Busting the MSG Myth

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

It seems to me possible that some people have an allergy or intolerance for msg, which may be most obviously triggered when it's ingested as an additive, not as occurring naturally in the foodstuff, perhaps. Possibly dietary msg is absorbed at a rate which is tolerated, whereas added msg is taken up more rapidly in quantities which trigger an adverse reaction?

 

[Vinny]

Possibly dietary msg is absorbed at a rate which is tolerated, whereas added msg is taken up more rapidly in quantities which trigger an adverse reaction?

Dirty sums again (apologies for mixed units) - an 8oz steak contains about 70g of protein. Going on the 4-5% of animal protein being glutamate, that is around 3g of glutamate, which, having never weighed/seen any, but based on comments on the R4 programme, is over a teaspoonful.
How easily/quickly is steak digested? Lots of varaibles there...........................

 

[Heckyman]

The FDA estimates that, in the US, the average adult consumes 13 g of glutamate per day from food sources and about 0.55 g from added MSG. By contrast, in some Asian countries, the average adult consumes at least 2.2 g of added MSG.

Source:
https://examine.com/nutrition/is-msg-bad-for-your-health/

 

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

Dirty sums again (apologies for mixed units) - an 8oz steak contains about 70g of protein. Going on the 4-5% of animal protein being glutamate, that is around 3g of glutamate, which, having never weighed/seen any, but based on comments on the R4 programme, is over a teaspoonful.
How easily/quickly is steak digested? Lots of varaibles there...........................

Sure, I wonder whether there's an analogy to the 'low GI/high GI' foods thing? The rate that essentially the same compound is absorbed depends on the way it is presented to the gut?

 

[Vinny]

in the US, the average adult consumes 13 g of glutamate per day from food sources

How much is actually absorbed is another question entirely, but it will be a lot. No digestive system is 100% effective, and cooking protein makes it less digestible, but studies in animals typically show around 60-80% digestion of dietary protein.

People seem to have a weird idea of how much is added to foods - it is used a condiment, in pretty much the same way as salt.

 

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

How much is actually absorbed is another question entirely, but it will be a lot. No digestive system is 100% effective, and cooking protein makes it less digestible, but studies in animals typically show around 60-80% digestion of dietary protein.

People seem to have a weird idea of how much is added to foods - it is used a condiment, in pretty much the same way as salt.

Sure, and in the way that people with high blood pressure are told to reduce added salt to a minimum, perhaps those with a sensitivity to msg should look to do the same?

 

[Vinny]

I wonder whether there's an analogy to the 'low GI/high GI' foods thing?

Has that not been blown out of the water?

The rate that essentially the same compound is absorbed depends on the way it is presented to the gut?

That depends on what you mean. Umpteen years ago there was a whole TV series looking at nutrition facts and myths. One experiment, they fed the same fried breakfast to two small groups of people - one as a plate of food, one group it was liquidised and offered as soup. The group fed soup felt satisfied, in no need of a snack, for quite a while longer than the group who ate the whole items.

 

[Enfield boy]

Liquified fry up would probably put most off eating for a while!

 

[davidsrsb]

Ajinomoto costs about £2 a kg, cooks pile it in (yes its sold in 1 kg bags). Much cheaper than real spices and fresh ingredients.

 

[davidsrsb]

People tend in SE Asia to keel over in their 50s from hypertension and heart disease. Diet is a big part of this

 

[MartinC]

It seems to me possible that some people have an allergy or intolerance for msg, which may be most obviously triggered when it's ingested as an additive, not as occurring naturally in the foodstuff, perhaps. Possibly dietary msg is absorbed at a rate which is tolerated, whereas added msg is taken up more rapidly in quantities which trigger an adverse reaction?

My doctor mentioned that the symptoms I get are similar to those of one reacting to a poison as opposed to a allergic reaction. As to Vinny's constant assertion that MSG cannot cause any adverse effect on anyone, I will tell that to my migraine when I accidentally ingest some and see if it goes away. Sure, 99.9% of the population may be fine with added MSG, it's just that it triggers something in the remaining 0.1%.

 

[garyi]

Well that's fair enough but probably fair to say the same for tomatoes or rich tea biscuits.

 

[Dozey]

Perhaps the naturally occurring glutamates are not mono sodium? Or not predominantly mono sodium?

 

[stevec67]

Perhaps the naturally occurring glutamates are not mono sodium? Or not predominantly mono sodium?

In nature msg exists as glutaminc acid and sodium ions, just like table salt. Living things are swilling in sodium salts, that's why blood and sweat are salty.

 

[stevec67]

It seems to me possible that some people have an allergy or intolerance for msg, which may be most obviously triggered when it's ingested as an additive, not as occurring naturally in the foodstuff, perhaps. Possibly dietary msg is absorbed at a rate which is tolerated, whereas added msg is taken up more rapidly in quantities which trigger an adverse reaction?

Almost certainly yes. It's about dose. You can poison yourself with table salt, but you can't eat enough salty food or even drink who sea water to do so. You'd just be sick. Likewise alcohol, there is always a trace in your body from natural gut bacteria. So are you and I permanently drunk? Or course not. But half a bottle a whisky will change that very quickly.

 

[kensalriser]

Everything is toxic in the right dosage, even water. Rice has arsenic in it, apple seeds have cynanide. That doesn't mean it's safe to ingest any amount of arsenic or cyanide.

I don't like MSG and can detect it in small amounts - it leaves a particular drying mouth feel I find really unpleasant. I don't find the same with any foodstuff containing naturally occurring glutamate.

 

[Dozey]

In nature msg exists as glutaminc acid and sodium ions, just like table salt. Living things are swilling in sodium salts, that's why blood and sweat are salty.

But also swimming in potassium ions and any number of other monovalent ions?

 

[cubastreet]

I quite like the msg - alcohol analogy mentioned upthread.

In normal quantities I don't notice msg, but when it's ladled into the wok I get heart palpitations and a strange malaise.

Likewise, I can eat as much kimchi as I like and remain unaffected the alcohol. Just one bottle of whiskey though, and I guarantee I'll have a headache the next day.

It's amazing how concentration can affect your experience.

 

[stevec67]

But also swimming in potassium ions and any number of other monovalent ions?

Yes, less so than sodium, but yes, they're all present. The Na-K balance is well studied. Either way the stuff isn't present as a sodium salt, it's dissociated in aqueous solution. So is everything, so considerations that it may not be the monosodium salt in nature are irrelevant.

 

[flatpopely]

Yes, less so than sodium, but yes, they're all present. The Na-K balance is well studied. Either way the stuff isn't present as a sodium salt, it's dissociated in aqueous solution.

Whatever..............the NAK 580 is sweet as.