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Active hi-fi speakers vs active studio monitors for Linn Akurate DSM

linnfomaniac83 said:
The only speakers I’ve ever lived with long term in my main system have been Linn speakers... but then I measure pretty badly so maybe that’s why they suit me!
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I wonder which measurements are appropriate to make a listener acceptable to the objectivists?

Do you need to be a certain height, weight, IQ level? This is largely ignored by many who think measurements are all. A massive gap in the approach.
 
sunbeamgls said:
I wonder which measurements are appropriate to make a listener acceptable to the objectivists?

Do you need to be a certain height, weight, IQ level? This is largely ignored by many who think measurements are all. A massive gap in the approach.
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Measurements only reveal how accurately a piece of equipment reproduces the recorded signal, which in the case of classical music is as close as you'll ever get to the original event and in the case of studio mixes (rock, pop, jazz, etc.) it is the music.
If one learns how to interpret measurements they can be useful for shortlisting equipment worth auditioning, whether or not we prefer accurate or a particular "presentation", making upgrades easier and more intentional / less accidental.
But measurements are just a tool and auditioning is important to determine preference, particularly if your taste is predominantly for equipment which adds "euphony".

Harman, through the research efforts of Toole & Olive, have been trying to work out a formula that is able to predict loudspeaker preference.
I don't see much worth in this for the consumer, only for the manufacturer which can use it to roughly draw a target speaker performance.
 
tuga said:
Measurements only reveal how accurately a piece of equipment reproduces the recorded signal, which in the case of classical music is as close as you'll ever get to the original event and in the case of studio mixes (rock, pop, jazz, etc.) it is the music.
If one learns how to interpret measurements they can be useful for shortlisting equipment worth auditioning, whether or not we prefer accurate or a particular "presentation", making upgrades easier and more intentional / less accidental.
But measurements are just a tool and auditioning is important to determine preference, particularly if your taste is predominantly for equipment which adds "euphony".

Harman, through the research efforts of Toole & Olive, have been trying to work out a formula that is able to predict loudspeaker preference.
I don't see much worth in this for the consumer, only for the manufacturer which can use it to roughly draw a target speaker performance.
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I was trying to go with the humour of linnfomaniac's post, but that seems to have been lost along the way...
 
As a humble initiator of the discussion, I now see a good opportunity to ask additional questions, to try to narrow it down.

In my case, should my pursue (to find appripriate speaker/amp solution) be driven only by my euphony, or should I read "graphs and numbers" to narrow possabilities, and than aply the "rule of euphony" to pick the one which sounds the best for me, among rivals which are "measured" as accurate enough ?

Or I should go other way round and select number of speakers which sound pleasent to me, and consequently take a look on the graphs? This way is probably better, but more complicated, as I need to listen a vast number of equipment, and that to compare. Its more easy to compare graphs and numbers as one could do it from home...
 
NL said:
As a humble initiator of the discussion, I now see a good opportunity to ask additional questions, to try to narrow it down.

In my case, should my pursue (to find appripriate speaker/amp solution) be driven only by my euphony, or should I read "graphs and numbers" to narrow possabilities, and than aply the "rule of euphony" to pick the one which sounds the best for me, among rivals which are "measured" as accurate enough ?

Or I should go other way round and select number of speakers which sound pleasent to me, and consequently take a look on the graphs? This way is probably better, but more complicated, as I need to listen a vast number of equipment, and that to compare. Its more easy to compare graphs and numbers as one could do it from home...
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I use measurements to narrow down equipment worth listening to.
For this you need to be able to correlate listening with measurements with a certain degree of accuracy.
I would start by learning how to correlate listening with measurements, learn the sonic "footprint" of equipment you enjoy, it's likely there'll be a pattern.
 
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Or just buy something neutral and with low distortion and then use an equaliser to change the tonality to suit your room and/or taste.
 
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flowjm said:
Or just buy something neutral and with low distortion and then use an equaliser to change the tonality to suit your room and/or taste.
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quite right... that's why I set my eyes on the ATCs primarily...they should be neutral, and Linns' space optimisation will adapt them to my room
 
NL said:
Very good suggestion! One could easily forget this basic principle and regret later...
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Yes, I understand the notion of buying something that measures well technically, but the most important thing to do when spend a large sum of money, is to try them in your listening space. If they measure well but don’t move you, it seems a crazy idea to buy anyway and then EQ them until they’re satisfactory. I’d rather have something that measures worse on paper but makes the hairs stand up on my neck!
 
