Whizzy
pfm Member
No
What cable and sockets in your dedicated radial?
- Thread starter Pterodactyl
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- cable dedicated radial sockets
No
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
Thank you for that short and definitive (if not sweet and affirmative) answer.
It's a shame that people are so conservative (as Boris Johnson used to say).
Please do let us know if you ever happen to come across one (or do it yourself).
Best wishes
James
It's a shame that people are so conservative (as Boris Johnson used to say).
Please do let us know if you ever happen to come across one (or do it yourself).
Best wishes
James
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
martin clark
pinko bodger
Total misapprehension.
The acoustic boundary reinforcement in the bass comes from being close to the room boundary - but that boundary does not have to, actually, be 'stone'! The reasons are pretty simple overall, but utterly defeat the persistent audio-forum marginal idea that the boundary must be dense. it really, really, really - does not need to be. It just acts to provide a virtual image / extension/ of the speakers front baffle.
& yes - I'd always prefer listening across a room. the enhanced distance (delays of reflections from the 'side' walls) helps defeat the Haas effect; it always sounds cleaner, tonally, and temporally. Again - very, very basic acoustics.
The idea that you need to be sat on the long axis to hear the fullest expression of bass extension is also utter, complete, longstanding, demonstrably false bollox once even the most the basic acoustic issues of how rooms behave is gr()kked - but it's still out there, for decades now, perpetuated by conflated forum myths.
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
I liked your original post better where you wrote:
"It just acts as virtual image of the speakers front baffle."
"It just acts as virtual image of the speakers front baffle."
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Not my experience at all, Martin, either in 15' wide rectangular or 10/12' wide long rooms. Back to wall speakers like Briks, SBLs and some folded horns and I.B. speakers can work firing across 'narrow' (i.e. <13') rooms because their imaging capacity is less than that of free-standing (usually front/rear ported) m/coil speakers. I have never found reflections from side walls to be problematic in any of my many listening rooms over the ages.
In my first house circa 1975/6 I had Leak 2075 'Dalek' speakers firing across from chimney breast recesses (bad news, I know) into crooks and nannies but actual room only about 12' wide, but as I added rear Leaks to immerse myself into the quadraphonic fiasco, it didn't matter in that delusional sonic experiment; (gosh, the money spent just after buying a house !!! Fools etc.....)
My friend fires his ported ProAc R3.5s across his 13' wide room with speakers away from the rear and side, but his sweet spot is pretty limited and I don't think he reaps the holographic potential of those speakers (which I also had for years). He doesn't have a choice though but lives alone, so no worries !
I think it's swings and roundabouts judging by how fishies have their layouts and really does depend upon the kit, room size and domestic ergonomics. My ESLs (or any) do need that extra space behind and indeed, in front for full soundstage, so firing down a room is mandatory, i.m.o.
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
I'd love to hear more about your foray into quadraphonic sound.
My room is 11.8 feet wide, which also vindicates the decision to play across the room.
An office move at work means I have bring home about 500 books from the office, so I'm going to create bookshelves on the blank rear wall opposite the speakers.
As regards radials, I am edging strongly towards adopting your recommendation of many radials.
Discussion with electrician planned for early next week.
Mike Reed
pfm Member
Can't see why 11'8" vindicates firing across; to my mind it mitigates against, esp. if you're going to reduce that width with books etc. Don't forget the space needed behind the listening position (for 'air') Okay, you have SL2s, but even toed in (and not sure that's recommended; certainly not for SBLs & Briks) will you get a decently wide soundstage?
If there's no routing prob., multiple radials are preferable (logically at least !
).I went the whole hog with the Marantz top receiver with oscilloscopes + SQ/QS and CD4 separate decoders + Onlife m/coil CD4 H.O. cart. The Marantz bought used when 25% VAT, but luckily I didn't lose too much when VAT was reduced by half, when I sold it locally to a chap who wanted it for 8 track cart's. Yup, strange world. Lack of software (records), esp. CD4 discrete and uncoordinated quadraphonic industry/record producers meant that this departure from stereo didn't last long, never to return.
B.t.w., don't think I mentioned that I had the 52 (with 4 x 135s, 01, Headline (yuk!) and Superline, Supercaps etc. Went to 552 in 2007/8; big improvement, but would not revert nowadays, despite hassles with valves (time) against instant push-button Naim music (with ProAc R4s followed by Quad 2905s ESL)
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
555/552/500 are all out of my budget for the foreseeable future, probably forever - esp. since the massive price rise last year.
To be honest I am delighted with what I have, and am now investing time and energy to make the most of it in terms of set-up, etc.
