come at around £1.5k/yr.

The last time I checked what my typical outlay would get me on PCP: Toyota Aygo ! I am not knocking the Aygo, but what I have been driving for the same outlay ticks many more of my boxes than an Aygo could.
 
One other point - it depends if you are trying to maintain a mint classic car to preserve resale versus a functional day-to-day driver.

I was trying to do the former and relying on specialists to work on the cars, so the bills were high. If you can do some work yourself and/or you are aiming for a more normal/everyday standard, you can save money.

I still would be somewhat wary of the lack of safety features - even my son’s 2021 Arona has speed/distance sensors and at least once has avoided an accident by slowing the car coming into a sudden traffic jam, it was quite impressive in use.
 
Annual running costs of the older cars that I run as daily drivers interests me. Here's what my records show, each car was owned for around 10 years and covered about 70k miles, so a good apples for apples comparison. Costs are for repairs and maintenance only:

Volvo 360GLT (1982 model) £370/yr
BMW 530iSE (1988 model/E34) £900/yr
Mercedes SL320 (1997 model) £2,200/yr

The Volvo won on cost because its parts were a little cheaper, but manly because it was simple, there was less to go wrong.

The BMW was best value because the extra cost was easily justified in terms of ride, handling, build quality comfort and refinement. I took this up to 225k miles and only sold it because I fancied a change...... :(

The Mercedes disappointed. It was significantly less reliable and had recurrent items that needed replacing every few years that on other cars usually never needed replacing. It was a relief to sell it.

I'm currently 2 years into a Volvo S80 (2005 model). Its currently running at £3k/yr. Whilst that is high that is normal when I acquire a car. There are lots of jobs I do to bring it up to my standard. Plus I "wasted" a grand on mis-diagnosed repairs last year which skewed the true running cost. Over time I expect this car will come at around £1.5k/yr.

The last time I checked what my typical outlay would get me on PCP: Toyota Aygo ! I am not knocking the Aygo, but what I have been driving for the same outlay ticks many more of my boxes than an Aygo could.
For the latter PCP example you are comparing new with used, which is not really a fair comparison. A better comparison would be a middling car bought used. My experience is that a 3-5 year old (say) Mondeo, Passat, offers similar global running costs to something like my current 13 year old A5 coupe. The latter is a "better" car , you are trading repair costs against an absence of depreciation. The newer car generally offers more fixed and predictable costs. The older car will also feature visible wear to the interior and bits of paint, which may be a problem of not. My car has a whistling door deal that annoys me but not enough to pay the non trivial repair costs. I know it won't ever stop the car, so there's no push to fix it. Likewise after nearly 200k miles there is wear to 2nd and 3rd synchros. We all know the fix, recon gearbox. So a £1500+ repair against living with a minor fault, we all know the answer. But it means that the car doesn't drive perfectly, and this may bother you or not.
 
Steve67, you are quite correct, I sense checked my decision to persevere with older nicer cars by comparing it to the trouble free experience of a Toyota under warranty for the same annual outlay. I decided the agro is worth it for the pleasure the older car gives me.

After the Volvo I am currently running I might have to change my lifelong stance of running older upmarket cars. Tomorrows older upmarket car, which would succeed the Volvo, is a much different beast to yesterdays equivalent model. Upmarket used to mean better design, nicer styling and higher quality materials. Now it means more complexity and higher repair costs to me. I think the cost of running such car when its 10-20yrs old coupled with electronic module availability will not make for a viable means of everyday transport.

I'm thinking my motoring future will be the 3-5 year old Mondeo you describe. Am I correctly interpreting your experience, the Audi has little depreciation but relativity high repair costs whereas the Mondeo is low on repairs costs and higher on depreciation?
 
FWIW, we've had a plain vanilla 2011 Vauxhall Insignia since Mar 2019; 32k miles when bought, now 50k, so around 4.5k miles per year.

We estimate running costs of service, repair incl MoTs to be £428 pa

A few glow plugs, two rear springs, a fan belt, regassing the air con and two front tyres are the extent of repair and replacement, plus fluids.

Again FWIW, would rather have the boring but useful advancements as standard that the Merc won't have - parking sensors, DAB radio, CD, USB, remote locking, semi-auto box, etc.
 
Could it be that all Paul Rich cars actually cost the same ? I mean a glass of beer in the pub here now easily costs 5 times as much as only a couple of years ago.
 
Steve67, you are quite correct, I sense checked my decision to persevere with older nicer cars by comparing it to the trouble free experience of a Toyota under warranty for the same annual outlay. I decided the agro is worth it for the pleasure the older car gives me.

After the Volvo I am currently running I might have to change my lifelong stance of running older upmarket cars. Tomorrows older upmarket car, which would succeed the Volvo, is a much different beast to yesterdays equivalent model. Upmarket used to mean better design, nicer styling and higher quality materials. Now it means more complexity and higher repair costs to me. I think the cost of running such car when its 10-20yrs old coupled with electronic module availability will not make for a viable means of everyday transport.

