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'There’s endless choice, but you’re not listening’

You're missing the point. I'm talking about people who bought into buying all of their music from iTunes back then and people who now BUY all of their music digitally. You don't own it. It's not yours. That was the point I was trying (and obviously failed) to make.

Nothing wrong with streaming. If you get along with Spotify quality then that's just fine AFAIC.
 
It’s the music that matters, it’s up to the user how they wish to access it. I’m sure there are many people with terrible taste, the fact they own the records or CDs doesn’t validate them;)

I think I had quite narrow tastes when I was a teenager, today’s ‘kids’ have far more opportunity to explore.
 
Speaking as a genuine old fart, I have never really understood the semi-religious mania about listening to a whole album at a sitting.
Classical and (some) Jazz and certain modern minimalists being the only exceptions.
As far as R&B, R&R, rock, hard rock, heavy metal, punk, etc. etc. etc. are concerned, most albums will contain one or two gems worth repeated listening and usually a bunch of space filling dirge that should never have been pressed into service. For these, well sorted playlists or selective algorithms are a life saver .....

The concept of 'Concept' albums should have been killed at birth .... along with ELP, Wishbone Ash and all their ilk :D
 
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I’ve stopped using any digital source at home now, I just play vinyl. I prefer the sound and there’re always plenty of reissues coming out to keep things interesting, as well as picking up secondhand records.

I’ve still got my Roon Nucleus tucked under a living room chair but it’s switched off now and I really should cancel my Tidal subscription as I just don’t use it. The Nucleus has an SSD with about 900 of my CD/SACDs on it but I’d played only a handful of them over the last year. If I didn’t have vinyl I think I’d go back to CD/SACD as primary source, with an Airplay receiver to demo tracks.

Out of the house, I use Apple Music as it seems to work well with an iPhone and AirPods with features like Dolby Atmos and I like the presentation. I do find the odd new album through Apple Music, which I then investigate for vinyl options on Discogs.
 
You're missing the point. I'm talking about people who bought into buying all of their music from iTunes back then and people who now BUY all of their music digitally. You don't own it. It's not yours. That was the point I was trying (and obviously failed) to make.

Nothing wrong with streaming. If you get along with Spotify quality then that's just fine AFAIC.

Yes.

My understanding is that you are ‘renting’ the music. You don’t own it.

I seem to recall someone wanted to bequeath their itunes collection in their will to their children, but was unable to as they don’t own the downloads. I could be making that up.
 
It’s the music that matters, it’s up to the user how they wish to access it. I’m sure there are many people with terrible taste, the fact they own the records or CDs doesn’t validate them;)

I think I had quite narrow tastes when I was a teenager, today’s ‘kids’ have far more opportunity to explore.

I’m with Woodface on this one. I grew up in a strictly classical household: my father had played flute for Vaughan Williams. Most music was live, most played by ourselves(!), but we did have the remains of an old radiogram that worked when it felt like it. So to play music of my choice, I had to beg, borrow & occasionally purchase (well second-hand) the odds and ends that became an audio hobby. It wasn’t until I went to university and became friends with people in the music department that my exposure to different styles really took off, but it felt like I’d missed out on years of music education!
My own kids have also grown up with live music (and live circus - but that’s another story) in the home and outside, but with a huge range of styles. Even so, Spotify has given them independence to discover what touches them and their friends without being tethered to the parental collection. They bought their first albums as CDs from the artists themselves at world music festivals and other gigs which get played on the main hifi. But most of their (extensive) listening is done in their own rooms via headphones or Bluetooth speakers and Spotify. They say the lack of playback quality doesn’t affect their enjoyment - it’s music, isn’t it?
We still all listen together, though, occasionally: after a recent session of listening to Pink Floyd on the monster Tannoys (rather loud, in the dark, lit only by valve glow) the younger one (13) declared that it was like being present with the band, only because the quality was so clear it must have been a studio! She could “see” the band members in different locations in the room. And that’s without chemical enhancement…. So she already knows the limitations of live PA systems.
Anyway - a bit of a ramble, I know - but the point is that not only do people like to access music in different ways, but the way they ‘use’ music also varies. REAL music is LIVE music. So even the best playback system is inherently compromised, making all the the arguments somewhat trivial. Educate children with live music first and then trust them to access recordings in any way convenient. As long as they regularly experience the real deal, they will retain perspective about streaming, etc.
Children are the future of music: what they do matters much more than the rest of us (which in turn frees us to indulge our own ways of doing things!).
 
