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Schitt+ Passive Preamp Volume Question

MusicBee

New Member
Hello Forum Members,

Here calling out to Phil (Hifinutt) and others who are experienced with the Passive preamps.

I recently got the Schiit Saga + (Old version with a plastic remote Not the current one the metallic remote) and blown away by its performance, thanks to Phil (Hifinutt) who advised me.

I have connected this to my Bel-Canto S300 Stereo Power Amp, which is rated 300 RMS into 4 Ohms and my Totem Model 1 Signatures Speakers are Rated 120 Max RMS into 4 Ohms.

now playing this Saga+ with the Volume Pot set to 12 to 1 ‘O’ Clock position, in which the sound is at my desired level, however, I'd like to increase more :D

so my question is as follows :

Will it damage my speakers at this volume listening level? The problem is, it’s not playing audible enough if I go below this position on the volume pot. Even in Tube mode, (as it should be for a Passive Pre)

if I raise the volume more then 12 'o'Clock position on Saga + is it safe to my speakers,

their user manual of Saga+ says this below statement which bothers me.

3 Volume Knob. Turn it to the right to make the music louder. Stop before smoke comes out of your speakers.

Awaiting any response to clarify this by the experts out there.

Regards
MusicBee
 
Fantastic to hear it's working well , their stuff is pretty good vfm . In passive mode I find both the saga and freya run at a normal level at around 2 o'clock or more. It's no problem. In the active stage it's about 1 o'clock because the active stage has more gain. Just yesterday popped the freya in with ice power monoblocks and it's running about 3 o clock and I listen fairly soft . I am sure there are other users of their kit who will comment
 
Thank you Phil, for your reply, that's great to hear, just one quick clarification though,

when do you say active stage? is it when the Tube-Buffer-mode is engaged? (with the light lit-up on the Pre)
and also I'd like your tube rolling option on this Pre. I reckon you have played with a few different tube's?

thank you in advance for your reply.

Best Regards
MusicBee.
 
If you have a 300W amp past 1 o'clock you should fear for your ears, not your speakers.

If you measure the voltage you are generating using a normal voltmeter you will have some idea of the power being delivered. 4R speakers will need a nominal 30V RMS at the speaker terminals for 120Wpc. I would be amazed if you are getting anywhere near this. Are you using it as a PA in a pub?

If you are and you want to protect your speakers, then fit fuses. Power = Isquared R, so I sq = 30, giving nominal current of about 5.5A. If you fit a 1 or 2 A fuse on one side of each speaker cable, you'll blow this before you destroy the speakers. Fuses on speaker feeds are generally held to reduce sound quality, but you'll be so deaf if you are delivering 120Wpc then you won't hear it.
 
I usually use an app on my phone to get a rough guesstimate of the volume. My normal volume is around 70-75dB which is well within safety limits for listening the whole day if you want. Not a loud listener though, there are some guidelines with a set amount of time per volume. But that being said it's a guideline, if your ears are getting tired you should take a break obviously.
 
Thank you Phil, for your reply, that's great to hear, just one quick clarification though,

when do you say active stage? is it when the Tube-Buffer-mode is engaged? (with the light lit-up on the Pre)
and also I'd like your tube rolling option on this Pre. I reckon you have played with a few different tube's?

thank you in advance for your reply.

Best Regards
MusicBee.
yes the active is when tube mode engaged. And mine had a brimar tube fitted by Jerry (art of sound forum) it sounded just great but never compared with any else
 
I can't stand loud noise too much but have used both saga and freya with a number of power amps . Some up to 200 watts class ab, in passive mode you do have to turn it up to about 2_3 o clock on the volume knob. That's using a CD player into a dac

The freya was running yesterday with 2 x100 watt ice power monoblocks at moderate volume in passive mode at about 2.30 o,clock
 
there's a recent Darko podcast with Vinni Rossi as a guest and they spend most of the time talking about gain vs. power, which seems relevant here.
 
I'm assuming passive mode on the Saga is unity gain, i.e. Vin=Vout. So a 2Vrms input will be a 2Vrms output from the Saga with the volume pot turned to max when in passive mode. Assuming the volume pot follows a typical log scale, I'd expect 12 o'clock to be around 1/10th of the input voltage. How high you need to set the passive preamp's volume pot will ultimately depend on the input sensitivity of your power amp. E.g. A power amp with an input sensitivity of 1Vrms for max power output would need the passive preamp's volume pot set +6dB higher than a power amp with an input sensitivity of 0.5Vrms.
 
You absolutely cannot judge power from vol control position! This is one of the most basic mistakes which is repeated again and again...
You also cannot say that a particular vol control setting is the max safe volume as the programme material varies so much both in recorded level and frequency spectral density.
Trying to max out volume like this will often result in blown tweeters... or even blown woofers with enough power and the right music!
 
Thank you all for your responses,
I have also written to Schiit Support Team asking the same question to them, right after posting here (while waiting for responses from PFM'rs) and here is what their response to my question.
--------------------------------
This is normal because the volume pot is a passive design, so it will not damage your speakers, in fact, you can expect to be higher on the volume pot than with many other designs.
----------------------
which was not clear to me, but now I understand better after reading the responses here on PFM.

thanks again.
 
My zero gain Diy DCB1 buffer pre also travels to 1 and 2 o'clock for loud listening with my EAR 516. There is no problem with this at all.
 


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