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Pre-Preamp' MC Amplification

Yes lots of confusion!!

So just for my own clarity:

MM cartridge - goes into MM phonostage with typically 40db gain
MC cartridge - goes into MC phonostage with typically 60-70db gain

But there are devices that give that 20db boost (and sometimes other adjustments) that "convert" your MM phonostage to MC. These are step up devices of one kind or another - they are already built into MC phonostages. Most common are step up transformers, usually 6x to 10x gain. BUT there was a fashion for solid state circuits that did the same thing - often referred to as a head amp, or MC pre pre. The classic circuit is the "Le Pacific MC pre pre", and this has been adapted by a few and was offered as a kit by Boozehound up til a few years ago. The attraction was that they allowed you to use your existing MM phonostage with a MC cart.

I'm probably only clouding the discussion on this, which I don't think is that the OP was talking about anyway. Ignore and carry on!!
 
I did have a McKinnie head amp' - a legend in its own lifetime. But mine went "pop" and the unobtainium JFETs were potted, so that was/is dead, dead.
I suspect that I would have never looked to have used anything else after that had it lived.
As of yesterday, I have an Elevator - early days, but played aongside an SUT, I like it a great deal. Obviously not side-by-side comparable to the McKinnie.

Head amp's are never cheap, one downside.


Dear Vinny,
Do you have this McKinnie prepre laying around in a closet somewhere and willing to sell?
Greetings,
Mario G Rouwenhorst
Netherlands
(shipping to LA possible)
 
Dear Vinny,
Do you have this McKinnie prepre laying around in a closet somewhere and willing to sell?
Greetings,
Mario G Rouwenhorst
Netherlands
(shipping to LA possible)

Hi Mario
Sorry - already sold.
Keep an eye on Switzerland - they appear for sale occasionally - it is where mine came from.
 
Implementation is everything! You may as well ask whether 4 cylinder, 6 cylinder or V8's are the best engine but unless you have all the information to know the differences in performance between a Honda VTEC DOHC and an Austin A series they are both just 4 cylinder engines!

Bearing that in mind and assuming very best practice and implementation without cost coming into it then:

1st/ MC phono stage.

2nd/ Head amp

3rd/ SUT

That's my experience. Currently use a very cheap NAD PP2 stand alone phono stage. It replaced the one in a Naim NAC 82. As they don't measure exactly the same, they don't sound precisely the same, but the PP2 does in no way sound bad. I've even compare digital transfers I've done with both. A younger me had both head amps and transformers, much trouble and not really worth the hazzle and money. IMHO and IME, of course.
 
Interesting one...

I’d not use a SUT before, am keen to know, what does SUT brings out that an active MC phono does not and vice versa. Was told SUT has no PRAT and not as transparent. However, I’d not experience it before and reading from Rothwell website, SUT seems to make a lot of sense an itch I may want to scratch.

I felt the same way after exploring SUT's. A few months ago, I eventually purchased a Rothwell Audio MCL S.U.T along with a pair of his excellent River Interconnects. Running this via the MM side of my Leema Essentials Phono-stage as opposed to directly via the MC side of it before. Overall presentation just seemed that little more open when using the S.U.T. A little more clarity too. I spoke at length with Andrew @ Rothwell Audio before purchasing as it is essential to get the best match for your particular cartridge, phono-stage and amplifier. The MCL suited my set up as the Leema Essentials Phono-stage only outputs 36db of gain, adding 26db from the MCL brought it up to 62db into the amplifier. He offers a 30 day money back return service if you are not entirely satisfied. Mine was not returned of course.
 
SUTS, pre pre amps and another alternative - namely nothing, I mean go back to an MM with a good tip, the correct load capacitance and a good valve phono stage. I will never go back to MC land. We’ve all been duped, Batman.
 
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You could be right, of course but just think back on how many times over the past 20-30 years you’ve read in hundreds (thousands?) of reviews and posts on amps, cartridges, speakers etc. etc. those fateful words “ a welcome touch of warmth”, implying the existence of the opposite in many, many systems. I sustain that MCs and step ups are an unnecessary complication for me and perhaps for others, that’s all.
 
I’ve had a few phono stages over the years either in a Naim 32.5 or, Graham Slee, Whest Audio 30R till I discovered the Paradise never looked back it’s been in my system for the last 6 years.

Regards,

Martin
 


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