Installed so long ago, I really can't remember. His thoughts on 'rings' made sense to me. As to prices, yes a a bit silly but I had contacts in the States and
use to get Kimber cable at dealer prices from there. The initial sparks took tails from the main box which kind of defeated the object. The advantage of
the the separate unit being powered directly from the incoming? Sounded better? Well it got rid of spurious noises from Microwaves, Dishwashers etc.
Working in telecomms at the time, let's just say the Copex was a tad less than Russ is charging,lol.
Have to say I did initially buy some cables from Russ till I graduated to really silly things like Shunyata and stuff that made even them sound cheap,
price wise that is
Just to give you an idea how ridiculous the pricing in the UK was even way back then, my Hydra and accompanying cord were £4.5K here.
Bought mine used from the States for $2000.
Loaned the aforementioned to half a dozen folks when I went on Holiday. All must be as deranged as myself because every single one of
them couldn't live without them and forked out for a similar set up? Luckily I had contacts in the Far East so cost them considerably less
than going to a dealer here and made me a couple of shillings.
Thankfully I have no need to indulge in all these shenanigans these days as my system thrills me every time I listen to music and loose no
sleep over what my power cords,i/c's or speakers cables cost. - well at used or dealer prices that is! Happy for all the folks with their Kettle leads.
Possibly hold you brain in whilst executing this swap over in case it 'fools' out. It was an answer to a question as to what I use, end off. My guess is you are an inveterate box swapper with no idea what your system is actually capable off, so keep cavorting in your field!
Curtis
pfm Member
Brilliant!
This thread has proved to me what idiots we have in the community.
I’m off to Brian cox’s house to enlighten him on particle physics.
Oh how wrong you are, but never mind.
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
It could mitigate or it could militate against.
I don't think 'mitigate against' is a thing.
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
If I did decide to play along the room, I would not build the bookshelves as they would make the room asymmetrical and even narrower.
So that's another reason to play across the room - because it allows me to build bookshelves on the rear wall and house my books.
Also, the issue was already decided above - I believe (based on reading many posts on the issue) that SL2s (and SBLs) sound better against a stone wall than a plasterboard wall.
So that alone settles the issue.
Add to that the books thing, and the no side-wall reflections, and ample space for racks in right-hand corner and it's a no-brainer.
As regards the listening chair being well out from the back wall - yes, that is even shown in the above plan.
My last sitting room was 11x22' - so much longer and a bit less wide than the new sitting room.
In the old room I had the chair about 4 feet out from the rear wall and that worked well.
In this room I will experiment with the chair until I find the sweet spot, but I'd expect it to be about a third of the way out.
Yes, SL2s are supposed to have zero toe-in.
I had a few degrees in my last room.
I'll experiment it in this room and see what works best.
As regards soundstage, I'm not really bothered about that as a feature of music.
I tune into whether the instruments - usually piano, double bass and drums - sound like they are there in the room where they were recorded at a gig or in a studio with minimal editing.
If that is soundstage, that's fine but I don't think of it in 3D terms more as actual instruments in a room.
I know that a room may be considered as a 3D space, but I focus more on how visceral the specific instruments feel, not what spatial position they have in relation to one another.
I almost never listen to vocal music.
Richard Lines
pfm Member
Good Evening All,
Answering the original question I fitted a MCRU 6mm T&E "spur" cable from a dedicated outlet in the Consumer Unit in the kitchen up into the loft and across and down in to the Hi-Fi Room in to a MCRU double socket.
Regards
Richard
Answering the original question I fitted a MCRU 6mm T&E "spur" cable from a dedicated outlet in the Consumer Unit in the kitchen up into the loft and across and down in to the Hi-Fi Room in to a MCRU double socket.
Regards
Richard
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
Thanks for these interesting stories.
I am not an inveterate box swapper.
[My guess is that you are attributing to me something that previously applied to you, judging from your stories of buying hyper-expensive cables - which I have never done.]
After 24 years of buying 2nd hand Marantz, KEF, Rotel, etc, in 2004 I bought a new basic Naim system - kept this unchanged until 4 years ago, then moved to streaming, and traded to what I have now.
In 42 years of owning a HiFi system, I estimate that I have owned only 36 boxes including turntables, graphic equalizers and speakers (counting each individual speaker as 1 box).
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
Thanks Richard
Was that a single cable for all your boxes?
Do you use a block and leads or a Hydra?
Did it sound better than when you had them on the ring main (don't be shy to admit it!)?
Pterodactyl
pfm Member
How far is it from your meter to hifi CU - and from your hifi CU to the connector blocks?