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Roe vs Wade overturned

I don’t know whether Stairpost is being entirely serious when he says that sex is about procreation, but if he is, this would mean that contraception is wrong because if effective it makes procreation impossible.

Plus of course sex between two men or two women is definitely about everything but procreation.
 
Can of worms. Forget I said anything.
There's something else, too. I'm not aware of much evidence that animals have sex for fun - all those Attenborough series fail to depict a whole lot of enjoyment and intimacy, despite miles of footage of copulation. So how come we humans get such a kick out of it?
Ignore the chimps, look at the Bonobos, our other 'closest relative':
 
The idea that sex is for procreation is one of the least examined ideas in this thread.

This is (or at least was) the Roman Catholic view. The papal encyclical Humanae Vitae of Paul VI

https://www.vatican.va/content/paul...ments/hf_p-vi_enc_25071968_humanae-vitae.html

does soften this position slightly, but the emphasis remains firmly on procreation. The teaching is that every sexual act must be open to the possibility of procreation, hence the prohibition for the faithful of any kind of contraceptive means.

11. The sexual activity, in which husband and wife are intimately and chastely united with one another, through which human life is transmitted, is, as the recent Council recalled, "noble and worthy.'' (11) It does not, moreover, cease to be legitimate even when, for reasons independent of their will, it is foreseen to be infertile. For its natural adaptation to the expression and strengthening of the union of husband and wife is not thereby suppressed. The fact is, as experience shows, that new life is not the result of each and every act of sexual intercourse. God has wisely ordered laws of nature and the incidence of fertility in such a way that successive births are already naturally spaced through the inherent operation of these laws. The Church, nevertheless, in urging men to the observance of the precepts of the natural law, which it interprets by its constant doctrine, teaches that each and every marital act must of necessity retain its intrinsic relationship to the procreation of human life.


For a long time, only the rhythm method was approved, but the old joke is that practitioners of the rhythm method are called parents. The Billings Method is said to be slightly more reliable.
 
What the hell have Freemasons got to do with anything here, or anyone's "ordeals"?

Everything, their tentacles spread far and wide, manipulate and corrode, they are a law unto themselves.

The police, the legal profession, they are everywhere interfering for their own ends.

You and other minions are merely their useful idiots.

I crossed swords with a property baron freemason via the courts. they had a feeble legal case and lost several times right until the court of appeal where they had my win set aside by three freemasonic judges!!

I was bullied on the street by their compatriots.

My friends in the music business made a heavy stand against them and they backed down.

I'm happy to discuss freemasonry with you if you'd like to PM me.

I have nothing to discus freemasons with anyone!

Research "Captain Morgan" and freemasons...

https://www.google.com/search?q=Research+"Captain+Morgan"+and+"freemasons"&rlz=1C1VDKB_en-GBGB938GB938&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
 
A blob of jelly is not a child

I must say that comments like this and "it's just a bunch of cells" which others have posted truly sicken me.

Abortions in this country are legal up to the 24th week of pregnancy so could you please look at a photo of a fetus or premature child around this age before posting such stupid comments.

A good friend of mine recently had to have an abortion at 23 weeks as the baby was going to be born with less than half a brain and most of its skull missing. It would not have been able to survive outside the womb.
This child was called Saul and both the parents have been severely mentally effected by what happened.
I can assure you that Saul was not a blob of jelly...
 
last week i was at the house of a family in mourning as they lost their baby just a bit younger than this . it was painful to behold their loss as they arranged the funeral
 
I must say that comments like this and "it's just a bunch of cells" which others have posted truly sicken me.
I managed a similar phrase earlier in the thread. When I wrote it, I did not have in mind even an early-stage foetus, let alone a 23-week old baby, but that is not an excuse. I am sorry for any offence I may have caused, and will be more sensitive in future.
 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-61849137

A Texas church in Dallas, one of the most religious cities in the United States, has become a haven for those seeking abortions. For members, its long history in the fight for reproductive choice brings hope for a post-Roe future.

It was well before dawn in Dallas but a group of women were already seated scrolling through their phones or picking at a free continental breakfast in the classroom where they had been told to gather. Bleary-eyed and yawning, they were waiting to board a flight that would change their lives.

Many were women of colour, all were from different backgrounds. A teenager came with her mom. Another woman drove through the night from Oklahoma.

But they all had one thing in common - each was more than six weeks pregnant and could not legally obtain an abortion in the state of Texas.

They had also all placed their trust in a seemingly unlikely source - volunteers with the First Unitarian Church of Dallas - who would fly them to New Mexico, where they could end their pregnancies.

The tension was palpable as the church's senior pastor, Rev Daniel Kanter, addressed the women assembled.

"God loves you. You have dignity and worth and your life is the priority here," he said. "If you're surprised a person of faith like me is standing in front of you saying that - that's a good thing. But it shouldn
't be".
 
There's something else, too. I'm not aware of much evidence that animals have sex for fun - all those Attenborough series fail to depict a whole lot of enjoyment and intimacy, despite miles of footage of copulation. So how come we humans get such a kick out of it? Presumably, those who argue from a religious perspective would assert that this is God's gift and proves, yet again, that They have put us in a special category among the beasts of the Earth. So if it is God's gift, then isn't treating it as only for procreation an affront to the giver?