I'm thinking my motoring future will be the 3-5 year old Mondeo you describe. Am I correctly interpreting your experience, the Audi has little depreciation but relativity high repair costs whereas the Mondeo is low on repairs costs and higher on depreciation?
I agree with you re newer upmarket cars. These days everything is good for 120-150k mechanically, but the electrical control systems can be a killer. I met a chap running a newish VW Transporter, it had thrown its ABS ECU. £1200 sir. Ouch. There is more and more of this, the Audi had the heater fan fail and it was a £300 repair, which is a bit stiff. Oh, and old Audis having little depreciation against heavier maintenance costs against a newer Mondeo that is unlikely to need repairs and when necessary they are cheaper, but the newer car suffering worse depreciation, is exactly what I'm saying.
 
Could it be that all Paul Rich cars actually cost the same ? I mean a glass of beer in the pub here now easily costs 5 times as much as only a couple of years ago.

A good point. I looked up inflation rates and took the middle year of the car's tenure with me and brought the cost up to date:

Volvo 360GLT: £675
BMW 530i: £1,440
Mercedes SL320: £2,800.
 
I agree with you re newer upmarket cars. These days everything is good for 120-150k mechanically, but the electrical control systems can be a killer. I met a chap running a newish VW Transporter, it had thrown its ABS ECU. £1200 sir. Ouch.

Yes I'd concur with that Steve - I'm always sounding out the lads at work who tend to run cars up to the age where I buy them, i.e. about 100k miles. Since taking on the Volvo at 120k miles I've hit a number of once in the life of the car parts replacements. I only paid £850 for the car, intending it to be a stopgap until I found a good 2006 BMW 630i, but then decided it was such a good car for the daily commute that it was a better choice than the 630i.That was when I started bringing it up to a good level of maintenance. Had I known the Volvo was to be a keeper I would have been better off seeking a better condition and maintained example.
 
I've been toying withe the idea of buying an old Mercedes Benz 190E when I retire my business in a year or two's time. I've often fancied one of these cars. They seem to have a mixture of quality and non-showiness that appeals.

I'm thinking a 1992/1993 car with driver airbag and ABS. Probably an auto box. Something around £4-£5k.
This would be our only car and would need to be reliable and durable for a couple of years at, say, 10,000miles/yr. Would also need to be cheap to run.

Am I being too optimistic thinking that a car this old could be run without major expense and 30+mpg? I've noticed that once the plastics and rubber bits start to fail in older cars, it can get expensive (fuel injection parts, steering racks, bearings, seals etc)

Just wondering if any other PFM-ers have run one of these and if you would recommend them?

Real car full,of character. If you have an independent merc specialist repair garage near you that would be a good place to ask, enthusiasts use them. Also the Mercedes magazine.
 
This would be our only car and would need to be reliable and durable for a couple of years at, say, 10,000miles/yr.

A 1992/1993 vehicle would be 30 years old by now. Personally I would expect a car this old to be not durable or reliable anymore since it's way past its lifespan. Just my opinion. In my book, an 8 to 10 year old car would still be a viable option which is about the maximum age I would consider for a used vehicle.
 
Thank you for all the replies. Many of them (sadly) quite sensible and pragmatic. I don't reckon I could afford to run one of these cars really. Or if I could, I'd resent the expense. Probably best to keep my savings for any urgent operation I might need, given the state of the NHS.

I have been trying these last few years to reduce my attachment to "stuff". Abandoning this particular desire will be a good practice I suppose.
 
Thank you for all the replies. Many of them (sadly) quite sensible and pragmatic. I don't reckon I could afford to run one of these cars really. Or if I could, I'd resent the expense. Probably best to keep my savings for any urgent operation I might need, given the state of the NHS.

I have been trying these last few years to reduce my attachment to "stuff". Abandoning this particular desire will be a good practice I suppose.
You can get one of these and run it as a hobby car. It's the desire to run it as your only car and do 10000 miles plus a year that will make it excessively expensive.
 
I‘ve been running a ’89 230 Coupe for the last 7 years as a daily driver, and an ‘81 200 Limo for around 5 years before that. They have both been utterly reliable, and except for changing a few worn things here an there (Battery, Ignition-cabling, belts, a few bulbs and a 50quid rubber damper in the steering column) I never saw any big bills. Sold both cars for a healthy profit too.

Both had Bluetooth Audio via a BT to DIN converter on the original radio.
 
I‘ve been running a ’89 230 Coupe for the last 7 years as a daily driver, and an ‘81 200 Limo for around 5 years before that. They have both been utterly reliable, and except for changing a few worn things here an there (Battery, Ignition-cabling, belts, a few bulbs and a 50quid rubber damper in the steering column) I never saw any big bills. Sold both cars for a healthy profit too.

Both had Bluetooth Audio via a BT to DIN converter on the original radio.
Good work. How many miles a year? IME up to 5k a year is viable at modest cost, beyond that you get into spending more time repairing than driving.
 
What I meant to say is „ go for it!“.

If you‘de like it to be a bit more modern, or are interested in my suggestion, I personally would right now hunt down a good early W212 without air suspension. Make that a 200 or 250 petrol or 220 diesel. Stay with the 4pots.
 
Yeah, around 5-8k.
Makes sense. A quality car like that is good for 150k, typically, so buy a good one with modest miles, do modest miles and maintain it properly, and it will last for a good while. But not indefinitely, for proof ask how many cars at the classic car rally are 200k miles plus. The odd one, sure, but not many.
 


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