Speaking as a genuine old fart, I have never really understood the semi-religious mania about listening to a whole album at a sitting.
Classical and (some) Jazz and certain modern minimalists being the only exceptions.
As far as R&B, R&R, rock, hard rock, heavy metal, punk, etc. etc. etc. are concerned, most albums will contain one or two gems worth repeated listening and usually a bunch of space filling dirge that should never have been pressed into service. For these, well sorted playlists or selective algorithms are a life saver .....

The concept of 'Concept' albums should have been killed at birth .... along with ELP, Wishbone Ash and all their ilk :D
I had a mini-epiphany about this when reading an interview Mick Jagger gave, possibly to Rolling Stone, back in the early 70s. The interviewer asked Jagger about various of the Stones albums, and Jagger said of Between the Buttons (words to the effect of) ‘It’s horrible. There’s only one good track on the album (Back Street Girl), the rest is rubbish’. The same could be said of most albums by most bands.

It’s obvious that very few artists have enough good material to fill a 40 minute LP, and even fewer have enough to fill a 70 minute CD.
 
As already pointed out the ‘album’ is a relatively new concept & by its nature quite elitist. Prior to the LP people used to listen to ‘tracks’ via 78s or the radio. I don’t feel the music from this era is in anyway devalued, in fact quite the opposite.

The founding fathers of what we consider as music were in their 50s when the LP became popular.

Louis Armstrong Hot 5s & 7s & the Ellington Blanton/Webster band were pretty pivotal to how music was shaped!

So, listening to ‘tracks’ is as old as modern music.
 
Interesting. I wonder if it’s a financial decision and then people are going all ‘it’s better for my listening experience’ to validate their decision?

I can see a few people doing this, but I bet millions have thinned out their streaming services to save money.
 
The tyranny of having too many choices is a phenomenon that is well-known and studied. It often leads to sub-optimal outcomes.

Similarly, clutter, whether physical or otherwise, is an issue generally. I have a huge amount of physical media to choose from and listen to. But often when I have picked something that is less than great from it, I have to wonder why I even bother when there's so much better music that I could and should be listening to.

I often think I really need to be culling and reducing this collection down to an optimal amount. At the present rate, I could go on for years without having to listen to the same album twice!
 
Well, it’s a competitive market. Apple Music is bundled in with phones so will be chipping away.

I still think Spotify is pretty dominant with the ‘kidz’, I don’t use it as much mainly since I bought an Innuos Zen mini.
 
In the old days when as a teenager I rode on a bus into Leicester city centre to trawl round half a dozen record shops before finally selecting an LP...

...even if my first listen wasn't that good - I carried on listening until I liked the album.

The effort and expense of obtaining the LP meant I was damn well going to have to enjoy the album.

I found Klaus Schulze boring on first listen (but grew to love his music).

Today I have Qobuz - without the same attachment to the music - it is all to easy to click on another album after just the first 30 seconds.
 
I was discussing music browsing in another space and commented that I wasn't attracted to streaming services as I don't want to browse millions of albums; I'm sure 90% of those are just clutter, they will not interest me.

Looks like I'm not alone.

‘There’s endless choice, but you’re not listening’: fans quitting Spotify to save their love of music
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2...-quitting-spotify-to-save-their-love-of-music

I hadn't heard of Navidrome until the article mentioned it - that sounds like it could be a fun project.
 
It seems that some, including a musician and teacher, still consider music a free service.
"Wendy Eisenberg, a musician and teacher who recently deleted their account with Napster Music (formerly called Rhapsody), put it this way: “The one thing I’ve noticed since divesting is that music sounds better to me because I’ve put in the work to either locate it on a hard drive or download it from a friend’s Bandcamp or something." (Guardian)
 
Ultimately it’s just a different way of engaging with music. Think of any of the arts & similar levels of consumption apply.

Lots of people like films, some love to go to the cinema, some subscribe to a movie channel whereas others just see what’s on the telly. It’s all equally valid.

I was at the Arctic Monkeys concert on Friday, lots of ‘yoof’, they all knew the words. Loved the band, paid handsomely to be there. I have all the albums on CD & Vinyl but it doesn’t make my experience any more valid or worthy.

This is just old people moaning. Both my children have very wide tastes in music which wouldn’t have been possible pre streaming.
 
. Both my children have very wide tastes in music which wouldn’t have been possible pre streaming.
Really? I like music from around the world, Rai from Algeria, classical Indian music, Brazilian, West African, chamber music, rock, folk, jazz, Baroque, and so on. I didn't notice any streaming going on when I became interested in any of them.
 


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