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Tandberg Studio Monitors

I had the Tandberg 5020's Mike maybe a model down from the studio monitor .. lovely sounding speaker everything sounded just right .. Mrs Heidcase said they are too big for this room so I sold them ..Still regret it :(
 
I had the Tandberg 5020's Mike maybe a model down from the studio monitor .. lovely sounding speaker everything sounded just right .. Mrs Heidcase said they are too big for this room so I sold them ..Still regret it :(
Yes I recall that you had a pair of 5020's and really rated them. I didn't realise you'd sold them.

Tandberg speakers seem to slip under the radar here in the UK and I suppose there just aren't many around.
 
Well I'm really not doing very well at deciding between the Tannoys and the Tandbergs. My wife and kids have been away for the weekend and I've made the most of it by putting in a good amount of hours with both pairs of speakers and I'm still no closer to making a decision.

For anyone interested here are some sweeps taken of both. These measurements were taken from my listening position and at normal listening volume but they aren't level matched between the speakers.

Tandberg Studio Monitors:

Tandberg sweep by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

The above was taken with the HF contour control on -1 (minimum) and the midrange control on 0 (level).

Tannoy Ardens:

Tannoy sweep by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

The discrepancy between the L and R in the bass range is all due to the room. It stays the same when I swap the channels before the amp, after the amp and also if I physically swap the speakers over.
 
Well I'm really not doing very well at deciding between the Tannoys and the Tandbergs. My wife and kids have been away for the weekend and I've made the most of it by putting in a good amount of hours with both pairs of speakers and I'm still no closer to making a decision.

For anyone interested here are some sweeps taken of both. These measurements were taken from my listening position and at normal listening volume but they aren't level matched between the speakers.

Tandberg Studio Monitors:

Tandberg sweep by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

The above was taken with the HF contour control on -1 (minimum) and the midrange control on 0 (level).

Tannoy Ardens:

Tannoy sweep by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

The discrepancy between the L and R in the bass range is all due to the room. It stays the same when I swap the channels before the amp, after the amp and also if I physically swap the speakers over.
I'm not sure what you're using to measuring but all of the graphs show high frequencies dropping off before you even reach 10kHz which is unusual, especially for Tannoys, unless you're listening way off-axis.

Comparing the bass response of two different speakers is problematic unless both speakers are of similar design and have their woofers in the same position in their respective enclosures and the enclosures are placed in exactly the same position in the room. If these criteria aren't met then large variations are to be expected which makes objective comparisons meaningless.

Measurements can be helpful in pinpointing issues with speakers and/or rooms and they can help to explain why you might prefer one speaker's tonality over another, but I'd stick to using your ears to decide which speaker sounds best! :)

That said, based on your measurements Tanbergs look to have a flatter, 'studio' balance while the Arden's have a darker voicing. The Tandbergs should therefore sound more forward/present and clearer in the mids and treble.
 
I'm not sure what you're using to measuring but all of the graphs show high frequencies dropping off before you even reach 10kHz which is unusual, especially for Tannoys, unless you're listening way off-axis.

The measurement kit isn't mine, it's on temporary loan from my sister who's much more experienced that I am with room measurements and digital EQ etc. The mic is a UMIK-1 and the software is called Foobar.

Both speakers were just a little off axis with the crossing point just behind my listening position.

That said, based on your measurements Tanbergs look to have a flatter, 'studio' balance while the Arden's have a darker voicing. The Tandbergs should therefore sound more forward/present and clearer in the mids and treble.

Yes! That's it in a nutshell.

The Tandbergs have an incredibly clear and detailed midrange. I reckon that ITT softdome mid is quite special. The bass on the Tandbergs is also very tight and well behaved compared to the Tannoys, which is guess is what you'd expect from a sealed cabinet.

Subjectively, you do very much get the impression that the response of the Tandbergs is very flat and that's born out in the measurements.

Overall I prefer the warmer tonality of the Tannoys and I do find the Tandbergs a bit fatiguing with some material, especially when using a digital source. With my vinyl front end, which is little warmer, the balance the Tandbergs is very nearly perfect for my personal preferences.

Both the Ardens and Tandbergs have contour controls facilitated by two rotary knobs on the front. On the Ardens they're the 'Energy' and 'Roll Off' controls that you'll be familiar with. The Tandbergs have two controls, one of HF and one for Mid range. Each control has three positions, high, level and low (labelled +1, 0 and -1).

Tandberg contour control by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

I'm finding that my preference on the Tandbergs is for the HF on the minimum setting and the mid setting on level for most music and -1 for brighter recordings.

Actually I've gone further than that and I've already increased the value of the series resistor on the HF up from 4R7uF to 5R6.

Here's the schematic:
Tandberg crossover schematic by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

You'll notice the annotation on the schematic showing that R6 might be 4R7 rather than 2R2 and that's how it was in mine.
 
With the Tannoys if you haven’t already done so try playing with the bolt-tightness to the baffle. IME this needs to be very low tension, just enough that they can’t move but not enough to energise the baffle like a drum. Try undoing the bolts and just gently nudging them up until they stop. My suspicion based on my own experience with (admittedly very different MG15s in very different cabinets) is you may well drop that 1kHz spike and fill in the area down to 200Hz a bit. It costs nothing, is easily reversible, and you’ll either love it or hate it anyway. There will unquestionably be a ‘right’ to your ears somewhere, and if anyone has ever cranked them down hard they are likely very ‘wrong’!
 
The measurement kit isn't mine, it's on temporary loan from my sister who's much more experienced that I am with room measurements and digital EQ etc. The mic is a UMIK-1 and the software is called Foobar.

Both speakers were just a little off axis with the crossing point just behind my listening position.



Yes! That's it in a nutshell.

