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The Pegasus Project

I guess in a sense it's not surprising but it is unsettling considering how our phones never leave our side.

It does make you wonder whether some high profile folk wouldn't be better off with an old Nokia...
 
It's shocking to me that world leaders are being spied on, dissidents and investigative journalists being tracked and arrested and even murdered (Kashoggi case!) and that this tech has been given to despotic regimes and no one here appears to give a toss!
 
This sort of thing is, kinda, implied in some of the provisions of the Investigatory Powers Act 2016. This UK legislation does set some pretty rigorous controls on how such tech might be used (see the ‘equipment interference’ bits, for example). It’s one reason why I was broadly in favour of the IPA2016, contrary to those who labelled it the ‘snoopers charter’.

I noticed a fair bit of the activity in the Grauniad report I skimmed seemed to be initiated by Morocco, which may not have such constraints perhaps?
 
There's been new revelations each day... Macrons phone having being hacked for example and the tech having used by Saudi in connection with the Kashoggi murder, victor oban using it against dissidents etc.
 
Arkless Electronics said:
It's shocking to me that world leaders are being spied on, dissidents and investigative journalists being tracked and arrested and even murdered (Kashoggi case!) and that this tech has been given to despotic regimes and no one here appears to give a toss!
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Appearances can be deceptive. Even though this has been in the public domain for quite a while and what has arrived recently is just the proof, I am gobsmacked at the extent of its use and the ease with which it can infect. Surely Putin got his hands on it? Perhaps even the Chinese government have it.

What can we do? Can't really boycott the vulnerable devices- as that is all of them. The software is out of the box now and there will be no putting it back. The company that made Pegasus has close links to the Israeli Government and we all know that the US wouldn't dare say Boo to them. Their websites response is one of denial and claims that they carefully vet their clients, which they obviously do as they are mostly despotic or corrupt regimes.

The result is a chilling threat to dissidents and journos who have a tough enough time as it is. They can now be tracked and monitored at will by their greatest enemies, as long as they have deep enough pockets.

I wonder if Cummings has this installed on Bojo's phone??

John
 
john.luckins said:
I wonder if Cummings has this installed on Bojo's phone??
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He wouldn't need to, his number was freely available on the internet for god knows how long.

He is thick enough you could probably get him to install it himself with a scam phone call for "network/phone maintenance".
 
john.luckins said:
Appearances can be deceptive. Even though this has been in the public domain for quite a while and what has arrived recently is just the proof, I am gobsmacked at the extent of its use and the ease with which it can infect. Surely Putin got his hands on it? Perhaps even the Chinese government have it........
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They both have the capability and motive to make their own version.
 
Arkless Electronics said:
It's shocking to me that world leaders are being spied on, dissidents and investigative journalists being tracked and arrested and even murdered (Kashoggi case!) and that this tech has been given to despotic regimes and no one here appears to give a toss!
Click to expand...

I'm surprised you find this shocking. Given the amount of snooping without this type of code done already being done by the corporate world this is just the next level that was inevitable. I wouldn't be surprised if it's been going on for a lot longer than this.
 
it is about as shocking that governments acquire the tools to spy on each other. Spying, and the tools of spying have existed since there was something to spy on.
 
boneman said:
I'm surprised you find this shocking. Given the amount of snooping without this type of code done already being done by the corporate world this is just the next level that was inevitable. I wouldn't be surprised if it's been going on for a lot longer than this.
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It's not that it's going on that shocks me... it's people seemingly being unconcerned that dissidents are being assassinated and states using the tech to arrange murder and kidnap and to obtain data to rig elections etc that shocks me... that there is little protest against it.
 
sq225917 said:
Just buy a none smart phone.
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I don’t think that would help. It seems just having SMS functionality is enough.
I also don’t think legislation will help, as it will just go even more underground. Our dependence on mobile phones is the issue, and if we gave them up, where do you find a phone box these days? (Just asking for my mate Superman).

The problem is the SIM technology but then a SIM is a -ahem- SIM.

BTW has Pegasus been linked to the Daphne Caruana assassination yet?
 
john.luckins said:
Appearances can be deceptive. Even though this has been in the public domain for quite a while and what has arrived recently is just the proof, I am gobsmacked at the extent of its use and the ease with which it can infect. Surely Putin got his hands on it? Perhaps even the Chinese government have it.

What can we do? Can't really boycott the vulnerable devices- as that is all of them. The software is out of the box now and there will be no putting it back. The company that made Pegasus has close links to the Israeli Government and we all know that the US wouldn't dare say Boo to them. Their websites response is one of denial and claims that they carefully vet their clients, which they obviously do as they are mostly despotic or corrupt regimes.

The result is a chilling threat to dissidents and journos who have a tough enough time as it is. They can now be tracked and monitored at will by their greatest enemies, as long as they have deep enough pockets.

I wonder if Cummings has this installed on Bojo's phone??

John
Click to expand...

Well we can't do anything, but it's pretty clear that if Apple/Google were made aware of the techniques that this software is using to infect phones, they would be able to patch the vulnerabilities. The fact that they haven't been patched implies that Apple/Google have been asked to leave the bugs (possibly by the NSA) or, getting access to the software is really not that easy and hence even Apple/Google can't get it to experiment with.

My guess is that the access the software needs to infect a phone may be greater than you imagine. It might only work with access at a very low level to the phone network, constructing packets for phones that usually wouldn't be transmittable. This would work by the company providing some different software for a base station on the mobile phone network, the sort of access that a government can require a phone network company to provide. If this is the case, then it should mean that you are not likely to have your phone hacked by random rogue companies/individuals, but it would by that token imply that anyone who *has* been hacked would only be hackable by the government that controls the networks in the country they were hacked in.

Of course this is all wild speculation, i've no information beyond what is public. I did work for a number of years for a reclusive billionaire who had a bee in his bonnet about security, and went to great lengths to keep data and machines safe. He did things and spent money on things which seemed bonkers to me at the time, but the more I learn about this sort of hacking, the saner these decisions appear.
 
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