Electric bicycles

[sean99]

This is exactly the problem with which I was faced. The hill on top of which we live averages 16%, and in some places goes up to 23% - even the road racers are up dancing on their pedals. I simply can no longer do it on the old touring bike, and I really don't want another knee operation. The motor I have is like having three extra gears below the already low bottom gear, and I only need the second one to make the hill. It's good knowing that, when the physical effort is too much, I can simply press the magic switch.

Tones - I think yours is a somewhat special case. If I lived atop the Matterhorn I would also likely endorse electric bikes.
However I fear that 95% of electric bikes will become landfill in under 10 years because the batteries and or electronics will fail and the bike will be a 35-40lb boat anchor without them. I like the idea of a mild electric assist on the front or rear hub on a bike which could easily be converted to a normal bike (or have another wheel fitted). But the ultra-integrated motors and electronics seem like an unrepairable problem waiting to happen.

 

[richardg]

Because you still seem to believe the batteries are no cause for concern...when they are in fact a very major one...it's not the cells that are an issue...it's the BMS boards...BUT if a cell or cells did go out of spec...chances are it would total the pack and make it unrepairable
My estimate is 70% chance

Just to satisfy your self I'm telling it how it is...why not phone someone like
https://www.electricbikebatteryrepairs.co.uk

Tell them your bosch battery won't switch on and has no power lights on it...how much to repair?

Then let's see if your still so unconcerned

Ok, well I have never heard anyone else complain about this potential problem...and I can't find anything on forums other than re-celling following a quick search (looking forward to your links, no doubt they exist in spades!). And re-celling is in fact possible.

I have two of these batteries, both old, both good. I have a few friends with them too. Noone ever mentioned anything other than worry about losing charge.

 

[ff1d1l]

Tones - I think yours is a somewhat special case. If I lived atop the Matterhorn I would also likely endorse electric bikes.
However I fear that 95% of electric bikes will become landfill in under 10 years because the batteries and or electronics will fail and the bike will be a 35-40lb boat anchor without them. I like the idea of a mild electric assist on the front or rear hub on a bike which could easily be converted to a normal bike (or have another wheel fitted). But the ultra-integrated motors and electronics seem like an unrepairable problem waiting to happen.

Conversions will convert back.

 

[richardg]

Tones - I think yours is a somewhat special case. If I lived atop the Matterhorn I would also likely endorse electric bikes.
However I fear that 95% of electric bikes will become landfill in under 10 years because the batteries and or electronics will fail and the bike will be a 35-40lb boat anchor without them. I like the idea of a mild electric assist on the front or rear hub on a bike which could easily be converted to a normal bike (or have another wheel fitted). But the ultra-integrated motors and electronics seem like an unrepairable problem waiting to happen.

Hmm, yes if people like Bosch refuse to supply motherboards to batteries, then this is where the problem is. It's a corporate repsonsibility issue, methinks?

 

[tones]

Tones - I think yours is a somewhat special case. If I lived atop the Matterhorn I would also likely endorse electric bikes.
However I fear that 95% of electric bikes will become landfill in under 10 years because the batteries and or electronics will fail and the bike will be a 35-40lb boat anchor without them. I like the idea of a mild electric assist on the front or rear hub on a bike which could easily be converted to a normal bike (or have another wheel fitted). But the ultra-integrated motors and electronics seem like an unrepairable problem waiting to happen.

Oh well, I'll just have to wait and see, although I can't imagine reputable makes such as Specialized letting their bikes become landfill so quickly. Perhaps the best solution is to buy a bike with a Fazua Evation motor - the battery is a removable part of the down-tube, and can actually be replaced with a conventional bit of tube, so that you have essentially a normal bike.

https://fazua.com/en/

The one thing I didn't want was something with a monster external battery pack, so the Specialized, with its battery inside the down-tube, suited me fine.

 

[Mynamemynaim]

Hmm, yes if people like Bosch refuse to supply motherboards to batteries, then this is where the problem is. It's a corporate repsonsibility issue, methinks?

Sadly it's even more cynical than not supplying boards
The boards actually have a "hand shake" chip programmed so that if any issue trips it ...the handshake is PERMANENTLY lost and the battery is useless (ie cannot be repaired....a "suicide chip")
If a Bosch pack is re-celled before a fault develops ...then as long as the BMS is kept powered on correctly ALL the time the batteries are being rebuilt...then it is possible to do it. (Needs a very special rig to do this )


But as you have not heard of a problem... I must be imagining it


https://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/bosch-400wh-battery-sudden-death.39669/

Link to other people with wild imaginations....and a lot lot more on various forums where that came from sadly

 

[Martyn Miles]

My wife and I bought Raleigh models. We are extremely happy with them.

Tried others, but preferred the Raleighs.
Got a brilliant deal, as we bought both at the same time.

 

[George J]

For what it might be worth, I am off the view that a conversion of a bike to electric assist is far preferable to a new electric bike.

Firstly you give added utility to an existing machine, even for for the small carbon footprint of an existing pedal only bike so it is good environmentally, and should the conversion kit be unsupported in the future, then get another when the time comes - as it surely will.

Secondly, if you are tied in to a purpose designed electric assist bike you will be faced with a completely impossible conversion to a new system that cannot fit the existing bike, so it becomes so much scrap, like a CD player you can no longer get a proprietary disc drive to fit.

I have not had a CD player for twelve years. If want to play a CD, I insert the disc into a simple external USB disc drive on my ancient Mac mini. It works just as well as any CD player. For best results I rip to iTunes [in AIFF] first, which is better than any CD player can do.

KISS: Keep It Simple Stupid. The matter of inbuilt obsolescence is an ethical evil which we must guard against by refusing proprietary solutions, but going for generic reversible alternatives, such an electric conversion solution on a pedal cycle.

Even Bosch may not support a very expensive dedicated electric bike in a staggeringly short number of years.

Just tuppence' worth from George

 

[Dowser]

Tones - I think yours is a somewhat special case. If I lived atop the Matterhorn I would also likely endorse electric bikes.
However I fear that 95% of electric bikes will become landfill in under 10 years because the batteries and or electronics will fail and the bike will be a 35-40lb boat anchor without them. I like the idea of a mild electric assist on the front or rear hub on a bike which could easily be converted to a normal bike (or have another wheel fitted). But the ultra-integrated motors and electronics seem like an unrepairable problem waiting to happen.

I bought an early 2011 Stromer a few years back, just started using it again now I have to go into office again, so 50km commute. Works perfectly still, although battery needs a repack again - cheap enough in Germany, or maybe I try it myself this time.

 

[tonerei]

Took a test drive on a few today. The Cube Touring Hybrid Pro 500 stood out. Really cycled nice. Plenty of Prat
At its price level it seems better put together than the Raleigh Motus. Think I am going to go for it. Looks like next delivery is early March possibly extending out to June of next year. The wait doesn't bother me as the winter is closing in and not ready to go all in to the biking yet. Some of the negative stuff about the Bosch system is concerning but my real bug bearer is the worry about theft. I am already investigating the various options available to dissuade the miserable scum who steal bikes from targeting my toy. I can see me getting a bike alarm and if realistic a gps tracker to go with the usual array of kryponite, abus armoury and removal of battery tactics to try and ward of these sub humans.

@George J is probably right about it being more sensible to go for a standard bike with electric kit but with our bike2work schemes one gets nearly circa €780 off the price and you can buy it over a year through your workplace.

I see them as a necessary transition to try and get me out of the car when travelling around the city. It is getting more difficult to bring your car into Dublin and certainly not environmentally friendly. Also need to widen my options for keeping the fitness levels up.