ks.234
Half way to Infinity
Then perhaps a perfectly reasonable cost of living increase in pay should’ve been agreed a long time ago?
Train strikes
- Thread starter hifinutt
- Start date
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
Well first she’d probably have to repeal the human rights act.
Oh yes, that’s in the pipeline too, isn’t it.
Joe Hutch
Mate of the bloke
And you'd be OK with that?
hifinutt
hifinutt
new shutdown announced for 8th october ....
my this is getting very hard to cope with
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62999136
my this is getting very hard to cope with
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-62999136
gintonic
50 shades of grey pussy cats
yep we'll need to get back from London. I'm sure it'll be fine but slow.
hifinutt
hifinutt
Speaking from a picket line at London's Euston Station, RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "We haven't targeted the London Marathon, we've more targeted the Tory conference, if we're honest with you - because they're the people responsible for this mess."
He apologised for the inconvenience caused to people, adding that they would much rather have a settlement.
But he said members had to keep going with the dispute, which has lasted nearly six months. He said he believed workers had the public's full support.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63087621
grrr . what planet is this guy on. thousands who are collecting money for charity at marathon will be affected . costing me 200 quid extra to attend a medical appointment next week due to strikes !! not a happy bunny
He apologised for the inconvenience caused to people, adding that they would much rather have a settlement.
But he said members had to keep going with the dispute, which has lasted nearly six months. He said he believed workers had the public's full support.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63087621
grrr . what planet is this guy on. thousands who are collecting money for charity at marathon will be affected . costing me 200 quid extra to attend a medical appointment next week due to strikes !! not a happy bunny
vince rocker
pfm Member
Speaking from a picket line at London's Euston Station, RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "We haven't targeted the London Marathon, we've more targeted the Tory conference, if we're honest with you - because they're the people responsible for this mess."
He apologised for the inconvenience caused to people, adding that they would much rather have a settlement.
But he said members had to keep going with the dispute, which has lasted nearly six months. He said he believed workers had the public's full support.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63087621
Mick Lynch is on the planet of doing his job representing RMT members. As for charity collections, ask yourself why people need to be running a marathon (and other similar activities) to raise money for causes that in many cases were, and should still be, state funded?
Bob McC
Living the life of Riley
Good for Lynch.Speaking from a picket line at London's Euston Station, RMT general secretary Mick Lynch said: "We haven't targeted the London Marathon, we've more targeted the Tory conference, if we're honest with you - because they're the people responsible for this mess."
He apologised for the inconvenience caused to people, adding that they would much rather have a settlement.
But he said members had to keep going with the dispute, which has lasted nearly six months. He said he believed workers had the public's full support.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63087621
A man with his priorities right, as Vince says.
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Haven't been following this thread so apologies if this has been mentioned already. As far as I can see, the unions simply want a straight increase without strings. Those strings involve allowing the companies to modernise to become more efficient; 'strings' opposed by the unions. Surely it should be quid pro quo and once upon a time when strikes were wrecking the British economy, ACAS often came to the rescue; or at least tried. Maybe I've missed it but haven't read or heard about this or any mediation service in these more recent strikes.
Is it this or the postal strike where the company's/companies' offer(s) have been refused direct access to the membership? I don't understand the rational ethos of these disputes and can only think that the unions need to rattle their sabres every now and again as a justification for their being.
The right to strike may be sacrosanct but not at all sure of the right to endanger or inconvenience those having no part in it and, oddly, effectively paying the wages and creating employment; the company being the middle man providing both a service and employment. What a simplistic, naive thought ! (enter sarcastic emoji)
Is it this or the postal strike where the company's/companies' offer(s) have been refused direct access to the membership? I don't understand the rational ethos of these disputes and can only think that the unions need to rattle their sabres every now and again as a justification for their being.
The right to strike may be sacrosanct but not at all sure of the right to endanger or inconvenience those having no part in it and, oddly, effectively paying the wages and creating employment; the company being the middle man providing both a service and employment. What a simplistic, naive thought ! (enter sarcastic emoji)
vince rocker
pfm Member
You missed out "and taking a profit".
paulfromcamden
Baffled
You're suggesting people should only strike when it doesn't inconvenience anyone Mike? It's a lovely idea but I'm not sure how much pressure that's going to put on the employers : )
Enfield boy
pfm Member
Good grief!
The strings are essentially making working conditions worse and generally removing things like extra pay for overtime, creating enforced overtime/Sunday work and enforcing time off in lieu rather than payment. Come in when the employer wants, stay home when it suits and get paid basic rate.
Of course companies have direct access, they print and post notices detailing the offer. Staff are then free to vote how they feel appropriate in the strike ballot, believe me, for people to forgo their pay to make a protest is not an easy decision.
Meanwhile most have had real terms pay cuts for 12 years while CEOs etc have seen huge growth in their emoluments.
ACAS is voluntary if the employer doesn't want mediation, it won't happen. If workers are on the receiving end of 12 years of pay cuts and the employer wants to screw them over to claw even a small part back there is very little middle ground.
Cav
pfm Member
You really do not understand how negotiations work in a Unionised industry. I could answer the various points you raise but why would I waste my time.
Inconvenience is the whole point of a strike. If you stopping work doesn't result in anybody noticing then you don't have much of a job, do you?
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Pointless to include as that is surely the main/only driver of a business.