It’s a long time since my last ethnology lecture, but a key point is that for prey animals copulation is a dangerous distraction from the key need to avoid being eaten. Thus the need for much sniffing and behavioural cues to identify the moment of greatest effect.

Also important for more sociable animals in less danger of predation is the need to maintain your social status - many Attenborough films show sneaky lower-status animals trying their luck while the alpha male is bonking all and sundry.

For humans, these considerations have not been important for long enough for evolution to have had an effect on increasing the effects on bonding and childcare mentioned so eloquently upthread.
 
Everything, their tentacles spread far and wide, manipulate and corrode, they are a law unto themselves.

The police, the legal profession, they are everywhere interfering for their own ends.

You and other minions are merely their useful idiots.

I crossed swords with a property baron freemason via the courts. they had a feeble legal case and lost several times right until the court of appeal where they had my win set aside by three freemasonic judges!!

I was bullied on the street by their compatriots.

My friends in the music business made a heavy stand against them and they backed down.



I have nothing to discus freemasons with anyone!

Research "Captain Morgan" and freemasons...

https://www.google.com/search?q=Research+"Captain+Morgan"+and+"freemasons"&rlz=1C1VDKB_en-GBGB938GB938&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
Same old same old then. Just a load of paranoid rubbish.
 
Same old same old then. Just a load of paranoid rubbish.

That's their script eh!!

Lord Phillips of Worthmatravers...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Phillips,_Baron_Phillips_of_Worth_Matravers

Leading judge allowing a corrupt landlords appeal from his iffy
legal case he lost three times in the lower court.

Worth Matravers only pub...

https://www.squareandcompasspub.co.uk/

20180205_banner_home_01.jpg


Chew on that and your paranoia.
 
It’s a long time since my last ethnology lecture, but a key point is that for prey animals copulation is a dangerous distraction from the key need to avoid being eaten. Thus the need for much sniffing and behavioural cues to identify the moment of greatest effect.

Also important for more sociable animals in less danger of predation is the need to maintain your social status - many Attenborough films show sneaky lower-status animals trying their luck while the alpha male is bonking all and sundry.

For humans, these considerations have not been important for long enough for evolution to have had an effect on increasing the effects on bonding and childcare mentioned so eloquently upthread.

Sorry for the OT, but I saw an interesting thing about lions recently. Originally, in the historically male dominated world of science, it was assumed that males were sexually aggressive and females were submissive and monogamous. Then it was observed that females initiated mating with multiple males, and often the entire pack. The reason? Male lions cannibalize the young of other males, so females are "promiscuous" primarily as a method of confusing the pack about who the father is. Copulation is a survival tactic for her offspring!
 
Maybe there's good freemasons and bad freemasons. The only ones I've met seemed pleasant enough; they even gave me a free biro when I went on a guided tour of their Lodge on Park Street (though I kept thinking of Mark E Smith shouting out 'At the Lodge! At the Lodge!' on 'Feeling Numb'). They even asked me to join them, but I told them, politely but firmly, that as a Roman Catholic I was forbidden to do so, on pain of eternal Hell fire.

See Arthur Brown, he's the god of hell fire.

 
Don't you know it.

I could write a book about the ordeals at the mercy of christians and their co-conspirators, the freemasons.

Despicable bunch.

Hands up any other Adoptees here on pfm?
What has Freemasonry got to do with adoption?
 
I must say that comments like this and "it's just a bunch of cells" which others have posted truly sicken me.

Abortions in this country are legal up to the 24th week of pregnancy so could you please look at a photo of a fetus or premature child around this age before posting such stupid comments.

A good friend of mine recently had to have an abortion at 23 weeks as the baby was going to be born with less than half a brain and most of its skull missing. It would not have been able to survive outside the womb.
This child was called Saul and both the parents have been severely mentally effected by what happened.
I can assure you that Saul was not a blob of jelly...
Where did I refer to a foetus as a blob? I didn’t. A collecting of cells is definitively not a foetus. What I find sickening is people who distort and invent a meaning to make a moralising point based on belief. I am very sorry for Saul, but he was clearly a lot more than a collection of cells. He was clearly loved and the decision to terminate the pregnancy was, from my reading of your post, extremely traumatic. But this thread is about removing the right to abortion, and even if US law permitted abortion in your friends case, the added barriers to getting that abortion would only have further detriment impact on the mental health of women in your friends position. You are entitled to you beliefs, but please don’t try to inflict them on me.
 
That's their script eh!!

Lord Phillips of Worthmatravers...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Phillips,_Baron_Phillips_of_Worth_Matravers

Leading judge allowing a corrupt landlords appeal from his iffy
legal case he lost three times in the lower court.

Worth Matravers only pub...

https://www.squareandcompasspub.co.uk/

20180205_banner_home_01.jpg


Chew on that and your paranoia.
I've checked the list of Grand Officers in the 2018 Yearbook. Phillips isn't in it. Given his standing it's unlikely that he wouldn't have had Grand Rank by then if he were a Mason. Therefore I can only conclude that he's not a Mason, and you have a paranoid fantasy that everyone who crosses you in any way must surely be.
Of course, you'll now tell me that he's a secret Mason.
 


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