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Would you vote for the Soubry/Umunna party?

I wonder how strong that support is today now that many youngsters are starting to learn first hand what their grumpy older peers knew from past experiences with the hard left. Even though the current policies are not those of the hard left those in control are of the hard left. It is to do with trust rather than currently stated policies and, with the odd exception, the hard left is not behaving in a manner that seeks to build trust now they have successfully grabbed most of the controls. This is reflected in the polls where large numbers of people that ought to be labour supporters (like me) simply will not support a party run by untrustworthy people even though they agree with a large proportion of the currently stated policies.
But your mindset of 'untrustworthy people' is generated, manufactured, reinforced day after day by a hostile media.
 
Imagine if Corbyn had been given 1 Million quid by Putin to take Labour MPs to Russia, he pointed out, it would be put on a loop by Sky.

We know Galloway has taken very substantial amounts of money from both Russia and Iran, so he is, as ever, a zero credibility zone. A paid shill for dictators.
 
Well, Heidi Allen's speech just now suggests she's going to be a much more polished performer than Angela Smith. A rival to Chuka for the leadership gig?

Today feels a lot more significant than Monday.

Soubry says “hard line ERG are now running the Conservative party from top to tail”.

"Nicola Sturgeon‏Verified account @NicolaSturgeon
Unusually heard a bit of #PMQs. Striking how symbiotic the May/Corbyn relationship seems - collusion of silence on their imploding parties, neither showing any leadership on Brexit and each one relying on the other’s incompetence to obscure their own.
12:30 PM - 20 Feb 2019"
 
Well, Heidi Allen's speech just now suggests she's going to be a much more polished performer than Angela Smith. A rival to Chuka for the leadership gig?

Today feels a lot more significant than Monday.

Soubry says “hard line ERG are now running the Conservative party from top to tail”.

"Nicola Sturgeon‏Verified account @NicolaSturgeon
Unusually heard a bit of #PMQs. Striking how symbiotic the May/Corbyn relationship seems - collusion of silence on their imploding parties, neither showing any leadership on Brexit and each one relying on the other’s incompetence to obscure their own.
12:30 PM - 20 Feb 2019"

Heidi Allen is my MP - can't sleep for the thought of yet another (by) election....
 
This seems mean-spirited and also misplaced. It's an odd thing to survey the mess created by self-described centrists gleefully s____ing the bed and think, God, the British left are such bell ends.

But I am part of the British left and have have been all my life. A number of my best friends and a shed load of my acquaintances are literally in the Labour party. One's a councillor in East London. One works in McDonnell's office. One's been my local Labour party and known Corbyn for 30 years.

We disagree on lots of things but we do agree that a part of the movement and party is deaf to all criticism, rejects any blame as a Blarist or media plot and avoids any form of introspection. Lots of these lifelong Labour supporters share my frustration with Corbyn and his response to Brexit.

None of this is gleeful. It's much more about frustration and anger and worry.
 

As important as it is to acknowledge the history of war, that isn't a list of conflicts featuring world ending murder, i.e. nuclear war. For obvious reasons.

The past couple of years has seen the return of a particularly unpleasant spectre IMO, in the form of claiming that anyone not willing to say they'd push the big red button without a moment's hesitation is unfit for office. Bob alluded specifically to that.
 
We disagree on lots of things but we do agree that a part of the movement and party is deaf to all criticism, rejects any blame as a Blarist or media plot and avoids any form of introspection. Lots of these lifelong Labour supporters share my frustration with Corbyn and his response to Brexit.

None of this is gleeful. It's much more about frustration and anger and worry.

These are the key reasons why I am turning away from Labour. This has been compounded by many of the hardline responses I have read and heard on here and elsewhere, the tone of which I find deeply suspect.
 
Why would they give them yet more publicity? In fact the SNP, stripped of the nationalism, is probably very close to them politically, Sturgeon should be careful.
Sturgeon should carry on being perceptive and telling it like it is.
 
But your mindset of 'untrustworthy people' is generated, manufactured, reinforced day after day by a hostile media.
Rubbish. It is from having two members of the family that were active hard left supporters over many decades. Exposing a reasonably rational person to the talk and beliefs of the hard left will ensure they will strongly oppose the hard left being put in control of anything. The problem is that many new labour supporters do not know what the hard left is and why mainstream labour supporters are so opposed to them. They are slowly starting to learn now.
 
Anna Soubry: I think the coalition government did a marvelous job.

As nice a reductio of the Independent Group as I've heard yet.

Apart from that gem, a fun press conference with some visceral criticism of the PM and her part in turning the Conservative Party into a bunch of extreme right-wing racist cranks.
 
Rubbish. It is from having two members of the family that were active hard left supporters over many decades. Exposing a reasonably rational person to the talk and beliefs of the hard left will ensure they will strongly oppose the hard left being put in control of anything. The problem is that many new labour supporters do not know what the hard left is and why mainstream labour supporters are so opposed to them. They are slowly starting to learn now.
My brother was a fully paid up member of the SWP, I'm well aware of the nutty fringe, the extremists, and was concerned about their behaviour at my own local party meetings. This doesn't translate to your paranoid take on the current situation rather just reflects the crap put out by the Murdoch press and the Express/Mail.. demonising the Party.
 
This is what extreme, blatant, anti-semitism looks like for sure. What Corbyn has not done is to nip in the bud anti-semitic undercurrents in his party.

I differentiate because of the boy who cried wolf. We should all be aware that there are likey real anti-semites lurking among the Tory right wing.
 
Heidi Allen is my MP - can't sleep for the thought of yet another (by) election....

I wouldn`t lose to much sleep - the last MP that I can remember fighting a by-election on defection was Bruce Douglas-Mann in 1982 - he lost. (Mitcham and Morden, my constituency), he went to the SDP - remember them?

There may have been others but most of this current batch would be hard put to keep their seat at a General Election, let alone a by-election.
 


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