The Tandbergs have an incredibly clear and detailed midrange. I reckon that ITT softdome mid is quite special. The bass on the Tandbergs is also very tight and well behaved compared to the Tannoys, which is guess is what you'd expect from a sealed cabinet.

Subjectively, you do very much get the impression that the response of the Tandbergs is very flat and that's born out in the measurements.

Overall I prefer the warmer tonality of the Tannoys and I do find the Tandbergs a bit fatiguing with some material, especially when using a digital source. With my vinyl front end, which is little warmer, the balance the Tandbergs is very nearly perfect for my personal preferences.

Both the Ardens and Tandbergs have contour controls facilitated by two rotary knobs on the front. On the Ardens they're the 'Energy' and 'Roll Off' controls that you'll be familiar with. The Tandbergs have two controls, one of HF and one for Mid range. Each control has three positions, high, level and low (labelled +1, 0 and -1).

Tandberg contour control by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

I'm finding that my preference on the Tandbergs is for the HF on the minimum setting and the mid setting on level for most music and -1 for brighter recordings.

Actually I've gone further than that and I've already increased the value of the series resistor on the HF up from 4R7uF to 5R6.

Here's the schematic:
Tandberg crossover schematic by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

You'll notice the annotation on the schematic showing that R6 might be 4R7 rather than 2R2 and that's how it was in mine.

It's handy that both the Tandbergs and Tannoys have controls to contour the MF and HF response to your room and personal preference. What do you normally set the Tannoy controls to, you may have already said but I can't remember? If the Rolloff is set to the FLAT position then, when measured on-axis at a nearfield distance, the treble response should actually be on an upward trajectory all the way out to 16kHz before rolling off, at least it is on all of the MG and HPD drivers I've measured. I eventually settled on Energy=-1 and Rolloff=FLAT with my MG12(HE) in Edinburgh enclosures and turned down the treble control on my amp to achieve a gently downward-sloping in-room response. The Rolloff control has far too strong an attenuation effect to be useful IME.

You may have seen these before, my measurements showing the effect of the Energy and Rolloff controls on the LSU crossover:
Lockwood MG15 LSU Energy Control
Tannoy Edinburgh MG12(HE) LSU Energy control
Tannoy Edinburgh MG12(HE) LSU Rolloff control
 
just enough that they can’t move

Hard to judge. I just checked my MG15s and found that all the screws had worked pretty loose since I nudged them tight 18 months ago. I've tightened them again and put a note in my diary to check them in six months.
 
With the Tannoys if you haven’t already done so try playing with the bolt-tightness to the baffle. IME this needs to be very low tension, just enough that they can’t move but not enough to energise the baffle like a drum. Try undoing the bolts and just gently nudging them up until they stop. My suspicion based on my own experience with (admittedly very different MG15s in very different cabinets) is you may well drop that 1kHz spike and fill in the area down to 200Hz a bit. It costs nothing, is easily reversible, and you’ll either love it or hate it anyway. There will unquestionably be a ‘right’ to your ears somewhere, and if anyone has ever cranked them down hard they are likely very ‘wrong’!
I've had the drivers in an out many times, so they're just nipped up and no more.
 
It's handy that both the Tandbergs and Tannoys have controls to contour the MF and HF response to your room and personal preference. What do you normally set the Tannoy controls to, you may have already said but I can't remember? If the Rolloff is set to the FLAT position then, when measured on-axis at a nearfield distance, the treble response should actually be on an upward trajectory all the way out to 16kHz before rolling off, at least it is on all of the MG and HPD drivers I've measured. I eventually settled on Energy=-1 and Rolloff=FLAT with my MG12(HE) in Edinburgh enclosures and turned down the treble control on my amp to achieve a gently downward-sloping in-room response. The Rolloff control has far too strong an attenuation effect to be useful IME.

You may have seen these before, my measurements showing the effect of the Energy and Rolloff controls on the LSU crossover:
Lockwood MG15 LSU Energy Control
Tannoy Edinburgh MG12(HE) LSU Energy control
Tannoy Edinburgh MG12(HE) LSU Rolloff control

I usually keep the Tannoys on -1 on the energy setting and 'level' on the roll-off although rather embarrassingly I just checked them now and they're on Level/Level and I don't know how long they've been that way and I hadn't noticed! I think we must have put them on level/level when my sister was here a week or so ago and we were doing the sweeps.

On the Tandbergs I have the HF one -1 (and I've reduced the HF output by swapping the series resistor). I have the midrange control on 0 most of the time but on brighter recordings I sometimes knock it down to -1 too. God help you if you put both HF and Mid on +1, I think it would strip your tooth enamel off.
 
Is your Ardens position exciting a 600hz room mode?

I have no idea to be honest. It would seem like the most likely explanation. The big dips at approx. 70Hz and 150Hz that are most obvious on the right speaker when using the Tandbergs is certainly the room. If I put a load of cushions etc on the floor around the base of the right speaker it evens everything out considerably.
 
The custom stands I commissioned for the Tandbergs have finally arrived and I'm delighted with them. They fit perfectly and I think they look just right.

Tandberg stands 1 by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

Tandberg stands 2 by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

Tandberg stands 3 by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

Sadly now that the stands are here it means that it's time for the Tandbergs to move on to a new home. They really are wonderful speakers but I simply don't have space to for both them and my Tannoys.
 
Here's the schematic:
Tandberg crossover schematic by Michael Pickwell, on Flickr

...
I'm very late to this party, but love the option of having the tweeters protected via s28 by rectifying the HF drive signal, to unlatch a relay and turn on a light to tell you it's too loud/your amp is clipping.

That's a lovely thing! Much nicer, cleaner, than a bulb in series, a polyfuse, etc - which is far more common. And audibly-nasty.
 


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