A strike is going to inconvenience people regardless, Paul. I was really, I suppose, referring to deliberately targetting max. inconvenience re. special events like the Marathon, e.g.
No idea, Enfield Boy, as I've always accepted the terms of my employment in a lifetime of different jobs. If I was dissatisfied, I left. Just cannot understand the union mentality, or so it seems, to confront employers, modernisation and changing needs for greater efficiency.
Nope! I don't, as I've had little experience of even belonging to a union let alone understanding the rational reasons for this country, currently in the grip of so many economic and domestic pressures, having strikes compound things and potentially or actually degrade the chances of us all benefitting from climbing out of this mess.
In retrospect I thought I might have been stirring up a hornets' nest.
I have to say, though, as a possible explanation, that in the early sixties, I was interviewed and employed by an agricultural union in the City. Six weeks later they asked me to join the union, which hadn't been discussed at the interview. They said that this was mandatory for an employee. I left. Even in my naive early twenties I must have had an innate rejection of the herd instinct of unions.Much later, in the late seventies and after about 6 years of teaching, I was eventually forced (more or less) by the N.A.S./U.W.T. rep. (deputy head) to join. In protest (I guess), I joined the N.U.T. instead. Within a year or so, there was a call to go on strike. I resigned from the union. Whereas I wasn't exactly happy with my terms of employment or my job, I accepted the situation, and thought that teaching continuity was priority.. Thereby, hopefully, you can see where I'm coming from, as they say. I can only see the overall picture from an economic and non political standpoint. No axes to grind except in my own hassles !
Enfield boy
pfm Member
While execs are awarding themselves inflation smashing rises year on year and ordinary staff pay has been falling in real terms in most jobs for the last 12 years perhaps imaging the circumstances of a young rail worker, teacher, nurse etc with a young family, mortgage, energy bills.
Are they supposed to accept homelessness or bankruptcy just to avoid inconveniencing others? The present economic circumstances in the UK are a life and death struggle for many and it's been a deliberate choice by the party of government and the corporate paymasters, non-doms and hedge funds they serve. those acquiescing to this are equally to blame.
Are they supposed to accept homelessness or bankruptcy just to avoid inconveniencing others? The present economic circumstances in the UK are a life and death struggle for many and it's been a deliberate choice by the party of government and the corporate paymasters, non-doms and hedge funds they serve. those acquiescing to this are equally to blame.
Cav
pfm Member
tl;dr
You Tories can't accept the concept of fairness in society. Pay the rich more; screw the poor - and the sick and the disenfranchised and the vulnerable and the weak.
You Tories have brought the country to its knees and you bitch about your personal inconvenience - suck it up.
Monitor Gold 10
pfm Member
Pointless to include as that is surely the main/only driver of a business.
A strike is going to inconvenience people regardless, Paul. I was really, I suppose, referring to deliberately targetting max. inconvenience re. special events like the Marathon, e.g.
No idea, Enfield Boy, as I've always accepted the terms of my employment in a lifetime of different jobs. If I was dissatisfied, I left. Just cannot understand the union mentality, or so it seems, to confront employers, modernisation and changing needs for greater efficiency.
Nope! I don't, as I've had little experience of even belonging to a union let alone understanding the rational reasons for this country, currently in the grip of so many economic and domestic pressures, having strikes compound things and potentially or actually degrade the chances of us all benefitting from climbing out of this mess.
In retrospect I thought I might have been stirring up a hornets' nest.
Much later, in the late seventies and after about 6 years of teaching, I was eventually forced (more or less) by the N.A.S./U.W.T. rep. (deputy head) to join. In protest (I guess), I joined the N.U.T. instead. Within a year or so, there was a call to go on strike. I resigned from the union. Whereas I wasn't exactly happy with my terms of employment or my job, I accepted the situation, and thought that teaching continuity was priority.. Thereby, hopefully, you can see where I'm coming from, as they say. I can only see the overall picture from an economic and non political standpoint. No axes to grind except in my own hassles !
A number of friends and people I know have similar views. They believe in the Class System and see themselves as Middle Class.
Their occupations/ careers offer far better pay and conditions and are socially acceptable.
They don't appear to be aware of the shitty pay and conditions faced by those who they perceive to be in jobs associated with Working Class; indeed I get the impression that they don't care.
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Dear me; you've given me a label I didn't know I had. No idea why, as I was expressing a simple, entirely non politically motivated opinion. Why on Earth does everybody and his dog need to jump on a political bandwagon? You might be politically biased, but I'm not; nor am I really interested, as I thought was pretty obvious by now. T.b.h., I'd be lost if asked to explain Conservative and Labour values nowadays although it used to be a difference of perceived taxation and finance, I believe.
What the heck is the class system in the 21st century? More than ever before, progress is mostly built on merit, which in my opinion is right. That merit doesn't even need to be accomplished by a good education, though obv. it helps. Maybe I'm out of date and the class system is represented solely by the job you do nowadays, though not at all sure how to pigeon-hole that one.
I've never come across the 'socially acceptable' side of various job choices. I never realised I was socially unacceptable when I was a cable jointer's mate; it was simply a job, just like teaching.
Does that apply to railway personnel? I'd no idea they reflected your comment above. To me, 'shitty conditions' would be to sit in a chair in a large office operating a computer all day.
Everybody has their own viewpoint on most things; luckily we can express them in democracies but that shouldn't immediately bring down inappropriate and spurious opprobrium on the expression of those views.