Purité Audio said:
There are two parts to each Stereophile review, the subjective baloney and the measurements.
You can choose to believe the flim-flam, personally I believe the measurements.
Keith
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"It's especially disheartening when narrow-minded online critics use one aspect of our coverage—our measurements—to attack the other side: our subjective judgments. We're providing a complete picture; the two halves make a whole. You don't get that from our competition.

Broaden your mind. Seek perspective. Look at the big picture.—Jim Austin"

https://www.stereophile.com/content/hoisted-your-own-petard
 
sunbeamgls said:
"It's especially disheartening when narrow-minded online critics use one aspect of our coverage—our measurements—to attack the other side: our subjective judgments. We're providing a complete picture; the two halves make a whole. You don't get that from our competition.

Broaden your mind. Seek perspective. Look at the big picture.—Jim Austin"

https://www.stereophile.com/content/hoisted-your-own-petard
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No subjective baloney ,no advertising revenue.
Keith
 
Maybe some of the reviewers and "experts" should try designing and making their own designs, then let us pull apart their efforts, if it's so easy to do right.
 
Measurements are worth referring to but I’ve listened to plenty of stuff that measured well but didn’t really get my interest. If you like it then have it. It’s for your own listening pleasure in the end.
 
Just read this thread. I demo'ed an Akurate into D&D 8c speakers. The combo was lovely, but just out of financial reach for me at that time. I settled on the speakers with a MiniDSP SHD instead.

The 8c is no slouch - my living room is 5m x 4.5m and they go to deafening levels. I would have also tried ATC actives, but they were ruled out by Mrs C on appearance.

Having ran passive systems for over 30 years, I'll not move from active again unless its a funds issue. Actives are just too convenient. ;)
 
Hi NL,

My advice would be to go listen to both the rather advanced D&D or Kii actives that Purite Audio advocates and something rather more traditional such as the ATC SCM50A. The former are a technical tour-de-force that appear to deal with technical issues that dog domestic audio head-on in a small, domestically acceptable package. In my opinion, they appear to be a formidable product and one that it would be foolhardy to ignore.

The ATCs are rather more traditional in their design but, I think, beautifully and thoughtfully engineered. In the correct circumstance, they can and will sound excellent, and with grills on and a suitable veneer make rather a nice piece of furniture. Slightly cheaper alternatives could be the Genelecs or Neumann, but these are rather more form-follows-function and a bit 'bauhaus' for my tastes.

Personally, I'm a little wary of using DSP as an addition to a speaker, e.g the combination of Linn and ATC that you sight, as this provides rather a narrow view of what the DSP could achieve (in this case limited to some amplitude correction).

But in the end, you are comparing one piece of consumer electronics with another, so the stakes are low buy what you enjoy.

All the best.
 
Martin M said:
Hi NL,

My advice would be to go listen to both the rather advanced D&D or Kii actives that Purite Audio advocates and something rather more traditional such as the ATC SCM50A. The former are a technical tour-de-force that appear to deal with technical issues that dog domestic audio head-on in a small, domestically acceptable package. In my opinion, they appear to be a formidable product and one that it would be foolhardy to ignore.

The ATCs are rather more traditional in their design but, I think, beautifully and thoughtfully engineered. In the correct circumstance, they can and will sound excellent, and with grills on and a suitable veneer make rather a nice piece of furniture. Slightly cheaper alternatives could be the Genelecs or Neumann, but these are rather more form-follows-function and a bit 'bauhaus' for my tastes.

Personally, I'm a little wary of using DSP as an addition to a speaker, e.g the combination of Linn and ATC that you sight, as this provides rather a narrow view of what the DSP could achieve (in this case limited to some amplitude correction).

But in the end, you are comparing one piece of consumer electronics with another, so the stakes are low buy what you enjoy.

All the best.
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Linn Exaktbox or integrated Exakt active speakers are similar in concept to the Kiis with a sophisticated understanding of the room. They're focussed on playing music.
Not saying they're better, but they certainly suffer from Linn's stealth marketing.
 
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